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2x10 problem help!

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by ballison, Apr 20, 2006.


  1. I use a 2x10 (SWR goliath jr) + a 4x10 (fender bassman) and the 210 just aint cutting it with the b string. another problem, I live in boston with no car...so Im looking to just bring down the rig. I need a small cab 2x10 or maybe 2 2x10's? that will be great lightweight and take that low b like a champ. I was looking at a bergantino 2x10 and that was looking pretty appealing to me (thanks to emjazz for the suggestion) but Im looking for other input!

    thanks!
     
  2. Blues Cat

    Blues Cat Payson Fanned Bass Strings Owner Supporting Member Commercial User

    May 28, 2005
    Katy, Tx
    Payson Fanned Bass Strings Owner
  3. Plain Old Me

    Plain Old Me

    Dec 14, 2004
    I own a Bergantino 210, and it handles the B like a champ. If you have a very powerful head, you may want to look into an Acme cab. They are designed to go very low, but need a lot of watts.
     
  4. dave_bass5

    dave_bass5

    May 28, 2004
    London, UK.
    I havent heard this term used for a while here so ill recomend a Schroeder 1210 or one of the slightly bigger cabs but it depends on if you like the sound i guess.
     
  5. KJung

    KJung Supporting Member

    I've found the G jr. to be one of the weakest stand-alone 210's, especially if you play a 5 string. So, IMO, you will be pleasantly surprised by almost any other high quality 210.

    The ones I'm most impressed with are:

    Epifani210UL.... pro's.... very, very lightweight, very wide open sound, great treble response. cons.... kind of big... it's a full 18" deep, which makes it a little bit of a hassle to get in and out of a car. If you have a van or SUV, no problem

    BergHT210S.... pro's... that unique Berg sound... warm and woody, really small... only 11" deep. cons.... 55 pounds, but the small size makes it feel lighter

    Schroeder1210L.... pro's.... incredibly loud and punchy for its size, lighweight. cons... very unique signature voicing.. very 'mid punchy' which can be a positive or negative depending on your tone preference.

    EANL210.... pro's... light, loud, and warm...great cab covering (sprayed on) my favorite EA cab. cons.... actually... nothing really sticks out...

    AcmeB210... pro's.... massive low end for a cab that small, great build quality, relatively light. cons... very inefficient... takes lots of power.. which is the price you pay for all that low end coming out of something so small, also, to my ear, not enough mid punch and treble response versus the extended low end.... but pure personal taste.

    Eden210XLT/XST pro's... classic Eden sound... priced right. cons... large and weigh as much as some 410's... signature Eden mid growl is not for everyone.


    If you go for a modern, roundwound sort of sound, and slap on occasion... the Epi is wonderful IMO.

    If you go for a more 'woody, middy, organic' sort of sound, that BergHT210S is great IMO.
     
  6. hasbeen

    hasbeen Commercial User

    Sep 23, 2004
    Vice President, KMC Music. Warwick U.S. distribution, Ampeg distribution
    also, have you considered 12"s?
     
  7. Philbiker

    Philbiker Pat's the best!

    Dec 28, 2000
    Northern Virginia, USA
    My old Eden D210T does very nice work with my B string. It's no longer made, but can be found used. However, it is anything but light. I can't imagine hefting the even heavier XLT around.
    That may be true, but it sure sounds great for me!
     
  8. 12bass

    12bass

    Jan 2, 2003
    Victoria, Canada
    For Eden cabinets that handle the low B, I would have to recommend the D210XST, as it reproduces the lows better than the XLT series.
     
  9. would my power amp be able to handel two different loads on two seperate channels? maybe if I put the 2x10 on one and turned it way down and used the 4x10 for most? but Im guessing that wont work for the power amp?
     
  10. 12bass

    12bass

    Jan 2, 2003
    Victoria, Canada
    A modern solid-state power amp should be fine with a different load on each channel, or just using one channel.
     
  11. JOME77

    JOME77

    Aug 18, 2002
    Georgia
    I recently purchased a Berg HT-112 (38 lbs) for pretty much the same reason your stating (portability and Goliath Jr. breaking up). I couldn't be happier! I'm not sure if you're using your F1-X and QSC amp but the Bergs really open up with extra headroom so it should sound great. I've been playing an Eden WT-550 through mine and everyone that's heard it is just amazed at the tone and amount of clean volume. From what I hear, if your really want to do it right, you may also want to add a Berg EX-112 cabinet with the HT-112. You could sell both your SWR JR III and Fender 410 and cover a large part of the of the funds needed. I can promise that you'll never look back!:smug:
     
  12. LeonD

    LeonD Supporting Member

    How would you say the tone of the Berg 112 compares to the Goliath Jr.? I have a Goliath II Jr. that I really like the tone of. I'm looking for something lighter and louder.

    Is the Berg a similar tone in a lighter / louder package? Or is there something else I should consider?

    FWIW, I'll be powering it with an SWR Basic 350 head.

    Thanks,
    LeonD
     
  13. KJung

    KJung Supporting Member

    I'm sure Joe will chime in. Here's my take, comparing the GjrIII that I'm more familiar with (and from memory sounds reasonably close to the GII), and the Berg (I own the HT210S and have played through the 112 Joe is recommending.

    I believe the Berg 112 weighs about 40 pounds.. the HT210S weighs about 55 pounds. So, not a lot of weight savings... but, the HT210s and the HT112S are only 11" deep... so very easy to schlep and they feel lighter than their published weight.

    However... the SWR cabs have a somewhat scooped tone with a lot of 'hi fi' sizzle IMO... that's just the opposite of the Berg tone... which is mid punchy with a very natural tweeter.... the Berg tweeter sounds like the cab just extending toward the treble register, vs. the 'sizzle of an SWR tweeter. Very nice if you are looking for a more 'natural' organic sound.

    If you like that 'bright' SWR sound, but with more low end wump versus your Jr., either the Epi210UL or the EANL210 would both be great replacements. Again, depending on the tone you are looking for.

    Edit: The Epi112UL is an amazing cab also... very, very lightweight and loud and crisp. Two of them with 500+ watts will cover any gig you could think of IMO.... yet another option!
     
  14. JOME77

    JOME77

    Aug 18, 2002
    Georgia
    Leon,
    IMO the Berg sounds so much better than the SWR Jr. III. Your Goliath Jr series II is tighter sounding than the series III cabinets but still doesn't compare to the midrange growl and punchy sound of the Berg. I played the Eden and Berg at a low-medium size gig last week and I was amazed at the sound. I had the Eden on about 12 o'clock (master) and the Berg was still just pumping out clean punchy sound. I actually had to back off the volume some after the soundman started giving me dirty looks. The cabinet just never gave a hint of breaking up! I've had several Goliath Jr's and all of them started breaking up at borderline gig volume levels. I do believe that the tight porting of the Berg probably cuts a little lows from the sound but the slight midrange growl of the cabinet more than makes up for it.

    Your SWR Basic 350 might be a slight factor though with a single 8 ohm cabinet. The Berg definitely loves power and opens up better when pushed. The 350 would probably sound better paired with the Berg HT-112 & a EX-112 @ 4 ohms. That would optimize your heads available power. Maybe someone can chime in that has used a Berg HT-112 with a SWR Basic 350. I still think it would sound great though.
     
  15. LeonD

    LeonD Supporting Member

    Thanks for the replies guys.

    Lately I've been using the Jr. with the tweeter way down so that's why I was thinking the Berg with its "natural" sound as opposed to the Epifani. I also think after playing the cab exclusively for the last 12 years, it's warmed up quite a bit so I'm not sure how typical "SWR Sound" it is.

    At some point I'll probably upgrade my amp but for now, I do have a Peavey CS800 power amp I could use (along with the pre of the SWR 350). I think that'd do very well for a bit.

    Other cabs I'm considering are the EA Wizzy, Aguilar 112 and Avatar 112. What makes this tough is not having all the cabs side by side. If they were all in the same room, I could probably decide in about 30 minutes.

    Thanks again,
    LeonD
     
  16. tombowlus

    tombowlus If it sounds good, it is good Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 3, 2003
    Fremont, Ohio
    Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
    Ken pretty much nailed it, above. I also did a 2x10 shootout, which you may find helpful. Since then, I have picked up a Glockenklang Due (non-wedge, but it sounds substantially similar, yet slightly bigger lows - nice!), Sadowsky SA210 (great extended clarity through mids/highs, but not as much natural low end as the Berg HT210S), Schroeder 1010 (a bit too wooly through the mids, and not a lot of true low end, but loud through its mid hump), a Markbass Traveler 102P (super impressive for its size/weight, great low end, very clear, but the tweeter seems a bit 'sharp'), and a Music Man HD-210 (great sounding cab, but I wish it had a tweeter attenuator, and it's rather heavy).

    I still stand by my three faves, the Berg HT210, Glock Duo, and EA NL-210, though the Markbass 102P is outstanding in its weight class.

    Of the 1x12 options, I'd be sure to check out the Wizzy, HT112, UL-112, and Glockenklang Space Deluxe. All four are great, in their own way.

    Hope this helps, Tom.
     
  17. LeonD

    LeonD Supporting Member

    This has been very helpful. Based on people's descriptions (and they seem to be very consistant), I think I have it narrowed down to the Bergantino HT112 or EA Wizzy.

    Compared to the other 1x12, these seem the most similar. Is that an accurate?

    And seeing that they are both about the same size with the Wizzy having a greater sensitivity, ten pounds lighter and almost $100 cheaper, I'm leaning towards the Wizzy.

    Plus, with it being a four ohm cabinet, I should be able to run it along with my SWR Goliath II Jr. I'm thinking that this could be a good pairing. The Wizzy would provide the warmth and mids while the Goliath could brighten things up if needed.

    What do you think?

    Once again, thanks for all the help (if I didn't hang out on these forums, I'd be rich but playing a Squire P bass through a Peavey TNT :) )

    LeonD
     
  18. KJung

    KJung Supporting Member

    Sounds like a good plan! Let us know what you think when you've have a few gigs on the updated rig.
     
  19. tombowlus

    tombowlus If it sounds good, it is good Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 3, 2003
    Fremont, Ohio
    Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
    Those are both great cabs, and two of my favorites, for sure. You may be able to gain additional insight from these threads:

    EA iAMP 500 Wizzy vs Bergantion IP112

    Mini Cab Combo Shootout

    Tom.
     
  20. LeonD

    LeonD Supporting Member

    Actually, I started my quest after reading your Mini Cab shootout. Untill that point, I was happy with what I had. :eyebrow:

    Actually, I'm still very happpy with what I have. It's just my gigging has changed and I need more of what I have (soundwise) and less of what I have (weight wise). :D

    That's why I think an efficient, light weight 12 will work as a baseline. And if I need more, I'll add my Goliath II Jr.

    I'll be using an SWR Basic 350 which puts out 350 watts in 4 ohms and 420 watts in 2 ohms.

    Thanks again,
    LeonD


     

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