410 and 115 together

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by jarrhead, Aug 9, 2009.


  1. jarrhead

    jarrhead

    May 23, 2009
    Search was impossible to say. :bag:

    Anyways, I always hear that a 410 and 115 is a mis-match, even though a lot of people do it.

    Pros & Cons, anybody? :D
     
  2. stflbn

    stflbn

    May 10, 2007
    Nashville
    410 will overpower the 1x15. In both power, clarity and low end.
     
  3. UncleBalsamic

    UncleBalsamic

    Jul 8, 2007
    UK
    It depends very much on the individual cabs, but generally I would say no.
     
  4. billfitzmaurice

    billfitzmaurice Commercial User

    Sep 15, 2004
    New Hampshire
    Owner, Bill Fitzmaurice Loudspeaker Design
    1x15s are typically added to a 4x10 to get more bottom end. Since most 4x10s have more bottom than most 1x15s it doesn't work as well as adding a second 4x10. And mixing different driver sizes introduces phase and response issues that don't occur with identical cabs.

    You'll also hear from the 'I've got a so-and-so 1x15 and so-and-so 4x10 and they sound great together' crowd. What that crowd generally doesn't realize is that any two cabs together will usually sound better than either one alone. Then ask how many of them actually tried two 4x10s and two 1x15s and then one of each together side by side before deciding on which to go with. ;)
     
  5. RickenBoogie

    RickenBoogie

    Jul 22, 2007
    Dallas, TX
    Even cab manufacturers pair them up in ads. It's something I just don't understand. And yeah, lots of players use them together. I guess so long as you never come close to pushing the 15, it works. But, why would anyone want to limit themselves like that?
     
  6. This was one of those things people used to do all the time, from pros to basement heros, and they thought it sounded great. Until Talkbass. Now it has been proven by unassailable forum logic that what these people thought sounded good actually sounded terrible, because some guy they've never actually seen wrote somewhere on the internet that it was teh suxxor.

    Anyway, it's also bad because nobody uses two cabinets that size any more; you want a 4 lb 1X10 and a 2 oz amp. Though the really cool kids don't even use amps.
     
  7. Ric5

    Ric5 Supporting Member

    Jan 29, 2008
    Colorado
    I disclose nothing
    I find that with 15s I prefer 2 x 15s and 10s and 18s go nicely together.

    I like 4 10s or 2 10s and 1 18.
     
  8. UncleBalsamic

    UncleBalsamic

    Jul 8, 2007
    UK
    +1
     
  9. I have tried adding another 4x10 to a existing single 4x10 and it sounded great but all it did was increase the same exact tone that I allready had so I still Ended up adding a 15 or 2x15 to the mix and then I achived the bottom end that I was looking for.
    Most of the 4x10 cabinets that I have had do sound to be tuned lower than the 15 cabinets that I have but they dont put that out as well as a 15.
    I also have paired some cabinets together that have sounded terrible because of phasing issues.
    Ideally if you are using different size speakers they should be crossed over so as to not play the same frequencies as the other different sized speaker, but bottom Line it may not be the right thing to do on paper but using different size cabs can give you a wider range of sound and that is why ALOT of people do it.
    Ten inch speakers tend to be better for HEARING highs and mids,15s will let HEAR more lows and start to get that deeper bottom end that you hear and 18s will really get that sub feel going.You dont see DJ's using just 10 inch cabinets to fill a room full of bass.
    I dont know of anyone that has just gone out and bought 1 rig and not changed anything out along the way,so with that being said have some fun and try some different combinations and let YOUR EARS be the judge in the mix and standalone.
    Steve

    +1
     
  10. Coelho

    Coelho

    May 10, 2006
    Astoria, NY
    Maybe some people like the sound produced as a result of the frequency cancellation and other aberrations.

    Otherwise we should as well just listen to everything on high-end audio equipment with a flat EQ. :)
     
  11. billfitzmaurice

    billfitzmaurice Commercial User

    Sep 15, 2004
    New Hampshire
    Owner, Bill Fitzmaurice Loudspeaker Design
    That's a good point, but if you sift through the threads you'll find many of the same proponents of driver mixing voodoo to arrive at a particular coloration are also the first to decry running with anything but flat response from the amp, which is also as useful as a screen door on a submarine, since amps aren't flat anyway. :rollno:
    IMO blanket statements about what the result will be from using any two cabs together are based on a combination of pure conjecture and succumbing to marketing hype. It also seems that those who express the most vehemence about 'that's how we've always done it and it's always worked fine' are the same ones who, when asked 'how does a speaker work', can at best reply: "You plug it in!" :confused:
     
  12. There is no question that the People like Bill Fitzmaurice are very knowledgeable and have designed excellent speaker cabs that im sure would out perform the majority of the mass produced cabs that are available but here I go with the "but" for those of us who do use the mass produced cabs we have been able to mix and match to achive is what we think "our" sound.
    Steve
     
  13. Eminor3rd

    Eminor3rd BLAAAAARRGGHH!!

    Feb 10, 2008
    NYC
    Don't like it. Not sure why, but I think it has to do with the fact that the 4x10 is so much louder than the 1x15 that the 15 seems drowned out. I used to use a 4x10+1x15 setup, and found I was better off selling both and buying a higher quality 4x10.
     
  14. Hi.

    My Laney 4*10 won't take 6er well, even with a tube amp which is a steep 40Hz hi-pass filter itself by design. But paired with a HK 15" bottom, no problems and it sounds deep and loud. Well as deep as a tube amp can anyway.

    The sound is colored, and filled with phase problems I'm sure, but so are the places I usually play in ;). And yes, I've heard bassists use my rig in the said places and it sounds like it should. BTW I did pro/semi-pro sound back in the day if that counts for something.

    Regards
    Sam
     
  15. wouldn't you need a x-over to send the signals to the right cab? highs - low mids to the 4x10 and lows to to the 1x15?
     
  16. To be sonically correct then yes you should run each speaker crossed with a high and low pass but then you would be loosing what each one has to offer in the range.Like T-Bird said it works well for him and many others,Im sure that if BFM built him a cab it would blow it away but T-Bird and many others have found different combinations that have worked for them.
    I run a single 18 sub for our PA system that is set up for a low pass only and it sounds great crossed down low but if I raise the frequency above 80hz on the adjustable crossover then it starts getting a nasty mid bass ring so each senerio can be different.
     
  17. UncleBalsamic

    UncleBalsamic

    Jul 8, 2007
    UK
    It depends on what the drivers are good at. A 115 doesn't necessarily handle lows well.
     
  18. billfitzmaurice

    billfitzmaurice Commercial User

    Sep 15, 2004
    New Hampshire
    Owner, Bill Fitzmaurice Loudspeaker Design
    Yes, if the cabs were specifically designed to operate that way, but commercial electric bass cabs aren't. Besides, you don't need a 4x10 to give the mids and highs to keep up with a 1x15. A 2x6 or 2x8 is adequate, and with the right driver a 1x6 or 1x8 will do. But that's not an option you'll find offered by the usual suspects.
     
  19. jarrhead

    jarrhead

    May 23, 2009
    Specifically, a Neo 410 & Neo 115 (GK)
     
  20. rptrsn2

    rptrsn2

    Feb 21, 2008
    Northeast Missouri
    Endorsing Artist: Aurora Strings
    Don't know exactly how many talkbass members there are but its prolly about the same as how many answers you will get to this question. i,ve tried both ways and like mixing drivers much more but thats my taste. I take it from your username your a fellow devil dog,semper fi!
     
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