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About my DB - info request plse

Discussion in 'Basses [DB]' started by Kim Sparrow, Sep 16, 2005.

  1. Kim Sparrow

    Kim Sparrow

    Sep 16, 2005
    Monmouth, UK
    Hi everyone
    First post here, so dont shout at me if I have posted into the wrong forum/thread please :)

    I acquired a DB this week, and not having played an upright before, dont know that much about my particular instrument. It was perhaps an on the spot impulse buy, but it looked the part, and the owner only wanted 550USD for it. I am told it is of German origin and dates from just pre WWII. Its made of ply, but is in excellent order, and is a gorgeous color. Can anyone confirm what I have been told about it, or add to that ? Would appreciate your expert views as cannot see any labels on the instrument

  2. eh_train

    eh_train Supporting Member

    Jan 12, 2004
    Hi Kim

    Congrats. on your buy...

    IF it's an old-ish German ply bass in good shape $550 is a fantastic bargain! I say IF, however, because it's hard to tell from a single pic.
    Some shots of the scroll/tuners and the button (where the neck and body are joined at the back) will help immensely. The bass looks to be in VERY good condition for a 60+ year old, so I wonder if it is quite that old. Also, I've seen many ply basses from the 1950s with blonde finishes, but not so many from the 1930s...

    Just some initial thoughts.


    Paul (eh_train)
  3. Kim Sparrow

    Kim Sparrow

    Sep 16, 2005
    Monmouth, UK
    Thanks for your response Paul

    I have added another 15 or so pictures at

    which may help you/anyone give me more of an idea of which particular bass I have

    There is actually a very small amount of damage to where the neck joins the body - it might be that just a professional reglue will solve/pretty that for me, but the joint/join is solid, and in no danger of coming apart.

    Another clue which may help - I didnt even realise the basses didnt have a spike. I did however find a spike attachment in the case which looks quite old, and may give a clue to the maker and age. Its in the last picture of the above address

  4. jtlownds


    Oct 3, 2004
    LaBelle, FL
    The body is very similar to my laminated Meisel (Model 8900), with the same double striped painted on purfling. They have been making these for a very long time. The scroll, however, has some differences, so it probably isn't, unless they changed their scroll design over the years. Hard to believe it is that old, looking at the finish. Really strange end-pin you have there too.
  5. KSB - Ken Smith

    KSB - Ken Smith Banned Commercial User

    Mar 1, 2002
    Perkasie, PA USA
    Owner: Ken Smith Basses, Ltd.
    3 Things I notice from your photos.

    1) I think this was refinished at some point. I hardly see any wear. With the Neck popped in the back and re-glued poorly, this shows it has been used. The finish wear is absent.
    2) The neck/block/back joint needs to be redone. The Neck removed, all cleaned out. Block repaired so the neck fits well and re-glued for a tight fit. It is posible that the Block has to be replaced but only a slight chance.
    3) the ribs finish flush with the top and back. German made Basses show a small lip/overhang usually. This is an eastern eurpoean trait from Bohemia and Austria. That being said i believe this is a Czech made Bass.
  6. Kim, is the purfling (the black,supposed to be inlayed that follows the pattern of the edges of the bass on the front and back....as j says painted or even decaled..in case you didn't know) inlayed? painted or decaled?
    I can see that the scroll is carved, which is good news because Kays and Englehardt have pop-off scrolls that do exactly that..pop off. Rose wood finger board.
    As everybody says, or will say, it's either German or Czech. Possibly a Framus (German) The end pin is typical of basses that were made before we went to adjustable.
    That's a bit odd....because laminated/and un-adjustable end-pin?????????
    Great deal either way!! Good luck.......my guess is a Framus.
  7. Kim Sparrow

    Kim Sparrow

    Sep 16, 2005
    Monmouth, UK
    Thanks for the replies

    As regards the purfling, its actually quite difficult to tell. It doesnt appear to be inlaid, so making an educated guess, I would say that it is painted (where some of the "glazing" has worn or had a knock, so have the double black lines worn away)

    Have just added two pictures of the 'stump' - it appears original and made of wood, and as you can see, the spike fits it perfectly. Have added one of the case it came with as well - no idea whether this may provide a clue or not
  8. Kim Sparrow

    Kim Sparrow

    Sep 16, 2005
    Monmouth, UK
    For Ken

    Re your point number 2 - can you give me an idea of the cost of having this done ?
  9. Kim Sparrow

    Kim Sparrow

    Sep 16, 2005
    Monmouth, UK
    Am guessing you guys noticed it, but just noticed myself that there is no purfling around the 'f' holes
  10. KSB - Ken Smith

    KSB - Ken Smith Banned Commercial User

    Mar 1, 2002
    Perkasie, PA USA
    Owner: Ken Smith Basses, Ltd.
    Kim, I don't know where you are located so fill out your profile when you get the chance.
    Cost depends on who you take it to. It can run 200-500 or so depending on what the find. A new Block with the top removed will run higher.

    F holes are not usually purfled on real carved Basses. This is usually a decoration on plywoods for pop music stuff.
  11. Kim Sparrow

    Kim Sparrow

    Sep 16, 2005
    Monmouth, UK
    Thanks for the info Ken

    I just had an email reply from a nice chap called Volker of the Nahrmann Bass Shop in Billerica MA


    His email said "it looks like a bass out of the Musima factory in Markneukirchen in East Germany. I think that it has been refinished as I have never seen them in blond. Usually they are bright orange varnish.... They were sold in this country under the Eberle label. I can't say anything about the age ... They have been making this model for decades from the 50s on. The company went out of business two years ago"
  12. Freddels

    Freddels Musical Anarchist

    Apr 7, 2005
    Sutton, MA
    Hey, if Volker responded to you that means that he's reading this forum. If that's the case I think it's time for Volker to come out and join the ranks of our other luthiers.
  13. Good idea....we have an opening now that Branstetter has split!!
  14. nicklloyd

    nicklloyd Supporting Member/Luthier

    Jan 27, 2002
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    kim- Is the neck joint tight? Meaning, if you gently hold the bass neck and move it back and forth (while the body is held snugly against a wall or between your knees) does the neck "move around" where it meets the body? The neck repair doesn't look great, but if it is strong and holding, don't mess with it. If the neck is loose, then spend the $$ and get it repaired now.

    These basses were sold under a couple of different names, Knilling is another one. It's too bad they went out of business...

    As far as lurking luthiers go, there are plenty others that are around, but don't post ;) Too cool for school, I guesss. :cool:
  15. Kim Sparrow

    Kim Sparrow

    Sep 16, 2005
    Monmouth, UK
    Hello Nick,
    Yes the neck is nice and tight, there is no movement at all in it. It maybe just that the 'glue' has just come away from the edges making it look a little unsightly and worse than it actually is. I think I will take your advice with the old addage that "if isn't broke, don't fix it"

    In defence of Volker, he didnt actually reply to me via my post on this forum. What I did was send out a few mails to bass shop websites asking about my bass, and he kindly responded, so it may be that he doesnt read this site at all

  16. anonymous8547j7d7b

    anonymous8547j7d7b Guest

    Jul 1, 2005
    Just thought I'd let all you guys know that this very bass is for sale on the UK ebay courtesy of "Simon Moore" of Monmouth, England. It is claimed to be a stunning professional instrument estimated to be worth in excess of £1500 (approx $2,600) & some poor sod has already bid over £1000 for it! I have contacted the seller & raised concerns over his valuation & description & he assured me of his honesty blahx3, stating he would email me a reply. However, this is dependent on the hotel where he will be holidaying (conveniently until after the auction ends) having email facilities. I'm just about to contact ebay & the potential buyer & lucking across this on Talkbass should help.
  17. Kim Sparrow

    Kim Sparrow

    Sep 16, 2005
    Monmouth, UK
    You offer me no option other than seek legal advice now that you have commited an act of public libel. You were responded to last evening in very full detail about this instrument as was promised and not after the auction closes as you state. You have refused to believe my words and my good intent, and you are clearly a very bitter person - but then coming from someone who left another perfectly respectable seller negative feedback because you were overcharged one pound for postage says it all !!

    For all other forum users
    I am Simon Moore of Monmouth, and when I registered on this site to seek your very welcome advice and expertise, it was under the username Kim Sparrow. It breaks no rules of Talkbass to use a pseudonym to protect ones identity
    I am the legal owner of this bass, and have full documentation for it. It was bought at a professional sale room and catalogued and receipted as a German double bass circa 1940. You are welcomed to view my advert on eBay under the username online168, where you will see it is clearly described as not labeled and is sold as such (i.e. an unnamed double bass) and is described with opinion only, not statements of fact. My estimate is simply that - an estimate, and as explained to the 'other' user' the value of any item whatever it is, is only a matter of personal value. If I didnt own the instrument, I would hardly offer potential bidders the opportunity to come and view and try before buying would I !

    This 'other' forum user has caused me and my family a great deal of personal worry and distress and I am not prepared to let anyone do that to my family
  18. KSB - Ken Smith

    KSB - Ken Smith Banned Commercial User

    Mar 1, 2002
    Perkasie, PA USA
    Owner: Ken Smith Basses, Ltd.
    Kim Sparrow or Simon Moore.. Male or female? Be WHO you are. We give FREE advice here at our time and expecse. FILL OUT YOUR PROFILE and be who you are. Don't hide behind a Girl. Be a man and fill out your profile. Be respectful to those that have tried to help you. I will avoid your name(s) in the future for ignoring this request previously made. :scowl:
  19. drurb

    drurb Oracle, Ancient Order of Rass Hattur; Mem. #1, EPC

    Apr 17, 2004
    I don't understand. Who is the "other user?"
  20. Kim Sparrow

    Kim Sparrow

    Sep 16, 2005
    Monmouth, UK
    Yes Ken, you're absolutely right and I shouldnt have hid behind anything. I've been so infuriated by this other person, they have got me all at sixes and sevens. I only seem to be able to add a date of birth in the profile section, but I've nothing to hide so this is me: