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Adding a Little More Low End on the Cheap

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Obese Chess, Apr 10, 2018.

  1. Obese Chess

    Obese Chess I'm Your New Dad Supporting Member

    Sep 4, 2005
    Portland, OR
    Hello all,

    Here's the short and sweet version. My current rig is a Hartke 2500 into an old Hartke 4x10. I love the midrange and the highs, but my band tunes down very low, sometimes tuning the low B on my Dingwall down to a low G (The low A is our standard). The old Hartke 4x10 cannot replicate tones this low. I am going to save up for and eventually purchase either a Magellan 212T or a Fearless F212. However, four figures on a cabinet isn't in the budget right now.

    So, in the interim, I am looking for an affordable (used is fine) add-on cabinet that I can stick to my current rig to better represent those low frequencies. There's a Hartke 2x15 of a similar vintage for sale locally, which would be my first choice if it wasn't 148lbs.

    What do y'all think?
    Pbassmanca likes this.
  2. Stumbo

    Stumbo Wherever you go, there you are. Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 11, 2008
    the Cali Intergalctic Mind Space
    Song Surgeon slow downer software- full 4 hour demo
    Pickup an adjustable HPF. It will keep your cab from getting all muddy. Whether you add another cab or not.

    You're working with overtones/harmonics anyway.

    Also, get your cab closer to ear level, on a stand or bench. Or tilt it back so you can hear it better.

    Which strings are you using for the low A?
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2018
  3. BadExample


    Jan 21, 2016
    Cheap and deep sure weighs a lot.
    Stumbo, JRA, Burwabit and 5 others like this.
  4. Obese Chess

    Obese Chess I'm Your New Dad Supporting Member

    Sep 4, 2005
    Portland, OR
    Would the HPF on the amp not be sufficient? I'm out of my element here. The sound isn't muddy with proper EQing, the lows just aren't particularly pronounced in the same way that the low mids and upward are. I will work on tilting the amp back or raising it up a bit if you think that'll help getting the lows up.
    I am using a Payson Nickel .145 on a Dingwall NG-2.

    Ain't that the truth.
    BadExample likes this.
  5. Paulabass

    Paulabass Supporting Member

    Sep 18, 2017
    Too bad you're so far away. My local speaker reconer is selling two pairs of 4x18's really cheap. They would rock your situation.
    Pbassmanca, JRA, mikewalker and 2 others like this.
  6. Obese Chess

    Obese Chess I'm Your New Dad Supporting Member

    Sep 4, 2005
    Portland, OR
    Thanks for the thought, that sounds extremely bad ass.

    Just as an addition that I should have mentioned earlier - Here's how I narrowed the issue down to being the cab. We fiddled with my EQ as I was playing, and when we finally got the lows to stick out, there was zero note definition, it just sounded thuddy and muddy. I unplugged the rig, pedalboard, etc, moved it over to a 1x15 that we had in the room (we share the rehearsal space with a few other bands), plugged everything back in, and the note clarity was there in the lows - just not in the mids and highs.
  7. I think you are yet to learn about overtones aka harmonics. If you get the HPF you will be amazed how much better your 410 sounds on low notes.

    The sound of the string going Wob Wob Wob across its full length is the fundamental. It's very hard to hear, very hard to generate and very hungry of power. All the other string wobbles gang up on it and eat its lunch.

    HPF it. Your 410 won't be getting out audible amounts of 40hz even.
  8. BadExample


    Jan 21, 2016
    If an HPF before the amp lowers the cutoff freq or steepens the slope, it could help.
  9. BadExample


    Jan 21, 2016
    That could cause dain bramage.
    Rompin Roddy, JRA, Wisebass and 4 others like this.
  10. Yeah, be very wary of bramaging your dain. Above certain SPL level the sound goes straight through your dain and turns it to jelly.
    JRA, -Asdfgh-, Wisebass and 4 others like this.
  11. BadExample


    Jan 21, 2016
    OC - call up Mr. Hartke and ask him about the HPF. I checked the manual. Oddly the pics I saw on the site show an HPF on/off switch, but I didn't see that in the manual. I hear he's a straight up fella and will tell your what you need to know.
  12. Mushroo

    Mushroo Supporting Member

    Apr 2, 2007
    Massachusetts, USA
    +1 to the above comments. HPF and a limiter/compressor.
    Obese Chess likes this.
  13. Obese Chess

    Obese Chess I'm Your New Dad Supporting Member

    Sep 4, 2005
    Portland, OR
    I don't have his number anymore but I imagine I could dig it back up. He would be the one to ask.

    I am using a compressor already. My signal chain is bass -> tuner ->BBE Opto-Stomp (Blue LED) (BBE Opto Stomp) -> Darkglass B7K -> Amp
    ELynx and Mushroo like this.
  14. 73jbass

    73jbass Supporting Member

    Apr 17, 2004
    Add another cab identical to the one you have.
  15. bumperbass

    bumperbass Supporting Member

    Jun 19, 2012
    More Low End on the Cheap.

    That there's what they call an oxymoron. Settle down, OP. I'm not calling you a moron.
    The Fearless will do it. I'd like a 212 myself. I'll buy one if you do. I promise.
  16. juancaminos

    juancaminos Supporting Member

    May 30, 2003
    USA, Phoenix, AZ
    Wow and I thought I had issues last Saturday night with the addition of a 2X10 (to my existing 4X10) to get more boom out to the dance floor...thread coming. Adjustable HPF sounds interesting. I'll explain a little later becasue I have so much to say with highjacking this thread.
    Pbassmanca likes this.
  17. agedhorse

    agedhorse Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 12, 2006
    Davis, CA (USA)
    Development Engineer-Mesa, Product Support-Genz Benz
    Yeah, the big 'of heavy cabinets like that are almost impossible to even give away. MT's?
    Pbassmanca likes this.
  18. Getting down to low low G, 24 Hz, sounds like a challenge for consumer equipment. But improving your rig's ability to accommodate a 5 string or low B is very doable on a small budget. And you may get borderline usable levels at low G.

    I run a Hartke 410XL (Transient Attack) on top of Hartke VX215 with casters. The VX215 at 77 lb is lighter than the 4x10XL at 87 lb. The VX series are paper cones, which is what you want for 15's. Avoid the metal cone 15's, as they are known to fatigue and fail. Adding the 2x15 to your rig will be transformational for low end. A bandmate plays a 5 string thru mine, and it rumbles on the low B. So I'd recommend finding a VX215, ~$250 with some shopping. - more low end on the cheap.


    PS - there are two at Guitar Center, with cheap shipping if you can pickup at a store, under $250.
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2018
    Obese Chess likes this.
  19. MattZilla


    Jun 26, 2013
    two pair is four... so sixteen 18" speakers? You could sell your band as some sort of sonic IMAX experience. I don't care if you're playing new kids on the block into rage against the machine into tame impala, I would pay $30 to experience this rig for a half hour.
  20. BadExample


    Jan 21, 2016
    You might double check your math before shelling out the $30 ;)
    Pbassmanca and Obese Chess like this.

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