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Ampeg 410HLF or 2x10 and 1x15

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by jaffabass, Sep 8, 2002.

  1. jaffabass


    Mar 28, 2002
    I've been using an SVT3-Pro and 410HLF for some time and while it sounds great, my back is starting to regret the cab. I usually get someone else to help lifting it, but sometimes someone isn't around and at 3 in the morning pulling it out of the back of the car on my own makes me want to cry, and as for going up stairs....:( So, I was thinking about going for 2 smaller cabs, probably a 2x10 and a 1x15, to get the full juice out of the SVT3. The Ampegs look to be a good size and not too heavy. Anyone any thoughts or recommendations about this? I know quite a few folk use a 2x10/1x15 setup, how do you think it will compare with the monster 410HLF?
  2. :)
    It's funny you should mention these specific cabinets. I own the 410HLF myself, and, I also own two Ampeg Classic 1x15s, and a Classic 2x10. I run them with both an Ampeg SVT-III head (older version of the SVT-3Pro), and a Peavey Firebass II.

    I run all three together with the Firebass head when I feel that I need the extended power capability of that head. However, that's not very often, and virtually always in the case of outdoor gigs.

    I run three cabs in various combinations or solo, depending upon the gig, music style, bass I'm using, and mood I'm in.

    My normal indoor rig, for most venues, is the 1x15 and 2x10 combo. I find that it gives the most versatile sound capability, it's fairly easy to transport, and it sounds great with vitually all of my basses. The 15 provides a ton of bottom and the 2x10 fills in everything else.

    I use the 4x10 by itself ocassionally when I need the additional projection it provides. As you probably already know, it has a real broad-range capability. However, I don't think that it can fully replace a 15. And, I get a little tired of its weight myself.

    Sometimes, I get the urge to shake plaster loose, remove a little mortor from the bricks, and provide extra sensory stimulation for everybody in the house, that's when I run both 15s and don't worry about the high end.

    The 2x10 by itself is something I don't use very often. It just doesn't have enough bottom for me.

    If I was limited to two cabs, I would chose the 1x15 and 2x10. They are the best all around pair in my opinion.

    Good luck on your search for new cabs.
  3. jaffabass


    Mar 28, 2002
    Thanks Sammy. A quick question though, when you say the 4x10 gives more "projection", do you mean it makes the amp 'feel' louder and more powerful. The reason I ask is although it's a total pain in the back, one of the things I like about the 410HLF is that don't have to really crank the amp (gain 5, master 3-4 with a MM Stingray or Fender P). Does the 2x10/1x15 feel less powerful?
  4. It's not a case of more powerful, but clearer. It seems to carry more on outdoor gigs than the 1x15 with 2x10, and even more so than the 2-1x15s. The sound just doesn't seem as sharp outside with the 15s and the 2x10. It's almost like the leading edge to the notes get lost in the air. I know that's not a very technical description, but that's what seems to happen. In-doors, the 1x15/2x10 or 2-1x15s work quite well and I rarely use the 4x10 for indoor gigs.

    I'm not a sound engineer so I don't fully understand the dynamics of sound reproduction in the various environments. I do know that my band members all agree with my assessment as well.

    That's the only reason that I haven't gotten rid of the 4x10HLF. I am trying to find out more information on the new Demeter 3x10, and any other 3x10s, or lighter 4x10s that may be out there. So far, what I've heard are so modern hi-fi in their sound that I just can't justify buying them. I'm very old-school in the sound that I'm like. Big, deep, powerful, thumpy bass. If it doesn't produce that, I'm not interested. By the way, my primary basses are P-Basses. Some are PJ'd, some not.

    But, the Ampeg 410HLF is one fantastic sounding cab on its own, or in combination with 1 or 2 15s, for these outdoor gigs. Sounds good indoors as well, but, it's not better than my other cabs and its weight is a big negative to me.

    I hope this helps a little.
  5. cb56


    Jul 2, 2000
    Central Illinois
    Can I chime in here? Feel free to tell me I'm full of it if you think so. At one time I used and Ampeg 410he on top of an Ampeg 18 cab. Sounded great but the 410 cab was a 400 watt cab and the 18 was 175 watts. I was using an Ampeg 350 watt amp (175 watts to each cab). In my opinion, by the time I cranked the amp loud enough to hear the 410 cab the 18 was way too loud and over bearing. I got alot of complaints especially from sound men. I now use an Ampeg 610 hlf sounds great but I still miss having that 18 or even a 15 to go with it. I'm seriously thinking about getting the 15/210 set up both are around 200 watts each so I don't think either cab would out perform the other. That way I could use any combination of 610 cab, 210 cab, 15 cab. ranging from small set up to humongous set up. :D
  6. When I run the 4x10 with other cabs, it's usually with both 15s, or one 15 and the 2x10. The 4x10 is a 4-ohm cab, 400W. The 15s and the 2x10 are 8-ohm, 200W. It balances out quite well. Now it you run the 4x10 with one 8-ohm, 200W cab, then you might have a problem. You just have to make sure things are balanced when you start mixing cabs.
  7. stop_drop_pop33

    stop_drop_pop33 Guest

    Aug 15, 2002
    under your bed
    i have GAS for a 4x10HLF with a SVT350H head
  8. jaffabass


    Mar 28, 2002
    Thanks Sammy for your non technical description, I'm not too technical either so your description was pretty much what I was looking for. I'm with you on all the hi-fi sounding cabs, I'd rather have some thump over "transparent mids".
  9. Si-bob


    Jun 30, 2001
    Hemel Hempstead, UK
    Focusrite / Novation
    i had the same predicament when i was chosing my cabs, if i had the transport (and the arms) i'd buy the 410HLF in a blink of an eye, but portability is a very big issue for me, so i opted for the 210 & 115. I agree that the HLF is more defined, theres more clarity there. But the 210 & 115 setup is a good balance between sound and portability.

  10. I use an Eden 2x10 + 1x15. Here are my thoughts - take what you like and leave the rest ;)

    1. I never put dissimilar cabs on the same amp channel because I want some control of the volume balance between cabs. This means I need a huge power amp to get any volume out of a pair of 8 ohm cabs - I recently upgraded to a QSC RMX2450 - 500w per channel into 8 ohms. My cabs are rated at 350 and 400w.

    2. Rough calculations say that my rig should be about 1.5db louder than a 210XLT alone and 1.5db quieter than a 410XLT - you don't get the bass coupling you would if you had four identical drivers. I can dump the same 700 watts or so into it but it's not quite as loud as a 4x10 would be - but if you're playing that loud you really need to be going through the PA anyhow.

    3. Portability is great - for smaller stuff I can bring the rack and a 2x10 - but with 44lb of power amp the rack is kinda heavy. I have a hand truck that converts into a four wheeled cart - it's a real back saver.
  11. jaffabass


    Mar 28, 2002
    To Si Bob, do you think I should stop moaning, take up 2000 bench presses a day and get on with 410HLF. You seem to rate it pretty highly.
  12. Kurt M.

    Kurt M.

    Dec 11, 2001
    Reading, PA
    I've gone through the same thing. I assume you're talking about the pro series HLF at 128lbs I believe. Two of those kill and if I had somebody to carry them it would be the way to go. In my genre of music tens are pretty much the standard.

    All that said I have been using the SWR SOB 15" with the SWR Goliath Jr 3 2/10. I'm pretty happy with the 15" less so with the 2/10. I have played plenty of gigs with just the 15". I alway run direct so the cab is just my stage monitor anyway. It doesn't always get loud enough to keep up with our overly load guitar players. And my rack on top of just the 15" looks out of place. But, the 2/10 + 1/15 combination looks good and sounds good and is easier to move due to seperate pieces. For me my SVT 3 isn't enough power for this combination but you may find differently depending on what type of music you play. My QSC 2402 should be here to tomorrow. Then look out!

    Give it a try you can always go back to all tens.

    on the web www.lohmusic.com
  13. Si-bob


    Jun 30, 2001
    Hemel Hempstead, UK
    Focusrite / Novation
    Jaffabass - I think if you feel you can handle it, you should definatly go for the HLF, and yes i do rate it very highly cos its an amazing sounding cab.
    However, remember that with a 210 and a 115 you can seperate them, perhaps for a practise or for a small jam, it all depends on your needs!

  14. I currently run a 410hlf w/ Hartke 3500 head for gigs, and I carry a 210 and head to rehearsal and small gigs(mostly cause I don't want to haul the 4x10). Both of my cabs are 4 ohms so I can only run 1 at a time with my head. I may consider still getting the Avatar 2x10 and 1x15 setup some day.(Just to have more versatility) But for now I am happy. I double on Upright so I am not real crazy about the 15's or 18's. I havn't had this setup long so I don't have any real stories yet.
  15. jaffabass


    Mar 28, 2002
    Thanks guys for all your advice and observations. It seems I'm not alone in thinking the HLF is a total pain to move around unless you have a psychotic roadie or the build of a psychotic roadie. I'll have to check out the sound of the 2x10/1x15 setup but I think if the difference is little as compared with the HLF I will go with the 2 smaller cabs. Less back ache and more versatility.
  16. For what it's worth, I would own an Ampeg HLF if not for the portability issue. I used to have a Sunn 2x15 cabinet in the late 80's, and your comments about softly crying to yourself as you unload it at home at 2 a.m. in the morning ring true. Never again!
  17. BlacksHole


    Mar 22, 2000
    Rockville, MD
    I've also made the switch to a 2x10 and a 1x15. Weight and size were big issues. I drive a hatchback, so it is very difficult to lift a 4x10 into and out of the car without banging the car, plus I keep my stuff in my basement. So when I come home from a gig, I don't want to deal with carrying a 4x10 or some other weighty cabinet down the steps. I used to have an EV 2x15, which was a nice cabinet, but a real bear to haul. When I hurt my wrist unloading before a gig, I knew it was time to consider a smaller set up. Even though I liked the ampeg 4x10s, I decided to get the Avatar 2x10 and 1x15 and I think for me, I made the right choice.
  18. By the way, don't discount the possibility of simple using two 2x10's. That was my solution and it works really well. I find 2x10's quite manageable and I like the flexibility of being able to bring just one to rehearsals and small gigs.

    After alot of experimentation, I've decided I don't care for 15's.
  19. ZuluFunk

    ZuluFunk Supporting Member

    Apr 14, 2001
    210/115...the way to go IMO.

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