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Ampeg BSE 4x10 HLF Issues...

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Mike_Oh, May 14, 2018.


  1. Mike_Oh

    Mike_Oh

    Jul 24, 2017
    This is going to be a long post so hang on. I use an SVT-4 Pro as my gigging amp. When I need big sound I use my Ampeg 8x10....heavy! So for smaller gigs I thought a 4x10 might do the job. I picked up a used BSE4x10HLF cheap and it sounded okay until you run some power to it. I was getting speaker farts at low notes on the E string especially a fretted A or B. So I bought four new Eminence Legend 4ohm 200W RMS speakers and installed them. They are supposed to work in ported or sealed cabs. It works a little better but I still get the flapping or farting noise. I then blocked the ports on the cab and that seemed to help some but it still occurs....so I am wondering if a 4x10 is the right way to go? I am running maybe 4-5-6 hundred watts at playing volume. I have played with the settings, used active/passive basses and it seems to help going passive. I have no such issues using the 8x10 at very loud volumes, but it is a hassle for a small venue and it scares some club owners!
    I was looking at Hartke 4x10 1,000 watt rms cab, along with other brands. I was trying to keep the weight down. I really like Ampeg stuff but the only cab they have that is rated above 800w is the Neo cab for big $$. I wonder if it would handle the juice? Anyone have experience or advice on a solution?
     
  2. ELG60

    ELG60 Supporting Member

    Apr 26, 2017
    Mid-Florida
    I have a pair of BSE 410 cabs (H and S) and have also encountered this issue on occasion. I suspect that this is likely inherent to the design. I have a pair of Schroeder 410's as well, including an early one with the two angled speakers, and neither have ever farted out on me. It's purely anecdotal, but I think that you may want to just upgrade to a higher quality 410, or even a good full-range 212 but quality comes at a cost.

    As has been said here by others more knowledgeable and experienced than I:
    Sound
    Weight/Size
    $$$
    Pick two!
     
  3. denhou1974

    denhou1974

    Mar 6, 2008
    Not sure what the problem is but on a side note, port tuning is somewhat specific to the speaker make/model. So don't expect the exact tone if you replaced with a different speaker than what the cab was built/tuned for.
     
    Old Garage-Bander likes this.
  4. Cab power ratings offer no guarantee of avoiding speaker farts.
    Those power ratings are determined at "non-fart" frequencies.
    You need to plan on significantly de-rating the power claims at lower frequencies.
    It becomes about the the physical movements in the speaker rather than how much power the voice coil can handle.
    Appropriate EQ-ing and High Pass Filtering can help tame these things.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2018
    Pbassmanca likes this.
  5. Mike_Oh

    Mike_Oh

    Jul 24, 2017
    Thanks for the replies. I just want to be sure I don't buy another 4x10 and wind up with the same issue. I am looking at a Gallien-Krueger Neo 410 4x10" 800-Watt Bass Cabinet w/Horn 8-ohm.... The other thing is if I could limit the low freqs to say 50Hz and above it might be okay. Still experimenting before spending $$$
     
  6. denhou1974

    denhou1974

    Mar 6, 2008
    Where are you playing that you need 800 watts into a 4x10 but not the 'big sound' of an 8x10? Doesn't make sense to me.

    My outdoor 'big' rig is SVT3PRO into SVT-4x10. In 500 gigs the volume has never been past ~6. My 'small' rig is the new Ampeg 450 watt 2x10 combo which will blow everyone off the stage at 4.
     
  7. Mike_Oh

    Mike_Oh

    Jul 24, 2017
    Well, outdoor the 8x10 works well. Did I say anywhere that I needed 800 watts in a 4x10? When I get the volume up around midway the problem starts....5-6 I guess. We play Classic Rock....not sure what works for others.
     
    Pbassmanca likes this.
  8. denhou1974

    denhou1974

    Mar 6, 2008
    Well yeah, in your post you said that you're looking at 800+ watt cabs.

    The BSE 410 with the factory speakers should be able to handle your needs. The SVT410 has a different tone and seems to handle the low frequencies better than the BSE but it's heavier.
     
    Pbassmanca likes this.
  9. Mike_Oh

    Mike_Oh

    Jul 24, 2017
    So I have an update....I did a lot of research on porting bass cabs and fond some very good info on the Eminence site and also some calculators online. Plugging in the speaker info from Eminence I was able to determine that the existing ports are way off!! Ampeg you would think would know how to port a cab. So what I would up doing was to re-port the cab based on the above information. According to the port calculator the existing ports would need to be 24" in length to tune a cab to 35Hz which is the speaker rating! I had already made blocking from PB to turn it into a sealed cab so I cut the tubes into them. I did six ports using PVC pipe of 1 1/2" diameter each one 7.5" long and wow!! No more farts while playing the notes that caused massive speaker/fart excursion prior. The tone is good and tight so now to a rehearsal on Thursday to give it a work out. So far I am pleased with the results and not having to toss this cab! If it goes well at rehearsal I will post some pics of the porting.
     
    Pbassmanca likes this.
  10. denhou1974

    denhou1974

    Mar 6, 2008
    Ampeg knows how to build cabs. You bought your cab used then you replaced the speakers with non-factory speakers.
     
  11. Well, it's max wattage is 400, and its 4ohms, so it's taking your amps full load. Try running it at an estimated 250 or 300 watts instead of 4, 5, or 6. Those are thermal ratings, not frequency ratings. The lows are what's killing your sound. Whether your coils will melt or not because of the power is irrelevant. But, the Hartke's are 8 ohm, so they'll cut your power by like a third, which in turn will probably sound a lot better with how you're pushing it.
     
  12. Okay then. I'm glad that worked for you.
     
  13. Mike_Oh

    Mike_Oh

    Jul 24, 2017
    Just for your info it did this with the factory Eminence speakers....that is why I replaced them with 2oow rms Eminence speakers.
     
  14. Mike_Oh

    Mike_Oh

    Jul 24, 2017
    In my initial post I said I replaced them with 200w rms Eminence drivers wired in parallel/series for a total of 800w rms capacity. Still a 4ohm cab. looking for headroom....not to run at 800w......turns out it is all about tuning the cab to the drivers.
     
  15. Mike_Oh

    Mike_Oh

    Jul 24, 2017
    As you said tuning is everything!
     
  16. denhou1974

    denhou1974

    Mar 6, 2008
    It's not 'for my info', dude. You're the one asking for help.

    And no, the BSE410HLF didn't come with 200 watt speakers. That is evidence that you didn't replace with the factory spec speakers.

    The guy who owned the cab before you didn't know what he was doing either. Just buy new. Saves time.
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2018
  17. Mike_Oh

    Mike_Oh

    Jul 24, 2017
    Okay....dude.
     

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