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Ampeg PR 410 HLF versus Ampeg SVT 610 HLF

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Djeetn, May 14, 2006.


  1. Djeetn

    Djeetn

    Jan 6, 2005
    Hello everybody,

    I'm Djeetn and with this thread, I need some advice.

    I own an Ampeg B4R Head and an Ampeg SVP-PRO Pré-amp. With this rig, I use the Ampeg SVT 610 HLF cabinet. I've been using this cabinet for a long time now but I'm getting sick of it tossing that giant coffin around at gigs. I've been searching some information concerning the Ampeg PR 410 HLF. Many people say that this is the best cabinet ever created by Ampeg and it even blasts the SVT 810 to bits.

    Are there any people here who could give me some advice concerning the PR 410 HLF? I wish I could test it but there's aren't many stores in Belgium who sell Ampeg. If I want to test it, I must order it and buy it.

    Thank you all very much,

    Djeetn.
     
  2. BillyB_from_LZ

    BillyB_from_LZ Supporting Member

    Sep 7, 2000
    Chicago
    Caveat - My observations are only from messing around with these cabs at the store, not using them in a band.

    To my ears, there is very little difference between the two. The PR410HLF and the SVT610HLF both have impressive low end and nice treble response. The both sound very, very different from an SVT810, which is more midrange centered without the low, low bass. I really like all three cabinets...but two are more similar than the third.

    The PR410HLF is a BIG, heavy 4x10...I'd almost guess that it's harder to deal with than the 610 because it's wide and deep. It weighs 6Kg more than the SVT610HLF.

    When I had an 8x10 it was easy (relative term) to roll it up to the back of my Saab 9000 (hatchback), tip it in the back, and then slide it in. It was tall and you could get the center of mass in the car without having to lift it. A 4x10 is too short to do that and you have to lift the darn thing. I've never tried to load a 6x10 but you'd have more of a fighting chance than with a 4x10.

    My recommendation is to keep what you have...especially as expensive as bass gear is in Europe.

    Hopefully someone with gig experience with these cabs can comment.
     
  3. Those are excellent points and apply to the 610HLF / B4R that I have been playing recently.

    I don't care for the big monster either, but I can load it into my pickup truck without assistance by levering it over the gate. As noted above the 410 is too short for this, so you have to muscle it up. This is ugly after a long night.

    Neither of these are attractive when faced with stairs. As a card-carrying Geezer, my preference is for multiple separates that I can handle with relative ease.
     
    PawleeP likes this.
  4. tlwaps

    tlwaps

    Feb 13, 2006
    Ohio
    I have played the PR410HLF live many many times and I could never hear myself on stage. I used an SVT4PRO with it and the whole time all it would do was fart. If I turned the volume up past 9 o'clock it was farting and distorting. So I said to hell with this, traded it in and got an SVT810E. Now with the 810E it's easier to move around, the weight is evenly spaced out because of the larger space, and it just sounds better to me. I left all of my settings the same on my 4PRO and I can crank it up to probably about 5 or 6 o'clock before my 810E starts to fart or distort.

    So from my expieriences i'd say stay with the 610, even though i've never used it i'd prefer it over the PR410HLF any day.
     
    Boone_Mc likes this.
  5. Djeetn

    Djeetn

    Jan 6, 2005
    Thank you all very much for the great reactions and information. I'm very happy with my rig and reading all the info I'll keep my SVT 610 cabinet. It has never let me down at any gig or rehearsel and yes, it fits without any problems in my small car (seats down that is). I'll keep it and I'll buy a new cabinet when it's totally wasted (but considering Ampeg, this cabinet can last for a lifetime).

    Thanks again, it really helped to make up my final decision.
     
  6. (b)Assman

    (b)Assman

    Jun 22, 2008
    Champaign, IL
    I'm casting resurrection on this thread. I'd like to hear more opinions as I have a 410 Hlf pro and am finding it too difficult to fit and move because of it's width. Thinking about upgrading to a 810 svt but want to know about the sound differences.
     
  7. two fingers

    two fingers Opinionated blowhard. But not mad about it. Gold Supporting Member

    Feb 7, 2005
    Eastern NC USA
    The 410 HLF is ported. It will produce lower frequencies "better" than the 8-10. That being said, I prefer low mids to cut through a mix. There is NOTHING (IMO) that does that better than the sealed 8-10 (which actually ends up being four 2-10 cabs in one box). And as per reasons brought up earlier, I find it MUCH easier to move my 8-10 around than any 4-10 or other cab/stack I ever owned. The handle on the top is heavy duty. You can ROLL it around. Lean into any car/truck and slide it up (assuming it will fit inside). On rare occasions when I have to carry it for a short distance, I get a hand from a band mate. I had an 8-10 years ago and missed it until I got one again recently.
     
  8. BillyB_from_LZ

    BillyB_from_LZ Supporting Member

    Sep 7, 2000
    Chicago
    Please see Post No. 2...the 810 is quite different than any of the HLFs.
     
  9. (b)Assman

    (b)Assman

    Jun 22, 2008
    Champaign, IL
    Please see post No. 6...where I say "more" opinions.
     
  10. I love my PR410HLF! I bought it used from GC about three years ago, and have used it for about 60 gigs...I did have one electronic prob, but GC took care of it...They let me use a SVT810 while mine was in the shop, and I wasn't nearly as impressed...That being said, it depends on what kind of sound you're looking for...
     
  11. BillyB_from_LZ

    BillyB_from_LZ Supporting Member

    Sep 7, 2000
    Chicago
    Fair enough but if you like the general voicing of the PR 410HLF, it won't be there in an SVT 810. I wouldn't view a move from a PR 410HLF to an 810 as an "upgrade" it would be more of a "let's try something completely different" change...only the company name says the same.

    If you like the voicing of the PR 410HLF but desire the form factor of the SVT810 with regard to width and depth, then the SVT610HLF would be one to look at.

    Keep in mind that the SVT610HLF and SVT810 need to be tipped back to roll them around where, iirc PR 410HLF has four casters on the bottom and can be rolled around in two different orientations.
     
  12. FWIW - I had a PR410HLF that I ran with a GK700RBII.

    I bought it thinking I would get the same results as I did running my friend's SVT410HLF that we had at our rehearsal space, using the same head. Which, by the way, I REALLY LIKED!

    Sadly, the results were not the same. The PR was way boomy and I had trouble taming it on the one gig I used it on. Probably a combination of not spending enough time learning how to tweak it and having it coupled to a hollow stage. But definitely NOT the same as the SVT410HLF I'd been using at rehearsal.

    Then I hurt my back moving it and that was it. It went on my local CL.

    Despite it having 4 casters, the PR is heavy enough that if you don't let it down easy, the casters could get bent, broken or deformed. Two of the 4 casters on mine were deformed beyond use due to rough handling from the prior owner. I ended up buying new ones, but the weight of this bad boy wasn't worth it to me to hang onto it.

    YMMV.
     
    AlexanderB likes this.
  13. (b)Assman

    (b)Assman

    Jun 22, 2008
    Champaign, IL
    Good stuff. I just hate a freaking wide it is really. It fits in my car only when it rips into the doors, difficult to push a lot of times and deadlift is annoying. I love the way it sounds, but I just think it doesn't compliment my head enough. I feel like with my 750 watt head I'm not getting enough air/volume and more cones is the solution for this imo. Not as powerful as I want. Maybe an SVT-810 is really what I need after all for cutting.


    Edit : I see the 610 is only rated at 600 watts! :|
     
  14. ZiggyDude

    ZiggyDude

    Jun 8, 2005
    I tried both the 410HLF and the 610HLF (SLM versions) in several stores and there is a difference in the sound. The 410 is deeper while the 610 has more the classic SVT fatness but still decent low end. The reason is that the top two banks of 2x10s on the 610 are not ported - just like a regular SVT, while the bottom bank is ported. The 410 has a hole between the two 2x10 banks and all hit the ports. It is also deeper in size.

    The 410 actually weighs more! The extra wood.

    I used the 610 with a 4Pro head for quite a while and still do on occasion. It is a nice rig. I actually consider the 610 a mid size cab. It is only 40" tall. Look at the avatar - that is a big cab at 48" tall and over 150 pounds.

    I also know the 610 is very well balanced. When loading you can hold the side handles and flip it horizontal to the ground and move it easily.

    Unless you want the different tone - I would stick with what you got. Especially if yours is USA made and anything you find is imported.

    The PR series is too dang heavy - do you really need that armor? The SVT Classic 610 takes everything that my 4Pro can dish out - never a fart.

    - Ziggy -
     
  15. (b)Assman

    (b)Assman

    Jun 22, 2008
    Champaign, IL

    It's either the cab goes or my car door does....decisions..decisions...
     
  16. By-Tor1000RR

    By-Tor1000RR

    Jul 17, 2008
    Stamford, CT
    (b)Assman, what head are you using? I'm using a Kustom 1200 head and I think that this underappreciated head is a perfect mate for my PR410hlf. I have tried my GK head with this cab and it doesn't mesh well with it. On the same token, I've used the Kustom head with my Hartke 410xl and the sound is lacking. Finally after 19 or so years I have finally found a tone that is so killer that I'm never gonna give up my cab or head (no matter how heavy they are). It's the tone I've always had in my head but my gear could never quite get me there.
     
  17. I have gigged many times with a PR410hlf and that things rocks...it is a bit muddy sounding if you do not eq it right, but it can really thump. It does weight a ton though, you will definitly want help carrying it. I also used a SVT4pro and it was OK but when i switched to my Carvin B1500, that cab came alive!
     
  18. By-Tor1000RR

    By-Tor1000RR

    Jul 17, 2008
    Stamford, CT
    Pretty much supports my opinion that the head makes a huge difference with this cab. The Kustom 1200 is often compared to the Carvin B1500 so I know we're in the same ballpark sound wise. Give this cab some power and it really shines.

     
  19. BillyB_from_LZ

    BillyB_from_LZ Supporting Member

    Sep 7, 2000
    Chicago
    I don't believe that this statement is accurate. I had never heard that before, so I asked someone who would know and he indicated that the entire enclosure is ported. There are braces inside that have openings in them so that all drivers act in the same ported enclosure.
     
    AlexanderB likes this.
  20. BillyB_from_LZ

    BillyB_from_LZ Supporting Member

    Sep 7, 2000
    Chicago
    I was just thinking about the same configuration the other day. Six months or so ago (when I had myself convinced that I wasn't buying any more gear) I missed a killer deal on a pair of PR 410HLFs...and figure that the B1500 would have been brutally, excessively perfect!
     
    LennyE likes this.

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