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any sound differences between two 1x12s and one 2x12?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by KB, Feb 17, 2002.


  1. KB

    KB

    Jan 13, 2000
    Chapel Hill, NC
    I am about ready to make the plunge to upgrade my cabinets. I am fairly sure I want to go with 12" speakers (so I can get a cross between punch and deep sound). So my question is:
    would there be a difference in sound from two 8ohm 1x12s vs. one 4ohm 2x12 (all Aguilar brand)? I am trying to weigh portability/cost/and sound before I make my purchase (by calling Gard).

    My head can handle 4ohm (a Carvin R600 in bridge mode). I play in a 3 piece band with kind of a rock sound so I need to be loud.
    what are your thoughts?

    -KB
     
  2. jokerjkny

    jokerjkny

    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PA
    well,

    i had the same question about augmenting my Eden CXM110 with another one. it was that or going with a Epifani 2x10 or Eden D-210XLT.

    IMHO, i think the fact that the a box made specifically for two speakers is gonna be a more well tuned machine. the ports, crossover, even speakers, are gonna be tweaked for the best sound coming from two speakers in one box. to be honest, these perceptions could be pretty minor to take note of, but to my ears, the D-210XLT had a tighter and more responsive sounding bass than the dual 1x10 setup.

    Two separate speaker cabs are just that, two speaker cabs. they're more isolated and might not work as harmoniously since they can be affected by factors differently.

    but with that said, you probably get a whole lot more versatility in terms of cab placement like stacking for tight stages or better yet one cab slightly facing you as a monitor while the other faces the audience. also its alot more portable, breaking up the two for easier carry.

    i'm actually leaning more towards the two box setup since i already love my CXM110 for my jazz, acoustic work. my back would more than appreciate the easy carrying too.
     
  3. brianrost

    brianrost Gold Supporting Member

    Apr 26, 2000
    Boston, Taxachusetts
    You can expect it to be similar but not identical. If you use the two cabs you get two tweeters, for one thing.

    The tuning of the box may be slightly different as well (most 2-12 boxes are slightly SMALLER than two 1-12 boxes from the same maker).

    About the only way it can be identical is if the construction is truly 100% identical. For instance, an Ampeg SVT 8-10 is really four sealed 2-10 sections in one box. If you built two 4-10 or four 2-10 cabs with the same construction and stacked them up, it should sound identical.
     
  4. KB

    KB

    Jan 13, 2000
    Chapel Hill, NC
    I think the two 1x12s are probably the way I'm gonna go...mainly for portability, plus I've heard that Aguilar hasn't released the 4ohm version of the 2x12 yet. If I use two 8 ohm 1x12s I'll get the 4ohm load and be able to draw my full power (600W----300W to each cab with the R600 in bridge mode). Do you think that two 1x12s would be loud enough and punchy enough in a rock situation? (at least as good as my Carvin 2x10/1x15 stack?)

    -KB
     
  5. Maybe, maybe not. Here's my take on the aguilar 12s. They sound great and are loud when you run an aguilar preamp through them. I myself am going to get 2 GS112 cabs and play pretty loud rock most of the time, but what i personally found was that when you used another head with them, they just became so weak. My recommendation if you want two seperate 112 cabs would be Bergantino or Epifani. Although i would imagine because of the shape of the Epifani 212, that it would be easy to transport and that would be a killer cab.
     
  6. jokerjkny

    jokerjkny

    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PA
    Tho, i agree with fortune in that aggie cabs sound best with aggy heads, if the GS112 works for you, go for it. whether or not, it'll be loud enough for your rock band is something only you'll be able to see. make sure the place you're buying from honors a long eval period so you'll be able to try it out in rehearsal or better yet a gig.

    there's the old formula of being 4x more wattage than the guitarist. he's 100 watts, you better be pushing 400 watts.
     
  7. KB

    KB

    Jan 13, 2000
    Chapel Hill, NC
    Well I do have the 600W of my carvin head and my guitarist is only 75W. I will say that my Carvin cabs are not that loud and they seem to fart every now and then...probably from not being too efficient. My other option I am considering is an Eden 212xlt, but that brings weight back into the picture. I'll have to make sure that where I buy them from (probably Bass Central as local stores always have very high prices and only seem to carry peavey and maybe SWR and maybe 1 eden or aggie cab if you are lucky and they are in stock) would have a good return/eval policy. It seems likethe Ag 112s are more efficient and so maybe they will project the sound better.

    -KB
     
  8. From what you've mentioned, i'd say Aguilar, but...i definately say look into Epifani.
     
  9. bassmonkeee

    bassmonkeee Supporting Member

    Sep 13, 2000
    Decatur, GA
    I've got both an Aguilar 1x12 and a Demeter HBP-1 preamp that should arrive today. I'll be using my Carvin R600 head as a power amp, and bypassing the Carvin Preamp. I'll be running it bridged at 400 Watts into 8 ohms. I'll try the Carvin without the Demeter, and let you know how it sounds.
     
  10. KB

    KB

    Jan 13, 2000
    Chapel Hill, NC
    That would be great. Thanks

    -KB
     
  11. Wow, My 2nd Aguilar 1x12 is scheduled to arrive today and I have practice tonight. I'll be running my Eden WT300 into both cabs but I'm looking for a more powerfull head that will match up well with the Aggies. I'll post my thoughts on this setup as well.

    Edit: Looks like I will have to wait another day for my 2nd cab to arrive. UPS has come and gone according to Receiving. Drats!
     
  12. jokerjkny

    jokerjkny

    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PA
    Well,

    i just came back from Rudy's music here in NYC and tried a Bergantino 1x12 and Aguilar 1x12 thru an Eden WT400 using my trusty Roscoe 4 string.

    hands down, the Berg was sweet!! in most catagories, it was just "more". more louder, more deeper, a bit more punchier, and more complex than the aguilar at the same settings. For $200 extra, it'd better had be.

    the berg was really articulate, with a nice kick in the bass. but, the Aguilar's did have a bit more lower midrange kick. but it did lack a little top end making it "papery" sounding and not as 3D compared to the Berg. still for something $200 less, it was nice for what it was.

    in a loud rock band setting, with that lower midrange push, i think the Aggie's would still be great and cut like a mofo. With the Berg's, in that same rock setting, i'm sure that top end will totally disappear. but in a jazz, acoustic gig, it'd be MAD nice.

    funny enough, the berg was shallower than the Aggy by about 2-3 inches. and it was lighter, too. i gotta admit tho, i cant stand that ugly sliver grill. i like Aguilar's understated look better. the Aguilar also had a better built handle too. a self snap/folding roll bar style handle vs. the Berg's corny leather handle. also the Aggie's added weight made it feel as tough as a rock. the berg felt like i could kick it around a bit. For that rock gig, i'd be more comfortable taking the Aguilar.

    as you can tell, i liked the berg's tone alot, but it is a bit pricey @ $550 for a 1x12. For pure bang for the buck, i'd say the Aguilar wins hands down.

    tomorrow, i'm gonna take the train out to Brooklyn and give Nick Epifani's shop a visit and try out one of his 1x12's. i'll post a report.
     
  13. bassmonkeee

    bassmonkeee Supporting Member

    Sep 13, 2000
    Decatur, GA
    Well, my gear just showed up, so I'll definitely have something to say about it tomorrow. I can't wait for 4pm!!!!
     
  14. jokey, i was at Rudy's this weekend. I tried out the two cabs too. The berg is great, but i'll tell ya what, the GS112 doesn't sound that good or loud with other heads that don't have the ag preamp. I was in the NY guitar and bass boutique and the GS112 running with an Ag was majorly loud and sounded incredible. It would easily go head to head with the berg no question.
     
  15. I'm hoping that the 2 Aguilar 1x12's will work for me in a moderately loud rock band. My Eden/SWR 8x8 setup is doing the job but I'd like more headroom and the 8x8 is a pain to move sometimes due to it's size/weight.

    I'm thinking of going with the Aguilar DB659 pre-amp and a QSC PLX2402 but I'm concerned about how the Aggie GS112 cabs will hold up. That power amp is rated at 425w a side into 8 ohms, 700w into 4 ohms so I'd be comfy using one side only but the amount of juice it puts out in bridged mode may be too much at 1500w into 8 ohms and 2400w into 4 ohms.

    Anyone run a similar setup?
     
  16. To the best of my knowledge, if you run it in stereo, each sound goes seperately, so if you have two cabs, one on each side, it should push just 425w into each. But that's only to the best of my understanding, maybe someone can correct me or confirm my statement.
     
  17. Exactly right. I could run one cab from each side for 425w into 8 ohms or run both cabs from only one side and get 700w into 4 ohms which in theory will be plenty for me. I'm wondering if the 2 Aggies could handle this amp in bridged mode without blowing them up if I'm conservative with my volume.
     
  18. Well what i meant was not running both on one side but running one on each side. I actually read that on a thread that someone started and they said that if you put an 8ohm on each side when it's in stereo, it'll only push the 8ohms watts into each cab. Like i said, i could be wrong and that's just what i read. Although you could run both on just one side and you should be fine.

    My suggestion though, considering what you will end up paying for that poweramp and preamp, get the DB750 when it comes out in March(that's the tentative date). 750watts into 4ohms. Modeled after a brice poweramp, and aguilar craftsmanship. can't beat that. Rik's sells them for $1250 new, or will be selling them for $1250 new.
     
  19. jokerjkny

    jokerjkny

    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PA
    Oh, dont get me wrong, Cookie,

    i'll be the first to second that. nothing sounds as great as the Aggie DB359/GS112 setup at Bass Boutique, especially when i'm using that killer Atelier Z jazz they have. OMG, or better yet, at Roger Sadowsky's shop two avenue blocks over, using that swwwweeeeeet all natural swamp ash jazz thru the DB 680/728/GS112.

    ....holy mother....

    i'd pounce on that setup in a heart beat if my back didnt wince at the very thought of having to schlep 100-150 lbs. of pure Aguilar all over NYC in a cramped cab.

    but its still a little unfortunate you need to run nearly all Aguilar to get that tone from the GS112. but, compared to all other stuff out there, the GS112 still a great value IMHO, no matter what i say. (huh??)

    the lightness of the Eden WT400 (which is what i run) and the Berg setup just happened to spin my wheels a little easier than the WT400 w/ Aggie GS112. but when i become a body builder or am famous enough for 3 roadies, i'm all over an Aguilar setup.

    Oooooooo, i'm gettting goose bumps just day dreaming about it... hehe...
     
  20. Oh definately, i mean joker, the Berg was definately a great cab, no question. I think that when it comes to weight though, couldn't you try to go with the DB750, it's weighed in at like 36lbs i think, or somewhere like that. And then you could get an aguilar GS112.