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Anyone have a decent WinISD tutorial?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by DiscoRiceJ, Dec 2, 2019 at 2:11 PM.


  1. DiscoRiceJ

    DiscoRiceJ

    Oct 15, 2018
    I downloaded the software and input the specs for the Faital 15PR400. I am new to all of this so please give me both barrels if I say something ignorant. I was able to input most of the data from the Faital specifications. My intention is to either build a 215 box or modify an old Peavey 215 cabinet (as I'm a big fan aesthetically). From what I have read about most peoples attempts with the 215 configuration with this speaker is that a preponderance of people have tuned their cabinets too low somewhere around 35 to 40hz and they end up being unhappy. I'm going to port the cab and assume that tuning it to 55hz might eliminate some of the boomyness.

    Every time I go into looking at the modeling based on the internal box and other parameters might cone excursions don't look right. They are a flat line and not a curve. I'm assuming that I am missing something somewhere that I was supposed to put in. If someone has a WinISD tutorial aside from the Youtube one by 123Toid, which is decent, but hasn't helped it would be greatly appreciated.

    I read through JohnK_10's build which seems a bit small. He tuned his to 45hz or so. I think if I can get somewhere between 45-55, I can eq around any issues. I obviously want to limit excursion though. His internal volume was 5.3 cf. What I have come up with was either 6.76 cf or 6.88 (peavey internal volume). I'd likely put something in to separate the two speakers and thus drop the internal dimensions a bit.

    Any assistance aside from just give up, is greatly appreciated. You can say that too, but I probably will press on.
     
    Skillet likes this.
  2. Passinwind

    Passinwind I know nothing. Commercial User

    Dec 3, 2003
    Columbia River Gorge, WA.
    Owner/Designer &Toaster Tech Passinwind Electronics
    If you want to send me your .wdr file (or just post a screenshot of your driver data file) I'll be happy to look at it and see what's up. Don't think I have one already made, but I can double check.
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2019 at 2:25 PM
    basscooker and DiscoRiceJ like this.
  3. basscooker

    basscooker Commercial User

    Apr 11, 2010
    cincy ky
    Owner, ChopShopAmps
    Do you have anything entered for Sd? Are all of your units the same? Millimeters and liters OR inches and cuft?
     
    agedhorse likes this.
  4. DiscoRiceJ

    DiscoRiceJ

    Oct 15, 2018
    I made sure I changed to the appropriate nomenclature. Passinwind I will likely do both. Thank you.
     
    basscooker and Passinwind like this.
  5. Passinwind

    Passinwind I know nothing. Commercial User

    Dec 3, 2003
    Columbia River Gorge, WA.
    Owner/Designer &Toaster Tech Passinwind Electronics
    The autofill feature in the speaker database can go wonky pretty easily. Did you read through the suggested parameter entry order in the help file?
     
    dralionux likes this.
  6. DiscoRiceJ

    DiscoRiceJ

    Oct 15, 2018
    I did not, because a bunch of people said that it didn't work or didn't exist. I did check the autofill first. I did not know there was an order so I just worked right to left and down.
     
  7. Passinwind

    Passinwind I know nothing. Commercial User

    Dec 3, 2003
    Columbia River Gorge, WA.
    Owner/Designer &Toaster Tech Passinwind Electronics
    IIRC the autofill order is only listed in help file the latest version of WISD, but I may easily be wrong about that. In any case, you want to only input a minimal data set and let all the rest autofill. And you have to be sure to hit "enter" a bunch (like after each entry) and that the autofill is actually autofilling.
     
    Haroldo and DiscoRiceJ like this.
  8. DiscoRiceJ

    DiscoRiceJ

    Oct 15, 2018
    I will edit the existing driver details or retry as the Faital isn't in their database. I thought that I should put everything in according to what the actual specs were not what was autofilling.
     
  9. Passinwind

    Passinwind I know nothing. Commercial User

    Dec 3, 2003
    Columbia River Gorge, WA.
    Owner/Designer &Toaster Tech Passinwind Electronics
    That won't fly and is probably where things are going off the rails. I think it's probably mostly a rounding error issue, but in any case WinISD wants to see all the parameters conform to their calculation method, and something being off by even .01 throws everything sideways.
     
    basscooker likes this.
  10. DiscoRiceJ

    DiscoRiceJ

    Oct 15, 2018
    So here is a discrepancy.
    WinISD calc
    winisd pic.JPG
    Manufacturer spec. Check the calculated Sd number
    faital spec.JPG
     
  11. Passinwind

    Passinwind I know nothing. Commercial User

    Dec 3, 2003
    Columbia River Gorge, WA.
    Owner/Designer &Toaster Tech Passinwind Electronics
    From the help file:

     
  12. DiscoRiceJ

    DiscoRiceJ

    Oct 15, 2018
    While it shows blue I did enter the value, which is identical to what the autofill put in.

    When I originally put in the information I fixed any result from autofill with the manufacturer specification.
     
  13. Passinwind

    Passinwind I know nothing. Commercial User

    Dec 3, 2003
    Columbia River Gorge, WA.
    Owner/Designer &Toaster Tech Passinwind Electronics
    Trust the autofilled data, not the factory spec. Counterintuitive, but that's what works.
     
    basscooker, Inara and DiscoRiceJ like this.
  14. DiscoRiceJ

    DiscoRiceJ

    Oct 15, 2018
    15pr400P.JPG
    15pr400AP.JPG
    15pr400Dm'.JPG
    So some of the numbers differ from the published specs. I have no idea what AlfaVC is nor R(t) or C(T)

    This concerns me that this is just entering the driver info and it seems problematic. I'm hoping I have it straight. Thanks for all your help..
     
    agedhorse likes this.
  15. Passinwind

    Passinwind I know nothing. Commercial User

    Dec 3, 2003
    Columbia River Gorge, WA.
    Owner/Designer &Toaster Tech Passinwind Electronics
    Don't worry about the advanced specs. But you definitely need to enter Pe (max power handling) to get useful excursion and max SPL figures. And then you need to enter an input signal greater than 1 watt, which is the default.

    I'll be back in a bit, time to get outdoors for a while and shake off cabin fever.
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2019 at 4:31 PM
    DiscoRiceJ likes this.
  16. seamonkey

    seamonkey

    Aug 6, 2004
    Have you looked at one of the driver databases that can import into winisd and others?
    FaitalPRO 15PR400
     
    fdeck, DiscoRiceJ and Haroldo like this.
  17. DiscoRiceJ

    DiscoRiceJ

    Oct 15, 2018
    I had not. Didn't even know that they existed.

    Thanks!
     
  18. fdeck

    fdeck Supporting Member Commercial User

    Mar 20, 2004
    Madison WI
    HPF Technology LLC
    In Post #14, I don't see Re entered. That will throw off the other calculated parameters. You should also enter Le if it's provided in the datasheet.
     
    dralionux and Passinwind like this.
  19. fdeck

    fdeck Supporting Member Commercial User

    Mar 20, 2004
    Madison WI
    HPF Technology LLC
    dralionux and Chu like this.
  20. DiscoRiceJ

    DiscoRiceJ

    Oct 15, 2018
    So I haven't figured out how to expand the graph yet. So there's that. The max excursion doesn't seem anywhere near problematic at the cabinet size. The max power says 800w. The amp is 900w. I could do the 8 ohm version and then I'd have some protection and I'm sure it would still be plenty loud at the 450-500 or so. I used the driver details off of the web database. It made some changes to what the autofill produced.

    These are the charts folks. If any of you have some advice, lemme know.
    TFM
    tfm.JPG
    SPL
    spl.JPG
    Max Power
    max power.JPG
    Cone Excursion
    conexcursion.JPG
    Group Delay
    group delay.JPG
     
    Passinwind likes this.

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