Articulation, Timbre, Tone, etc.

I have been dealing with this same basic idea myself. It seems that everyone wants the big massive bass sound, but also want clarity and articulation, and very few seem to achieve both similtaneously. I play BG primarily, but even in that, it is the same deal. When I started playing, the standard was 15" speakers. Somewhere along the line, multiple ten's became the standard. My dad used guts on his bass, but spiros became the standard jazz string. He used to gripe at me about how thin my sound was. Nowadays I can't say that he was wrong.

It is a never ending quest for the perfect balance. I think that spiros are great for articulating solo work, but when it comes to background playing, the sound is just to thin. Guts are great for background work, but not for soloing. This (along with other reasons) is why I choose to not solo, just do the background stuff. If people dig my sound, great, if not, that's fine too, I am the one that got the call to play, not them. If I am asked to solo, then they have to take what they get, but most of the people I play for already know this.

Just my two cents.

 

Plenty of players get a huge sound with Spiros, it just takes the right touch and technique.
I am listening to Red Mitchell now with Donald Bailey and Jimmy Rowles. His sound is huge and full when walking and he changes it during his solos.
I think guts can also be just as clear when soloing, but guts take every bit as much or more practice arco to keep up on intonation and unfortunately
the bulk of gut players I run across don't seem to do this, Wilbert Dejoode being a rare exception.

My primary music, improvised music is very (maybe even mostly) concerned with the timbre and articulation.
Unless the content is really stellar, I get bored quickly with straighter jazz and classical when it is played with a monochrome palette.

That is one of the reason Red is such a great listen. I feel like he is dealing with so many different musical elements beyond line and harmony.

 

I didn't mean to sound like I am concentrating on the equipment making the sound. I believe that it has mostly to do with the player. I have been given compliments on my sound, then people realize I don't have any magic box that creates that sound, just me and the bass (maybe the amp). They walk away and don't want to talk to me anymore. I feel that a lot of how we play, and approach the instrument has a lot to do with how we learned, and what we had available to us individually duing the learning process. If you want to arco with a sweet sound, and all you have available is rosin, and strings known to create hashness, you learn to play to aleviate that harshness in some way.

 

One thing that I've felt is that some bassists fall into that whole trap of trying to make every note a big long event, forgetting that notes have a beginning and an end, with spaces of all varieties in between. One of the great moments of my life was when I was playing with Art Lande, and he pointed out to me that I didn't play all the notes as if I was trying to flatten them out, that each one had a life of its own. That was a great affirmation for me, because I've spent a lot of time in my life listening to singers and tenor players, trying to get that sensibility into my bass playing.

I'm not sure if that makes sense, but I don't know how else to verbalize it.

 

The Italian composer Giancinto Scelsi only wanted women to play his solo music because he said each note need to to be born, cared for and killed - or something to that effect. It is a bit dramatic, but it is a nice way to start thinking about that sort of thing.
Must have been great playing with Lande - what a great musician!

I think Barry Guy has a lot to offer in this area and his work in this context might translate to more traditional ways of playing:
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=449086

 

I like that... simple way of stating it.

 

Timbre is a big deal. Good stuff about the spaces between notes. I think the spaces might have just as much to do with the articulation as the attack.

 

What's up Charles!

Anyway, to borrow from a teacher, music is sound and silence, and the silence is every bit as important as the sound. Without the silence, sound is meaningless. I've been hearing that for years, but I just made the connection that that should be applied within phrases--not just between phrases.

 

Nice thoughts all around,

I agree note length/life is a key point here - I find that when I'm soloing, I can get ahead of myself with ideas, and not spend enough time executing what is happening at the moment in a clean and relaxed manner. I spend a great deal of energy working pizz tone, yet that can go right out the window in the heat of the solo. One thing that has helped me immensely is to only play while inhaling, and focus on the next phrase while exhaling. Also I try to play half of what I'm thinking nicely as opposed to everything in my head sloppily.

 

Learning to play in a smooth, long, legato style is the way to go. Once you've got that down, its easier to shorten notes and create different articulations.

That being said, I rarely hear DB players talk about practicing pizz articulation. For instance, seeing how to get the most bottom end, or how to get the most attack. I see lots of players who kind of play with the side of their fingers, others who use the tip like an electric player would, but I don't see many guys mixing it up. They're all legit techniques so why limit yourself to one?

My teacher always says "not to be just another thumper"

 

I think Jim Hall once said something in a similar vein... something on the order of where where its sorta takes guts to just let single note or chord ring out. Something like letting a note live it's full life is much deeper, because all the qualities of that note are left to be seen/heard as it is, all vulnerabilities & imperfections included. That's how I remember it, but maybe I'm embellishing a bit... I forget what he said exactly.

I think one difficulty is that timbre is such a personal thing... everybody's hands are different and we all get our own sounds. Something that is also very innate as string pullers. When to use 2 fingers together instead of alternating? I mean, it's just as subjective as using dynamics during a solo. Everybody can do it, but it something we don't talk about.

 

Check this out, esp. during the bass solo.

http://www.appliedmicrophone.com/upload/mediaclips/Montara.wmv

 

Bolo - Thanks for posting that video link. I though that solo really illustrated what Ben Rolston said about leaving space as well as the many comments about articulation and variety in tone through technique. To my ears that solo was so much more interesting than a constant flurry of notes all played with the same attack and volume. It's time to go practice!

 

I hear that!!

I also really enjoyed his walking as well. And kudos to the drummer - just laying down some great support.

 

Glad people seemed to enjoy that video clip. I am no great player, but I do like to try and mix up right hand technique myself, sometimes within songs and even within phrases if it seems called for. And I have gotten to the point where long breaths or pauses are part and parcel of my jazz solos now, whereas at one time they kind of made me uncomfortable.

Kudos to charlespf for starting the thread to begin with. Everything you conveyed in this thread is thoughtful and helpful. I like how you referred to so many great players, and not just bass players, and various elements of their sound and style. You've obviously listened to a lot of great stuff. Clifford Brown. Beautiful.