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Audere preamp with passive tone control question...

Discussion in 'Pickups & Electronics [BG]' started by mmbongo, Aug 19, 2012.

  1. mmbongo

    mmbongo Dilly Dilly! Supporting Member

    Aug 5, 2009
    Before I bother David at Audere..yet again..I wanted to ask here, hopefully someone is familiar with how the passive tone control works on Audere preamps.

    My basic question is...does the passive tone control, when turned fully up, add brightness to the tone? I know that sounds kinda like a stupid question...but what I'm getting at is, if the tone control were removed completely from the circuit, would that sound the same as the control turned fully up? I just need a better understanding of how it works.

    The point behind this:
    I have two Laklands, a 5501 and a 4401. My 5501 has an Audere with the passive tone control. My 4401 has the same preamp but without the passive tone control. Both have the same pickups. I'm trying to get them both to sound the same, but the 5501 is much brighter and punchier with more output. I'm trying to figure out if it's just a difference in the basses or if that passive tone control is what gives my 5501 that sparkle and punch. I run it all the way up and don't add any of the active EQ.
  2. Smilodon

    Smilodon Supporting Member

    Feb 18, 2012
    I'm not familiar with the specific equipment you are talking about, so here is the general explanation:

    If the tone control is passive it can't add any brightness. If anything, it may remove a slight amount of treble because the pot will load the circuit slightly.

    If there is some special circuit in that tone control there is a slight possibility that the circuit removes some of the bass and mids. It will then sound like it boost the highs.

    Having that said, to me it sounds like the 5501 have the pickups adjusted slightly closer to the strings, which will give you a crisper sound and more output.

    Also, are there a difference in type/brand/age of the strings? Fresh strings always sound brighter.
  3. You can't add anything in a passive circuit unless you steal energy from other frequencies. Passive tone controls cut only.

    Tone controls are nothing more than a capacitor parallel to the signal path, with a pot to vary the resistance between the signal and capacitor. The higher the resistance, the less signal will pass through the cap. Depending on the pot values, there can be a slight increase in treble when removing a tone control from a bass, because an infinite resistance is greater than 250k/500k/etc.
  4. Means2nEnd

    Means2nEnd Supporting Member

    I have it in my Warrior yes it will add brightness even after the bass/treble/mids are 100%. It will add more and also take away more than taking treble etc.. down. It kicks arse.
  5. mmbongo

    mmbongo Dilly Dilly! Supporting Member

    Aug 5, 2009
    I think you're right Smilodon. I found this (missed it yesterday) on Audere's 'passive tone control' explanation page:

    This style of tone control can only reduce the signal level.

    I guess that sums it up! I'm kinda glad, I sure didn't want to add it :)

    I have the same strings on both basses, and actually the ones on the 4401 are newer. I'll check pickup heights more thorough, but just by eyeball they look the same.

    I'm pretty sure now there's just a difference in the basses themselves. My 5501 is newer and made in Indonesia. The 4401 is an older Korean model. They are different. For example, the saddles on my 5501 are almost all the way up, making a nice severe break angle over the bridge. My 4401 is the opposite..the saddles are all the way down and if I don't string through body there's not enough break angle. I'm even looking at exposed core strings so that I can get them a little lower since the saddles are bottomed out.
  6. mmbongo

    mmbongo Dilly Dilly! Supporting Member

    Aug 5, 2009
    See that's why I need further understanding. It's a passive tone control, but works in active mode..and it's a 100k pot.
  7. If it's 100k, that would indicate that it is not a standard tone control, as that's far too low of a resistance range for standard high impedance pickups. Sounds like there is a control of some sort working with the lowered impedance after a gain stage in the preamp circuit. Perhaps this is a treble control, and not a tone?
  8. mmbongo

    mmbongo Dilly Dilly! Supporting Member

    Aug 5, 2009
    They call it a tone control, but also call it a treble control:

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