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Bergantino and Tube amps

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by jacove, Feb 29, 2004.


  1. jacove

    jacove

    Apr 12, 2003
    Aalborg, Denmark
    Hi there,

    I'm interested in hearing if anyone have tried Bergantino cabs with an all-tube amp like Ampeg SVT or Aguilar db728. I know "Bigstring" has bad experince with using a 400+ with the HT322, but it just seem strange if a loud SVT can't work with a small cab like the HT322. I currently have the Aguilar db680/qsc 3402 and HT322 which I love, but I still think that an all-tube amp sound better and louder (even it is only rated at 300w). Also, I've just ordered a NV610 for some bigger venues, maybe this cab will solve the volume problem I've had with the HT322. What do you think?
     
  2. I've used my Eden VT-300A with a Bergi HT112 with no problem.
     
  3. I tried my Mesa 400+ with my 210 + 115 twice at fairly loud jams and some ugly, wierd sounds happened. I thought I had a blown speaker cone the first time, and checked everything out during the week and it sounded fine at low volumes, and again it was wierd at the Friday night jam.

    I've never put them together again, and they both work great in other combinations.

    Aloha,

    Jonathan
     
  4. I can just imagine my SVT on top of a Bergantino NV 610!!! :D
     
  5. You mentioned that you read my posts about the 400+ and HT series Bergs. All the above mentioned equipment is superb, but the 400+ will NOT power these cabs loudly (except the HT112 or HT112 x 2) Greybeard and Jonathan Starr's statements verify what I claim. The sealed type cabs such as the famous SVT's and the newer NV610 and NV215 will react much better to the 400+. I can't speak for any of the other "all tube amp", as the 400+ is the only one I've tried. I sold both of mine mostly because of weight. I really never tried the NV610 400+ rig on a gig, but it sure sounded WONDERFUL in my practice room. I had made up my mind I wasn't going to lug the 400+ around anymore so what was the point... I sold them, great amps though. You are probably having problems with you're 322 because of it's apprent open sound. I loved mine to death, but could not hear myself in my particular mix live. I would have to stand at least 8-10 ft. in front to really hear it, and it was not practical for me to lift the cab or tilt it. Most owners don't seem to have the problem I did so it's an individual thing. The NV610 solved this problem for me no matter which amp/rig I"m using. My Walter Woods Ultra and my Demeter 201S/QSC-PLX2402 both sound superb with my NV610 or my Mini Bergs HT/EX112. I'm set. The only thing I may do in the future is upgrade to a PLX3002 and us my 2402 in the PA system since we are liking lighter amps to schlep around. We have the MX3000a and 2000a QSC amps for the PA and they are very heavy in one case. Anyway it sounds like you have a great source for your tone and power, and will be very happy with the NV610. Choices are GOOD! :D
     
  6. GRoberts

    GRoberts Supporting Member

    Jan 7, 2003
    Tucson, AZ USA
    I would guess that is only because they didn't have a Bergiantino HT322 at the time. It is like an HT310 on steroids (over simplified generalization, but it works). The HT322 has all the clarity and punch, but with added gusto and booty in the nether regions.

    Did you prefer the Big Tube Aggie tops over any other notable Power/pre's?
     
  7. I just ordered a NV-215 to run with the 400+.

    Comments to follow...

    Aloha,

    Jonathan
     
  8. jacove

    jacove

    Apr 12, 2003
    Aalborg, Denmark
    Just want to let you know that I've spoken with Jim Bergantino regarding his cabs and tube amps. He said that all his cabs can run safely with any amp including tube-amps unless you of course clip it. He also said that he would recommend using a Crest CA9 power amp instead of a QSC...
     
  9. "Oh crap here we go" Did he say why he prefered Crest over QSC?
     
  10. jacove

    jacove

    Apr 12, 2003
    Aalborg, Denmark
    Well, he said that the Crest CA9 sounds alot warmer and fuller than the PLX amps, which he said was kinda thin-sounding....he even favored the Crest compared to tube power amps...
     
  11. metron

    metron Fluffy does not agree

    Sep 12, 2003
    Lakewood Colorado
    The Crest CA9 is just over 50 lbs. Its too heavy!
     
  12. GRoberts

    GRoberts Supporting Member

    Jan 7, 2003
    Tucson, AZ USA
    I wonder if some of the lighter weight series Crest Amps might also yield the performance that Jim likes about the CA9? Things that make you go Hmm. I agree 50 lbs is too much for steady gigging and schlepping.
     
  13. True. All Bergantino cabs sound great with everything I've tried, bare the clipping thing. My HT cabs sounded wonderful with my all tube 400+ at medium to low volumes.

    Dang...Jonathan! Let us know how you like the NV215. Please try it with you're Walter Woods and other rigs too. I'm scared to death I'm going to get one too..... :eek:

    I spoke with Jim Bergantino myself on the solid state amp issue, and I will NOT quote him, but I think what he might have been expressing (trying not to sound bias) was, SS amps with transformers (the heavier type) sound smoother and thicker than the newer-lighter H or switching rail type amps, hence the "thinner" expression. I've proven this theory to myself, by comparing my QSC MX2000A (heavy as heck) amp with my PLX-2402. The MX sounded deeper and less stressed sounding than my PLX. This was not enough to make me give up my PLX weighing only 17lbs compared to +65 lbs on my MX. I don't think I would be able to tell the difference in a live mix. Jim B. is very knowledgeable and I have complete faith in his opinion. What I stated above is what I got out of my converstation with him about amps. After talking with about what I liked and what I wanted he suggested trying the NV610 and it was just what worked for me. I wish my Financial Planner was that good....
     
  14. A CA-9? Really? My experience with those has been way less than stellar. They tend to run out of steam real quickly powering PA subs. My picks for lead-sled power amps would be the Crest 001 series, Crown Macrotech series, QSC MX series and EV P series. The CA series had fairly serious reliability issues early on, I believe they've remedied it.
     
  15. jacove

    jacove

    Apr 12, 2003
    Aalborg, Denmark
    I feel I have to point out that Jim Bergantino did not say he didn't like QSC amps, he actually said they were great, but not as full/deep sounding as the Crest and all-tube amps. And yes, Bigstring, he did also make the point about the heavier transformers. I agree that QSC are excellent amps when comparing weight/tone... ;)
     
  16. Fuzzbass

    Fuzzbass P5 with overdrive Supporting Member

    Excellent point about not telling the diff in a live mix. If I was willing to strain my back for tone I would go all the way and buy a vintage SVT to put on top of my NV610. But my Class H SVT-wannabe rack gets reasonably close to my ears, and weighs less than half of the real thing.

    Not that I'm discouraging anyone else... if you have a better spine than mine, go for it! :bassist:
     
  17. Brian Barrett

    Brian Barrett

    Nov 25, 2001
    Murfreesboro, TN (Nashville)
    Dealer LowEndBassShop.com, Builder LowEndBasses.com
    On the Crest statement from Jim, I don't think he mint anything negative towards any company. Its a personal preference and some people hear things others don't. Jim was using the QSC for a while and still, as mentioned thinks its a nice amp. About 6 months ago I sent him a Crest LT1000 series amp just to open his eyes :) This is in my opinion the best bang for the buck. Jim agreed that he felt it was a warmer and more musical sounding amp. This in no means says the QSC lacks to the Crest, but again a personal preference. The QSC is a dollar or two cheaper, so some might want to save a buck or two verse the Crest LT. The Crest LT is a medium weight amp at 30Lbs as well. Its a combination of the led sled and switching amps which leads to its tone difference. Crest does make the ST which is a full switching amp and I believe Matt Powers has one of those.


    As for the tubes, I have to say, I've had the same experience with the 400+ and Berg.
     
  18. Rockbobmel

    Rockbobmel Supporting Member

    I know this is an un educated answer but, You gotta have heavy Iron for heavy sound.
     
  19. Well, with the new NV-215 on the way from BNW, I figured I'd dust off the old 400+ and see if it was still ok, since I'd loaned it to a friend for some studio work.

    I put it on top of the HT-112/EX-112 mini stack and found it sounded rather harsh and nowhere as nice as the WW or PLX/Kern. Turning the tweeter off on the HT-112 helped a bit, but it still wasn't the sweet round tone I remember from the days I paired it with the Bag End S15 & S12.

    The NV 215 showed up just as I was leaving the office. I won't get to try it till Monday.

    Aloha,

    Jonathan