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Best Way to Monitor House Bass Sound?

Discussion in 'Amps, Mics & Pickups [DB]' started by Dave Irwin, Oct 28, 2013.


  1. I'm happy with my sound on stage, but have no way of checking the bass sound in the house.
    Any cool gadgets out there that I can use to monitor the house sound?
    I don't have anyone that can approximate a good pizz to walk out to the house.


    Thanks,
    Dave
     
  2. Ric Vice

    Ric Vice Supporting Member

    Jul 2, 2005
    Olivette, Missouri
    Dave,
    I've learned over time that you need to trust the folks running the FOH sound to do their jobs, and for the most part I've had very good luck, buy engaging them in a dialogue, when we to the sound check. While I certainly have the ability to send my onstage mix to the mains, I generally use the pre settings on my amps, line out to give the engineer the feed from my amp. Unless, the individual responsible for the mix is a total tool, you're better off not to try and use you onstage EQ for the mains. On the rare occasions that the individual running the board is an idiot, I usually, opt to have them just run the signal direct from my DPA 4099B. Recently, I've been using the Headway EDB-2 to send a blended signal FOH to the board, using the DPA-4099B and an Ehrlund EAP. Generally, I have the tech's remove the bass from any monitors that are in close proximity to me or kill the bass entirely. Basically, you want to try and isolate yourself from the FOH and Monitors as much as possible. The only thing I tend to get pissy about is extended lows coming from the subs.

    Ric
     
  3. Sounds like you get unusually good soundmen but in my case we usually run our own pa. I've just been leaving it up to fhe singer who goes out to hall and listens to the overall mix. It's fine for volume but I want to control the tone a bit more.

    Dave
     
  4. Ric Vice

    Ric Vice Supporting Member

    Jul 2, 2005
    Olivette, Missouri
    Dave,
    Yes, I am lucky that way, but sometimes I have to play Rock Clubs where the sound guy is less that up to the task.
    Having control over you tone, in your particular situation will require you to learn the parameters of whatever P.A. system you folks use. Just as a start, I'd wonder if the P.A. is even up to the task of running a DB. It takes some pretty sophisticated gear, to handle the lows coming off our instrument. As an example, I never run the bass through a small P.A., unless I'm confident, that it will handle the frequency range of the instrument, and has the tone controls required, to properly EQ it's timbre. So for example, running the bass into a set of QSC K8's without benefit of a sub, really won't work very well. I'd also recommend getting a DI, that allows you to set it's impedance load to buffer a piezo pickup. There are a several out their that aren't expensive. You wan't to make sure that you're running at least 1 Meg Ohm into the board. Just my take. Others will have solutions that work for them.

    Ric
     
  5. stonewall

    stonewall

    Jun 14, 2010
    ontario,Canada
    Wireless....
     
  6. You could make a direct recording of you playing some reference grooves, convert it to a low z signal, and run it into your DI while you walk out front and listen. You'd have to match the gain to what your di puts out normally by trial and error in advance of course.
     

  7. LOL! Or a long-ass cord.
     
  8. Ric Vice

    Ric Vice Supporting Member

    Jul 2, 2005
    Olivette, Missouri
    This might work since you're a DIY sound engineer, it's a possibility. There are differences in a recorded signal though, since the sample is coming of a discreet source, that can't feedback. As mentioned by Wig Hat, you'd still have to account a particular EQ at different volume levels. Ultimately it's good to know the parameters of the P.A. and have someone else play a few notes on the bass, while you go out and take a listen. Not ideal mind you, but at least your ears are deciding the mix.

    Not certain that would work since you're putting a Double Bass in front of the mains, to do the test. There's just to many possibilities for feedback. Bass Guitar is a different story under these conditions. Plus wireless rigs on DB tend to be not very common.

    Ric
     
  9. 20db pad

    20db pad

    Feb 11, 2003
    I been everywhere, man...
    None. At all.
    Once in a while I will see guys using a loop pedal to record a phrase and the let it run on repeat while they walk offstage and go around the room to see how it sounds. It's essentially a stand-in of your playing, and goes through your amp, mic, DI, and other gear before it terminates to the house feed. Haven't seen a DB player do this yet, but it seems to work well for this purpose.
     
  10. Good idea with the loop pedal. Play in a few turnarounds or a vamp. If the drummer can sync to the recording this would work nicely.
     
  11. Ric Vice

    Ric Vice Supporting Member

    Jul 2, 2005
    Olivette, Missouri
    I think you're on to something here. With a actual, loop of the instrument, running into the entire signal chain, it's about as close one can get to the actual sound coming off one's instrument. Nice idea. I'm going to try this, eventually.

    Ric
     
  12. The loop pedal is a cool idea. I'll look around for one.

    Thx
    Dave
     
  13. Michael Eisenman

    Michael Eisenman Supporting Member

    Jun 21, 2006
    Eugene, Oregon
    I'd bet there's an app for that, too.
     
  14. Phil Smith

    Phil Smith Mr Sumisu 2 U

    May 30, 2000
    Peoples Republic of Brooklyn
    Creator of: iGigBook for Android/iOS
  15. geoffbassist

    geoffbassist UK Double Bassist Supporting Member Commercial User

    Jul 17, 2006
    UK
    Founder - Discover Double Bass
    I take Rics approach of trying to talk about it with the sound guys... but ultimately I just have to hope that they know what they are doing and try not to let it distract me from the performance. I wish it wasn't such a gamble each time :)
     
  16. geoffbassist

    geoffbassist UK Double Bassist Supporting Member Commercial User

    Jul 17, 2006
    UK
    Founder - Discover Double Bass
    I take Ric's approach of trying to talk about it with the sound guys... but ultimately I just have to hope that they know what they are doing and try not to let it distract me from the performance. I wish it wasn't such a gamble each time, but there are some great sound engineers out there. I just wish there were more :)
     
  17. It didn't and I'm going to explore the digital recorder route since the dry signal from my should be consistant


     
  18. Except that depending on the size of the room, "the sound" is a composite of stage + reinforcement (PA). The smaller the room, the more the board feed becomes a "negative" of what's coming off stage. i.e.: "No guitar" or "thin guitar" on the board feed means it was unnecessary to put any guitar amp in the PA because it was already plenty loud coming from backline. "Thin" is what the bleed through all the other open mics on stage sounds like. Similarly, the "bass tone" in the board feed may well be mostly what wasn't coming from stage, to augment what was.
     

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