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Bille (Italian) fingering?

Discussion in 'Jazz Technique [DB]' started by robobass, Jun 22, 2008.

  1. Jun 22, 2008 #1
    robobass

    robobass

    Aug 1, 2005
    Cologne, Germany
    Private Inventor - Bass Capos
    I'm cross-posting this also to "Orchestral Technique"
    My question is: Does anyone anywhere still use the 1-3-4 fingering system? A new student came to me today who had learned this way. He said he got it from a reputable jazz teacher but who was mainly a slab-basser. I told him that this system died out like 50+ years ago, and his former teacher was likely self taught from Bille books. I have never, ever seen this system in use, and personally find it quite inferior to Simandl. Am I wrong? Do people still play this way?
    Robobass
     
  2. Jun 22, 2008 #2
    jisbass

    jisbass

    May 13, 2005
    Queens, NY
    I believe Marco Panascia plays this way. I think he first learned DB in Italy.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4Hx0VfUbTw

    I don't know much but I think many Italian players still use this method. I don't think it's inferior to any other method. Just different.
     
  3. Jun 23, 2008 #3
    jsbarber

    jsbarber

    Jun 7, 2005
    San Diego
  4. Jun 23, 2008 #4
    damonsmith

    damonsmith

    May 10, 2006
    Saint Louis, MO
    I played a lot of the Billie Etudes 134 for a week or so. The intonation can be more stable but it is not quite as solid.
     
  5. Jun 24, 2008 #5
    robobass

    robobass

    Aug 1, 2005
    Cologne, Germany
    Private Inventor - Bass Capos
    Wow! That's very cool. Well, I guess 1-3-4 is alive and well.
    I stand corrected.
    Robobass
     
  6. Jun 24, 2008 #6
    robobass

    robobass

    Aug 1, 2005
    Cologne, Germany
    Private Inventor - Bass Capos
    He really slips seamlessly between 1-3-4 and 1-2-3-4, doesn't he? I'm feeling very old and reactionary right now. Everyone leave me alone!
    Robobass
     
  7. Jun 24, 2008 #7
    Barcza

    Barcza

    May 1, 2005
    Budapest
    In Italy this is the common method, I only saw Ron McLure play jazz with this fingering. I never undertsand why is it good, becouse anatomically absolutely not reasonable. Even so there are very good players play this way.
     
  8. Jun 24, 2008 #8
    nathanmcnathan

    nathanmcnathan Inactive

    Jan 25, 2008
    Barrie, Ontario
    I love 1-3-4... it feels no natural, and it lets you move quickly
     
  9. Jun 24, 2008 #9
    damonsmith

    damonsmith

    May 10, 2006
    Saint Louis, MO
    Not in my experience. In my experience you actually trade facility for slightly better intonation in the lower positions.
    Still, it is a legit system used by a lot of players.
     
  10. Jun 24, 2008 #10
    nathanmcnathan

    nathanmcnathan Inactive

    Jan 25, 2008
    Barrie, Ontario
    I think I might do this differently, but I use 1, 2&3, and either 4 by itself or 1&4 together for fingering in lower positions. I find it really comfortable, it just seems that the 3rd and 4th fingers naturally move together for me.
     
  11. Jun 25, 2008 #11
    tito mangialajo

    tito mangialajo

    Feb 1, 2006
    ciao, I'm italian and I've studied 20 years ago with a good teacher the Billè method (1-3-4). I've never had problem with this fingering but during the years I've studied by myself 1-2-4 and 1-2-3-4.
    now I choose the fingering depending of what I have to play and of what I feel in the moment.
    I think i'ts better to have more options.
     
  12. Jul 8, 2008 #12
    valeresperanza

    valeresperanza

    Mar 9, 2006
    I think both 1-2-4 and 1-3-4 are valid. It's down to personal preference.
    I personally use 1-3-4, up to the D on the G string, and then use 4 finger fingering (D/Eb/E/F with 1-2-3-4).
    I started play URB when in Italy, but the teacher at the time gave me the 2 options.
    Before I played URB, when playing 3 notes per string major scales on electric, I would use 1-3-4 (Despite another bass player telling me it's not proper technique and that if I was playing upright I would use 1-2-4!)
    A good selling point for the 1-3-4 fingering is that the exercises in the Bille method are by far more musical than Simandl ones.