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Blown Speaker?? Genz Content

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by JimiLL, May 10, 2010.


  1. Rig in question is GBE 1200 with GB 610XB2

    Bought the cabinet used off a fellow on here a month or so ago... worked great up until tonight.

    Little bit into practice I noticed I got what seemed like breakup on the low end of the notes I was playing. Seemed like a rattle, maybe like the speaker was rattling around in the enclosure.

    Listened to all the speakers individualy.... nothing seemd out of the ordinary. No unusual speaker movement...

    What really makes me scratch my head is I used to have a Hartke 4x10 that I powered with the GBE for a while and the same thing happened. Cab handled head ok when they were newly mated (keeping volume in check),, but after a while I was getting the same bottom end fuzz/breakup/distortion as tonight.

    Head is "braked" down to 750 watts, gain and volumes on pre at or before 12:00, master at 9:00, no massive eq settings.

    Could the head be frying speakers?

    Thanks
     
  2. Rick Auricchio

    Rick Auricchio Registered Bass Offender

    What do you mean "braked down to 750 watts?" And how do you know it's only 750w?

    Also, the gain and master controls have no bearing whatsoever on power output. All they do is set the required input to get full power. With a hot enough input, you can get full power with the master just open a little bit. So don't use knob positions as a guide.

    Sounds like you're blowing speakers by driving them too hard. You can also tear up the cones with too much bass boost, way below any power spec the speaker has.
     
  3. Well its set in the 2 ohm configuration at a 4 ohm load... its been said on here that puts it down to 750 watts.....

    I never had any input or output led warnings..... none of the eq settings are past 2:00

    Active input selected, spector Euro 5 with 18v EMG pre

    I know "I Play Metal" on here uses MUCH crazier settings than me....

    Also the rig started the night sounding fine.... and all im keeping up with is two 1x12 guitar combos... so I cant be playing that loud.....
     
  4. Could someone tell me how to go about figuring out which speaker is blown??

    I cant believe Im saying this the freakin amp was cold as a stone.... dont know how it blew a 900watt cab. There were no signs or smells of smoke, amp wasnt making any audible displeasure.... everything sounded great!!

    Actually now after looking at a few different threads....

    Would it be possible I cooked the speaker cable?? Its a speakon to 1/4, and I have in weeks past I have tested the SPL of this rig... running ata full 1,000 watts. And no, I wasnt abusing the amp at this point. I still have yet to feel any heat build inside its chassis

    Also, I read about amps putting out DC voltage.... and i DID notice that it seemed as though when I was playing I really couldnt see the speakers moving at all..... signs of DC power??

    Please help guys... this is my dream rig now my dream isnt so nice anymore :(
     
  5. Thornton Davis

    Thornton Davis

    Dec 11, 1999
    Toronto
    I used this same setup for a few years and never had any problems with it. It was a great rig.

    You can set the GBE1200's OHM setting to either 2-4-8 OHMs by adjusting the OHM setting switch and the Powerflex switch on the back of the amp. Only engage the Powerflex switch if you're using a 2 OHM load!

    Your GB610T-XB2 is rated at 900 watts and should have a 4 OHM rating. Set your GBE1200 to output 4 OHMs (1000 watts) and you won't have any problems.

    If you continue to experience this problem, pm Andy or Roger (agedhorse and hasbeen) at G-B.

    Good luck.

    TD
     
  6. Ukiah Bass

    Ukiah Bass

    May 10, 2006
    This problem happened to me with two NeoX-112T cabs. It was caused by the internal wire (connecting the crossover with the woofer) touching the woofer surface. In both cases, the assembly person at Genz failed to tie back the wire to prevent woofer contact. The buzz disappeared when I tied back the wire with a twistie.
     
  7. Rick Auricchio

    Rick Auricchio Registered Bass Offender

    And that has no relation to your situation, unless he is using the exact same equipment, at the same settings, with the same playing technique.

    It's like saying "Fred drives the same amount as I do...why did I get a flat tire and he didn't?"

    The amp isn't heating up, but the speakers probably are.

    You can still cause mechanical damage to a speaker by overextending its cone, well below any max-power rating. So the speaker's thermal-power rating doesn't help you at all here. If you've got enough bass going to the speaker, it'll fart out and be damaged.

    Another analogy: It's like having a VW and complaining you got a speeding ticket when the guy in the Corvette didn't. Horsepower doesn't control your speed. Just as a speaker's power rating doesn't guarantee it will take everything you feed it---even below its max wattage rating.
     
  8. Actually this is incorrect. If you read the owners manual you may engage the Powerflex switch with a 4 ohm load, which will "brake down" the output to around 750 watts.

    Now I appreciate everyones responces, but in reality I know when a speaker is getting pushed to far... im not a noob. And I said there was no massive eq.... so running too much bass also isnt a problem of mine.

    Ive had lots of rigs before and I know how to eq properly so I really doubt its user error.

    And another thing i must stress is IT WASNT TURNED UP LOUD!!!!!!!!!! Take this statement LITERALLY!!!!!! And I HAD NO CRAZy EQ SETTINGS!!!! I was playing along with two 1x12 guitar combos..... I could put my freakin ear right up against the grill of the cab and not feel any discomfort. OVERPOWERING IS NOT AN ISSUE!!!
     
  9. agedhorse

    agedhorse Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 12, 2006
    Davis, CA (USA)
    Development Engineer-Mesa, Product Support-Genz Benz
    Let's look at a little logical troubleshooting before making all kinds of potentially erroneous assumptions...

    The speaker was bought used so we do not know what the speaker might have been driven with in it's past life. It's possible that it was driven with a big pro audiio power amp bridged at 4 ohms in the never-ending quest that some folks have looking for "headroom" and mechanical damage resulted. Have you tested the speaker with another head to rule this out?

    Speakers can sound "blown" for a variety of reasons, some of which have nothing to do with a blown speaker. Something as simple as a wire touching a speaker cone from the back, I just saw a "blown speaker" where a piece of clipped off guitar string was inside the cabinet with the end stuck in the spider, etc. A loose driver, grille or handle screw is another possibility. Check outthe simple things FIRST.

    It's also possible that there is a problem with the amp, again we do not know it's complete history so some troubleshooting is in order here as well. One thing to check, and this applies to all amps by all manufacturers that use serial (or series) effects loops, it to be sure the internal loop bypass switch contacts are not hung up. This can be caused by dirt and dust, humidity, corrosive environment (coastal areas), and spider webs... seems like those little holes attract spiders and they deposit silk web inside and it interrupts the switching. I see this maybe a couple times a year, the last time was on a pro audio mixer's channel insert points. Try bypassing each loop with a shielded 1/4" jumper. Generally all that's required is to cycle the return jack a few times and it's good to go.

    If you have the original sales receipt and it's less than 3 years from date of original purchase, your gear is still under our 3 year transferrable warranty so give Scott a call at the factory and he will get you squared away. you can also PM me with any questions.
     
  10. I havent had a chance to try it with another amp... I will be doing that tomorrow. Also need to look into the grill and I thought of the speaker coming loose already. Someone else even said it may be the speaker wire rattling around inside. I have to take a closer look.

    The former owner is a member on here and he ran the cab with a G-K 700RB

    Any chance this amp is putting out DC power??
     
  11. Rick Auricchio

    Rick Auricchio Registered Bass Offender

    TB membership doesn't rule out unintentional abuse.

    If the cones move in or out when powering up the amp (and they stay in that position), then you've got DC. This isn't a foolproof test, however.
     

  12. TB membership doesn't rule out unintentional abuse.

    Never said it did. Previous post commented that he may have been using a huge PA amp to run cab. He was not.
     
  13. Rick Auricchio

    Rick Auricchio Registered Bass Offender

    OK, it's just taking a while to get all the answers as the questions get asked. (Your answers to EQ and loudness seemed angry. We don't know anything till you tell us, so keep it relaxed. We don't know your settings, level of experience, etc.)

    The best thing for now is to try the cab with another head, and the head with another cab.
     
  14. In some of my first posts I said what all my gain and eq was set at... i just get a little preturbed when when people say it my eq and such when I already made light in a previous post of this subject.

    Sorry for coming off harsh

    Its just this is really bothering me. For a long time it was great and then one second, I noticed a change in tone. And I definitely wasnt hammering on it; my gui**** has no problem letting me know when im invading his space :)
     
  15. Rick Auricchio

    Rick Auricchio Registered Bass Offender

    First, try the five-minute job of cleaning the head's FX send/return jacks. Just run any 1/4" plug in and out of the jacks a few times. To do a really thorough job, spritz a little contact cleaner on the plug first (but don't spray any into the jack).

    Because of the sudden onset of the problem, it seems unlikely that it's a wire touching the cone, but it could have moved just a fraction of an inch during transport. That's not hard to check, but it'll take some time to do it.

    Is your bass active? If so, there's the obvious suggestion to change the battery. Has to be asked...
     
  16. Yeah its a Euro 5er..... It runs 18V EMG Pre... changed both batteries out about a month ago. I never leave the bass plugged in for long, except at practice... once a week, for about 3-4 hours.

    Ill go give it the old tounge check
     
  17. korngold

    korngold Supporting Member

    Nov 10, 2006
    Iowa
    This is what I was thinking. I read a thread about someone with a Kustom 1200 watt amp doing the exact same thing to multiple cabs, and it turned out that it was supplying DC voltage to the speakers.

    I'm not sure how to test for this, but if you have an amp tech nearby, they should be able to do it. Unfortunately, it won't save the speakers...
     
  18. agedhorse

    agedhorse Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 12, 2006
    Davis, CA (USA)
    Development Engineer-Mesa, Product Support-Genz Benz
    An amp failing DC is a catastrophic event, and most amps have DC offset protection (ours do anyway) so I think this is an unlikely cause.
     
  19. korngold

    korngold Supporting Member

    Nov 10, 2006
    Iowa
    Have you tried a new speaker cable? Just to confirm--you are using a speaker cable, correct? Also, is it a 1/4" cable or speakon? Maybe the contacts in the speaker jack (head or cab) are not connecting 100%?
     
  20. No but Im going to do this as well. Im using a speakon to 1/4 speaker wire going from the head to the cab.
     

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