building 1x12 - internal bracing ?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by ZolkoW, Jun 30, 2008.

  1. ZolkoW

    ZolkoW

    May 8, 2006
    Hungary, EU
    Hi!

    I'm about to finish my 1x12 box.
    in such a small cabinet, is it neccessary to make some bracing inside?
    it's outer dimensions: ~20"W x 14"H x 16"D
    3/4" plywood, going to accept a Deltalite 2512.

    thanks in advance!
    12.jpg
     
  2. billfitzmaurice

    billfitzmaurice Commercial User

    Sep 15, 2004
    New Hampshire
    Owner, Bill Fitzmaurice Loudspeaker Design
    Yes. Too late now, but for future reference well braced 1/2" plywood construction works better and is lighter in weight.
     
  3. Really? With 3/4" and that small of a cab, I wouldn't have bothered with bracing either.
     
  4. ZolkoW

    ZolkoW

    May 8, 2006
    Hungary, EU
    I can still add some bracing.. but for me, 1/2" seems to be too "light". but this is my first plywood cabinet..
     
  5. billfitzmaurice

    billfitzmaurice Commercial User

    Sep 15, 2004
    New Hampshire
    Owner, Bill Fitzmaurice Loudspeaker Design
    Even 3/4" doesn't take much pressure to flex. The hi-fi guys routinely build cabs of that size with two layers of 3/4" MDF, and they don't come remotely close to the levels that we do, but they don't have to move them either. OTOH 1/2" plywood braced to a maximum free span of 8" doesn't flex. With 3/4" I wouldn't run more than 12" free span.
     
  6. How much? How do you test this? :confused:
    I'm not arguing, but genuinely curious because I would like to test my boxes. I'm thinking that a 250w bass cab won't see more than 60-70w at the cab's resonant freq which wouldn't be that much pressure, or am I wrong?
     
  7. qts

    qts

    May 15, 2006
    Ijmuiden-holland
    I did not use bracing either, and no problem with the sound.
    OTOH, i will never know how it'll sound with bracing.

    DSC01787.gif
     
  8. billfitzmaurice

    billfitzmaurice Commercial User

    Sep 15, 2004
    New Hampshire
    Owner, Bill Fitzmaurice Loudspeaker Design
    Play a low E at normal stage volume with your hand in front of the port.
    It's not so much a matter of hearing vibration as the energy loss that occurs when panels flex. Energy that's expended flexing the cab walls is energy that doesn't end up in the room as sound. With the very low electrical to acoustical energy transform efficiency of loudspeakers wasting any watts to cab flex can make a significant difference in your sound.
     
  9. 3506string

    3506string

    Nov 18, 2004
    Lawton, OK
    Is Braced 1/2" really good to use I've been using 3/4 thinking that it was the bare minimum. What type of bracing is recommended
     
  10. CrackBass

    CrackBass

    Aug 10, 2004
    huntsville,AL
    my 112's are 1/2" braced. they weigh about 35 pounds a piece for a 2.25 net cf cab. (finished) not too shabby. a tip for 1/2" construction. line the braces up with the handle cuts so you have some extra meat to screw your handles into, and also put a front to back baffle brace next to your speaker hole between the ports/tweeter/midrange...

    good luck.
     
  11. ZolkoW

    ZolkoW

    May 8, 2006
    Hungary, EU
    yesterday I glued two rods to the back of the cabinet, to test, how this bracing thing works.. they are aligned vertical, next to the connector/control panel cutout. I tested it only by knockin on it :) (before and after)
    well, I don't know, how this would affect the overall sound, but it sounded much more rigid, had a higher pitch, and lower amplitude sound while knocking on it.
    I'm going to do that for the other panels, too, and make some connection between the opposite walls. I feel that it can't be wrong /okay, maybe it CAN, but I hope, it turns out good/

    my 210 (EBS) has a slightly bigger box, but has no bracing at all :-S
    It sounds wonderful, but maybe it could be even better.
     
  12. Looks good.
    Why did you not want to put a tweeter in?
     
  13. ZolkoW

    ZolkoW

    May 8, 2006
    Hungary, EU
    (was the question addressed to me?)
    Mine has a tweeter, but only yesterday got it to it's place..
     
  14. billfitzmaurice

    billfitzmaurice Commercial User

    Sep 15, 2004
    New Hampshire
    Owner, Bill Fitzmaurice Loudspeaker Design
    That's the classic 'Knuckle Test'. When you rap your knuckles on a cab the sound should be a high pitched whack, not a low pitched thump as with a drum. The sound in the middle of the panel should not be all that much different than that at the edge. If it is the panels are too flexible, and you are losing tone and power. The vast majority of cabinets will fail the knuckle test.
     
  15. So I decided I would do a little testing with the 1x12 cab I've been building. To test each panel I positioned that side face up and placed a penny in the middle of the panel. Then I played a loud E through the cab. Sure enough, the back panel, which measures 18x23 and is the only side bigger than 12" in both dimentions, buzzed the penny around. I'll be adding some bracing on that and the front baffle and also trying the "knuckle test."
     
    downlowuponit likes this.
  16. 3506string

    3506string

    Nov 18, 2004
    Lawton, OK
    Would you lose anything going from a 3/4" to a well braced 1/2" cabinet. In my mind it seems like the thicker wood would help the sound, not sure why though. I am about to build and 1/2 would save me some dough.
     
  17. Cool. Love to see some progress shots.

    I've been thinking about building one of these but got very confused when it came to selecting a tweeter. What are you using? .. and how did you calculate the crossover?
     
  18. billfitzmaurice

    billfitzmaurice Commercial User

    Sep 15, 2004
    New Hampshire
    Owner, Bill Fitzmaurice Loudspeaker Design
    Only a lot of weight.
     
  19. ZolkoW

    ZolkoW

    May 8, 2006
    Hungary, EU
    mine is 12kg (~25pounds?) without the speakers, and stuffing.
    not very light, but not heavy, too. And for me, external volume is always a bigger issue than weight, as we don't have much room in the car.

    thanks for the replies, anyway!
     
  20. ZolkoW

    ZolkoW

    May 8, 2006
    Hungary, EU

    I choose the easy way :)
    I use the same as in my EBS (Selenium super tweeter, 2", 8 ohms), and the crossover (12db/oct high pass for the tweeter at about 4-5000Hz ) is the same. I didn't calculate, just tried to find out the frequency, but none of the methods (Linkwitz, bessel, etc) gave the same component values.
    maybe it's an empirical value, or maybe it's because of the L-pad.

    I would love to try some mid-driver, but I couldn't find one with enough efficiency, and power handling to match the woofer.