Building a 22 fret neck 20 fret body.

Discussion in 'Hardware, Setup & Repair [BG]' started by Bobdobalina, Jan 17, 2009.

  1. Bobdobalina

    Bobdobalina Guest

    Jan 17, 2009
    :help:
    Well, I would like to introduce myself, as this is my first post. "I am an idiot!" (But that is mostly because I am a guitarist and not a bassist.)

    I just picked up at 22 fret(less) J-Bass neck off E-bay. I simultaneously ordered a J-bass body from Warmoth, which I had a custom hole drilled in, so it is non-returnable. 34" scale body...but with this neck--35.5" scale. You get the picture...

    Should I:

    1. lengthen the neck pocket to shorten the scale, leaving the bridge and pickup routes in the proper position.

    2. attach the neck as is and move the bridge to create the proper scale length, and install the pickups in the current routes.

    3. Attach the neck as is and move the bridge, while also making new routes in my brand new one piece body and pickguard. :(

    4. install the neck from my MIM P-Bass and destroy that body instead until I can afford another neck for the J.

    5. other options?

    The neck is from a 97 American Deluxe J Bass. Obviously the body is already routed and drilled for the bridge.
     
  2. slyjoe

    slyjoe Supporting Member

    Jun 28, 2008
    Valley of the Sun (AZ)
    If it's from a Fender, it is a 34" scale. Deluxe jazz bodies are smaller than regular bodies, because of the longer neck, but the scale is the same.

    Your best option is #1 in my opinion. Lengthening the pocket won't change the scale. The problem you will run into is the neck holes probably won't line up properly with the body. Best bet may be to glue in dowels and redrill the neck.

    If the Warmoth body is drilled standard for a Fender neck, the other issue is that (at least the current) Deluxes have 5 mounting screws, not 4 that Warmoth usually drills for. So it looks like you will have some work to do to put this neck on the body.
     
  3. Bobdobalina

    Bobdobalina Guest

    Jan 17, 2009
    Thanks for the reply. Now that I think of it. I think it is a Jazz Plus neck. Serial number says 1997 (so it isn't a boner bass neck), and it is made in USA....Oh, and it has four mounting holes not five.


    At any rate, the neck is 1.5" longer than a regular 20 fret neck from nut to bridge, so that does means the scale is not the same. It would only be 34" scale if the nut or bridge moved closer to the center of the neck. Unless I move the bridge closer to the nut or the nut closer to the bridge, the scale will be 35.5"
    After thinking about it over night, I am thinking of buying a 20 fret neck from Allparts, and then either putting the 22 fret neck up on ebay or getting another body for that one that is drilled and routed properly in order to make it a 34" scale. Any more suggestions are gladly accepted. Thanks.
     
  4. slyjoe

    slyjoe Supporting Member

    Jun 28, 2008
    Valley of the Sun (AZ)
    The length of the neck has nothing to do with it. The scale length is (roughly) 2 times the distance from the nut to the 12th fret. This is fixed. This distance will be the same on 20, 22, or 24 fret necks, even though the neck itself is longer.

    The fact that your body doesn't have a neck pocket that allows for the longer neck doesn't change the scale. If you put a longer neck on your body, the open strings are longer, but the frets (or markers) are not in the right position.

    Does the fretboard extend over the heel end of the neck? That is how Warmoth necks with more than 20 frets are made. That way, they fit standard bodies. If so, you don't have a problem.

    That is another option - hope it works out :). It should only take a rout of the neck pocket, but I don't know if Warmoth does this any more.
     
  5. Bobdobalina

    Bobdobalina Guest

    Jan 17, 2009
    It is a fender neck, not a warmoth neck. The fretboard does not extend out over the body. The neck is actually 1.5" longer. If I set it on top of my standard Pbass, and line up the two necks at the neck pocket, the nut on the 22 fret neck extends an extra 1.5 inches past the P bass neck.

    I hate to argue about scale, but I will: on a 34" scale bass, the 12th fret is 17". But if a longer neck is put on (and the neck pocket is not altered and the bridge is not moved), then the point of measurement moves. It is still half the distance, but it no longer lines up with the 12th fret marker. The twelfth fret then has to be moved to 17.75". A fret or a marker is an arbitrary mark. Scale is measure from nut to bridge or half that distance times two. Fret 12 on a normal bass would be half the length of the string measured from nut to bridge, but since this neck is longer and the body's neck pocket and bridge are set up for a shorter 20 fret neck the scale is 35.5" Since it is fretless, it doesn't matter of course, except the lines on the board will be in the wrong place.

    Anyway, I am going to put it up on ebay and buy a standard neck from Allparts.
     
  6. slyjoe

    slyjoe Supporting Member

    Jun 28, 2008
    Valley of the Sun (AZ)
    I think we both understand, just coming at it from different directions.

    Can you determine the scale of a neck without the body? Yes, it is nut to 12th fret distance times two. As you said, putting it on the wrong body will lengthen the scale, but all the markers/frets are in the wrong place. The markers/frets aren't arbitrary; they define the scale for that neck.

    I think I was looking at the scale of the neck, not the scale of the bass. Hopefully, you will get them to match. :)
     
  7. flyboy909

    flyboy909 Guest

    Feb 7, 2009
    I think I might be too late for this.... but I'd be interested in buying that 22 fret deluxe jazz neck from you.

    Let me know if you still have it.
     
  8. Bobdobalina

    Bobdobalina Guest

    Jan 17, 2009
    I still have it...I was just now trying to decide if I want to keep it or not. I will meditate on it and let you know. I am considering fretting it myself and putting it in my MIM P-Bass.
     
  9. SpamBot

    SpamBot Guest

    Dec 25, 2008
    St. Paul, MN
    Uh, btw, if the neck fits in the pocket it will work fine. It's fretLESS. Scale length really doesn't matter here, you just won't be able to use side dots for reference.
     
  10. flyboy909

    flyboy909 Guest

    Feb 7, 2009
    Ok, let me know. I bought a 97 Deluxe new, and always had problems adjusting the truss rod. Finally took it to a luthier who said the truss rod nut must have been cross threaded at the factory. He said he got it off but could not get it back on. So either I do surgery on the truss rod pocket or I get a new neck.
     
  11. Bobdobalina

    Bobdobalina Guest

    Jan 17, 2009
    Back on the auction block:

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270343109480
     
  12. Bobdobalina

    Bobdobalina Guest

    Jan 17, 2009

    It will "work" fine, but the pickups will be in the wrong place (more to the treble side) relative to the new scale length so they will sound like poopoo. Not to mention it has fret markers on the board which would be annoying if they were in the wrong place.
     
  13. ehque

    ehque

    Jan 8, 2006
    Singapore
    There's no real "sweet spot" for pickups anyway. The difference in sound from having a 35.5" scale will be much bigger than the difference in the small relative change in the picup locations.

    I would stick with the 35.5" bass. It could be fun. The markers could easily be drilled out with a small drill (the thumbscrew style ones) and filled with similarly coloured (to the neck) putty, and new markers made.
     
  14. Bobdobalina

    Bobdobalina Guest

    Jan 17, 2009
    I will have to beg to differ on the pickup placement issue . There would be a much larger difference than that between the '60s and '70s J-Bass bridge pickup placement, which is only .4" And most people agree there is a difference in sound there.

    A 35.5" scale would be fun, but it would need to be drop tuned due to the increase in string tension, and a dropped fretless is not really on my list. I bought a new fretless neck for the J-bass I was building (this project) and I don't really need two fretless basses when I only have two basses to begin with.
    As far as the fretboard...like I told the other person there are fret markers (lines) for every fret, not just position markers. It would be a huge hastle to remove, fill, color match and level.
    Plus, it would be easier to fret the neck than it would be to remove the fret markers and fill them in. Like I said, I might end up doing that if it doesn't sell and throw it on my p-bass. It might look cool to have the fret markers inbetween the new frets too. It would look random and strange.
     
  15. ehque

    ehque

    Jan 8, 2006
    Singapore
    I won't argue that there will be a difference in sound, just that it would be nigh hard to detect on its own or in a band mix. Also, i'm trying to say that the new placement wouldn't necessarily sound bad even if it was different.

    Different strokes, i guess. I would get another neck for that warmoth body if i were you then.
     
  16. Bobdobalina

    Bobdobalina Guest

    Jan 17, 2009
    Thanks, yes I have already. I bought an Allparts neck, and it is heavier and not anywhere as nice as the Fender, but oh well. Cheers.