Checking out 2x10’s. Acme B2 vs TC K210 vs Genz GB210-T

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Heavy Blue, Jul 22, 2020.

  1. Heavy Blue

    Heavy Blue

    Nov 11, 2017
    Prairie Canada
    Been checking around for a 210. Found these about and was wondering what you guys would pick.

    The Acme B2 (Series II) doesn’t have the stock drivers anymore and now has a pair of Legend BP102’s wired for a 4 ohm load. He’s asking Cdn$350.

    The TC is stock and is asking C$400. Apparently it’s very light.

    The GB is the bargain of the bunch at $225 but I know nothing about it.

    I’m kind of leaning towards the ACME cause the price seems decent, my trucker friend is in that part of the country for pickup atm, and I’ve never used a cab with that kind of deep bass extension before and I always wanted to try one out. Does the driver swap screw things up though. Iirc, BP102’s have little high end but I could be mistaken. Are the stock drivers still available?

    What say ye?
  2. Popps


    Nov 26, 2009
    Proper replacement drivers for the Acme are custom OEM and only available from Acme.
    That said, I use the Acme 2x10 and it is fantastic. It does require a lot of power, 400-500
    watts. I doubt you hear the box as designed with replacement speakers.
  3. abarson


    Nov 6, 2003
    Santa Cruz
    Even though the BP102's are likely in the ballpark, an Acme B2 without Andy's custom speakers isn't going to sound very good, in my estimation. I'd also worry that the crossover was for the 8 ohms version and may not play nice with the 4 ohms load it has now. He's asking way too much money for a compromised box: I got mine for $250USD. Maybe the Canadian market is different.
    A real Acme B2 is a wondrous 3-way full spectrum product with amazing low end. You can still get the speakers from Acme, but I doubt he'd take the BP102s as trade-in.

    There were a few generations of GB210T: original, -XB, -XB2, -XB3, UB.
    The original was rear ported while all the -XB variations were front ported. The original, XB and XB2 had round ports while the XB3 and UB are slot ported. All are considered to be very good sounding with solid low extension. They are also considered to be a bit on the large and heavy side. The UB had neodymium speakers and is the lightest of the bunch. The asking price is reasonable for any of the XB versions, slightly high for the original, and a "pounce now" bargain if it's a UB.

    I've only played the TC K212 and not the K210. It is very light and sounded very good, but was just missing that "something" that would make me want it. It's hard for me to say if that's a good asking price.
  4. When the original speakers a cab was designed for are swapped (regardless of the new ones performance) it becomes just a box with said manufactures name on it.

    That Acme Low B2 is now just a box that Acme made, NOT an Acme Low B2 cab.
  5. Bent77


    Mar 6, 2013
    Desert, Colorado
    I’ve never met a Genz cab I didn’t like. To me they are fairly transparent

    Only tried a few TC units, didn’t care for them
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  6. Heavy Blue

    Heavy Blue

    Nov 11, 2017
    Prairie Canada
    Thank you for your experience with the B2. My biggest amp is 400 watts at 4 ohms. I’ll contact Acme about getting replacement drivers.

    Good point re the crossover. I never considered that because I do like the idea of having it 4 ohm to draw max power out of my 400w amp. I’ll contact Acme for a solution.

    Thanks for the detailed Genz info. It is rear ported and thus an original.

    Re the TC and “missing” something. That seems to be a TC thing to me. Kind of sterile/generic sounding imo.
    Yep, it’s most of a tuned system. I’m going to contact ACME about getting replacement drivers. I hope he’s quick to respond. I have a rather small window of opportunity on this one as it is 2,000 miles east of here but a trucker friend of mine is in the neighbourhood till tonight or tomorrow.
    S-Bigbottom likes this.
  7. Heavy Blue

    Heavy Blue

    Nov 11, 2017
    Prairie Canada
    I concur. Genz stuff is great.:thumbsup:
    Bassdirty and Bent77 like this.
  8. abarson


    Nov 6, 2003
    Santa Cruz
    My amp is a G-B Shuttle 6.2 and powers my Acme B2 nicely. It is 4 ohms and I wish it was 8 ohms so that I could add another cabinet. The single cabinet has been adequate for all indoor gigs so far, and was okay for a few outdoor shows, but it was way too lonesome for a couple of outdoor gigs I've had.
    It's either that or I get a 2 ohms capable amp.
    Heavy Blue likes this.
  9. Rip Van Dan

    Rip Van Dan DNA Endorsing Artist Supporting Member

    Feb 2, 2009
    Duvall, WA
    I'd be very careful about a cab with different drivers in it. You really need to play it and hear it to make that call. Problem is that the cabs are typically designed around the drivers and even a much higher power handling drive can blow with a lot less than it handles if the air and air movement in the cab isn't correct. It really is buying a pig-in-a-poke. If all the Thiele-Small specs line up as well as the original speakers, it could sound great. If they don't, it could sound like crap and the speakers might blow out easily.

    I would love to recommend a DNS-210 cab by DNA to you because I have one and it is amazing. Simply the best 210. I also have a DNS-410 cab, which I thought was going to be my last cab. But it scared small club owners who would then force me to use their backline. I bought the 410 in 2015 and just last year got into DNA's Endorsing Artist group. So I went ahead and bought the DNS-210. It's the only cab I use now for all indoor venues. I use my DNS-410 for outdoor venues and festivals. The 210 will handle 700-watts rms both mechanically and thermally and will produce a maximum SPL of 134db. It's a very sensitive and LOUD cab, but is super clear and articulate. My 800 watt amp could drive it to that max SPL, but I never run the master on my 800-watt amp above 10 o'clock when I'm using it because it's just too loud.

    Disadvantage is this is an expensive cab and is probably out of your budget range by a fair amount. Street price runs from $849 up to ~$949. If you can find one used, they typically run around $600. Saw one on Reverb once for $449. If you can get one in that range grab it. I truly believe there's not a better one made.

    If that's way out budget for you though, see if you can find an Eden EX210. Street price is ~$449 new and they have a great sound. Also look at old Eden D210XLT and D210XST cabs. You can often find them on sale used for ~$500. The XLT cab is a great sounding cab. It has a built-in low mid hump that adds great definition in the mix. The XST has a very flat frequency response and, like my DNS cabs, I dial in a little low-mid boost ~250Hz to get a sound similar to the XLT. The advantage of the XST is that it has a much lower and tighter bottom end. If you can find one of those around $500, that would be a really good choice, presuming you can't find the DNS-210. Those were all designed by the same guy.

    In any of these cabs you look at used, be very careful if they've had the speakers replaced. If they weren't replaced with OEM speakers, they are not going to sound the same as the new cab.
    Heavy Blue likes this.
  10. Rip Van Dan

    Rip Van Dan DNA Endorsing Artist Supporting Member

    Feb 2, 2009
    Duvall, WA
    OK, update. I just checked with Reverb and they have a number of used and new DNS-210 cabs. They have a great price on two of the used ones and OK prices on the rest. One of them is just $395 and the other is $400. They both have the silver DNA badge on them instead of the Gold and Silver badge, which means they are a few years old. My DNS-410 from 2015 has the silver logo and my DNS-210 from 2019 has the gold and silver badge. But there haven't been any changes in the cab outside of this since David released them in 2010 and I would jump on one of those around the $400 price.
    Heavy Blue and steelbed45 like this.
  11. ezstep


    Nov 25, 2004
    north Louisiana
    G-B for sure. You can check with agedhorse about the original speakers that should be inside. IIRC, Faital's.
    Heavy Blue and Bassdirty like this.
  12. nilorius

    nilorius Inactive

    Oct 27, 2016
    Riga - Latvia
    I would recommend TC.
    Heavy Blue and JeezyMcNuggles like this.
  13. It is hard for Americans to appreciate the high cost of everything up here. Many things cost double what they do in the states. Also buying new incurs 13% sales tax (at least in Ontario). Shipping prices are exhorbitant.

    I would stay far away from the Acme with the replacement speakers. They are probably selling it because it sounds terrible now that they replaced the speakers. Also, getting replacement drivers up to Canada would be too cost prohibitive.

    Probably best to go with the Genz Benz at that price and see what happens.
    Heavy Blue, Bassdirty and S-Bigbottom like this.
  14. JeezyMcNuggles

    JeezyMcNuggles Supporting Member

    Feb 23, 2018
    Santa Maria, CA
    I suck, but nobody really notices
    I'll vouch for the K210. K series is awesome. No tweeter control though. I just unplugged mine.
    Heavy Blue likes this.
  15. bassdude51

    bassdude51 "You never even called me by my name." Supporting Member

    Nov 1, 2008
    Central Ohio

    $350 for the Acme without the OEM woofers is a "no go"! You can't buy replacement woofers from Acme without returning the originals.

    Don't buy!

    Acme's turn up here on TalkBass from time to time.

    I have 2 pairs of the Acme B210 and a B10. My favorite cab! True bass sound! Not for slappers. Not a loud cab and a power eater but true bass sound! Open E, 41 hz flat response! Open B, 31 hz @ -6 db. Can't get much better!

    Acme ain't for everyone but for "true bass sound lovers", it's an major excellent cab!
    Heavy Blue likes this.
  16. RichSnyder

    RichSnyder Columbia, MD Supporting Member

    Jun 19, 2003
    I would pass on the Acme. A P neck on a Jazz or J neck on a P can work out, but Speaker X in Cabinet Y will rarely yield good results. Acme cabs are built well, but tone goal is somewhat dated, IMHO. The GB has rat fur, and the Acme, so that would be a non-starter for me. If "wait for something else" wasn't an option, I'd get the TC.
    Heavy Blue likes this.
  17. BassmanPaul

    BassmanPaul Inactive

    I would have to agree. An Acme cabinet without the original drivers is a waste. I have always found Andy Lewic af acme a pleasure to deal with. I have bough replacement drivers from him after a couple a distastes of my own making.

    I would not pay $350 for an Acme box that I would need new drivers for. An Acme is only and Acme when it is complete. when it's complete they are sublime! :)

    Just for reference I own a pair each of Series One and Two, all 4Ω
    Heavy Blue, Popps and Bassdirty like this.
  18. Heavy Blue

    Heavy Blue

    Nov 11, 2017
    Prairie Canada
    Thanks for all the feedback guys. I contacted ACME and I can get the replacement drivers for about $75 apiece iirc.

    One person said it didn’t have a good slap sound. I slap some so a good slap sound is essential. Do other feel the same way? That being said my tone is much more rounded than your typical slap sound and I don’t feel a tweeter is mandatory.

    I still haven’t gotten for now it as the trucker pickup didn’t pan out and my finances went to crap a couple of months ago. Just got a new job for now though.

    Also liked the suggestion re DNA and Eden cabs. Thx Rip!
  19. BassmanPaul

    BassmanPaul Inactive

    If you are interested in Acme PM me. and we can talk. :)
    Heavy Blue likes this.
  20. jeff7bass

    jeff7bass Inactive

    Apr 9, 2009
    I get the ACME love but to say the cab sucks without his original drivers is going overboard IMO. I'm sure there are other drivers on the market that would sound good in the cab.