Cliff Burton & Lars Ulrich: Isolated bass and drum tracks to "Seek and Destroy" (1983)

Discussion in 'Bassists [BG]' started by Hamlet7768, Dec 29, 2014.

  1. Hamlet7768

    Hamlet7768 Here to chew gum and rock. Still have gum.

    Jun 5, 2011

    Some neat stuff that's nearly buried in the regular mix of the record, like those fuzz-wah fills at 1:47 and 2:52. I've heard he used a Bassballs early on before getting his famous Morley wah, think it might've been the Bassballs?
    lokikallas likes this.
  2. Ender_rpm


    Apr 18, 2004
    St. Louis MO
    Fascinating how "off" his timing would be considered now. Really betrays his 70s roots, versus the hyper precision the thrash movement would inspire.
  3. baceface


    Dec 28, 2014
    I always thought his basslines progressively got better through his other albums with them. I have to wonder how much time he had to get things together for the Kill Em All recording but either way, Lars wasn't a good drummer until Master of Puppets/And Justice for All so we can just blame him:hyper:
  4. Hamlet7768

    Hamlet7768 Here to chew gum and rock. Still have gum.

    Jun 5, 2011
    Yeah, I was surprised too at how off-time the root plugging sounded. It's interesting to compare "The Four Horsemen" to "Master of Puppets," though, as they're fairly similar in bass terms: a lot of tight riffing in the main section and a mellow, more "open" feeling bridge section. He does some great counterpoint parts that have influenced me a lot.
  5. tobias3469

    tobias3469 Supporting Member

    Sep 28, 2013
    West Los Angeles
    I bet they recorded the guitars before the bass. He found a pocket between the drums and guit-fiddles
    bftbassman and baceface like this.
  6. Hamlet7768

    Hamlet7768 Here to chew gum and rock. Still have gum.

    Jun 5, 2011
    I'm not sure if they did that on this record. I know they did that on Lightning and Puppets.
  7. hintz


    Jun 5, 2014
    wahiawa, HI(Oahu)
    Yeah, I know that alot of what he did wouldn't pass as studio quality nowadays, I've listened to a few of his soloed tracks, kinda disappointed honestly, alot what I mistook for bass attack was really guitars all this time....but playing along with the 1st three albums did get my chops together, so I owe cliff that much!!
    edit: you can get similar wah sounds with the DOD fx25 into dirt pedals IME
  8. bolophonic


    Dec 10, 2009
    Durham, NC
    I love listening to isolated tracks of seminal recordings to get an idea of what the difference between "ideal" vs "reality" really sounds like. It brings me much closer to the music to hear the human quality of the players coming through the speakers.

    The one thing that I am dying to hear are the isolated shaker tracks on Sympathy For The Devil. I can't pinpoint any mistakes, but I can't imagine that they did them perfectly.
  9. TonyP-

    TonyP- Excuse me but you have your I-IV-V in my II-V-I Gold Supporting Member

    Aug 21, 2003
    Boston Mass
    A-Designs Mike Lull GK Tsunami Cables GHS Strings RMI Basswitch Nordstrand Pickups Darkglass
    Good point...Its like the recorded completely separately and did not know what the other one was playing.
    SirMjac28 likes this.
  10. This was done on a Rickenbacker right? I thought he ran that bass in stereo with an SVT on the neck pickup and Marshall JCM on the bridge. This sounds like it was just recorded mono.
  11. DWBass

    DWBass The Funkfather

    He didn't have a great drummer to work with!
    JohnnyWishbone and mindwell like this.
  12. I've heard another rumor that all guitars were recorded using one Marshall stack, but who knows..
  13. AdamR

    AdamR Inactive

    Sep 24, 2007
    Bethel CT
    I think at this point Cliff was using a Sunn bass head but that doesnt mean thats what he recorded with. I was such a huge Cliff fan early on but these tracks disappoint me. Not to take away from his legacy but listening to his playing other then his use of wah and fuzz I dont think his basslines were anything special or even solid.
    hintz likes this.
  14. squirefan


    Nov 22, 2009
    Lansing, Ks.
    I noticed also, but I think this is what gives music the human feel...something the digital age has taken away.
    It's what I love about classic stuff, that everything isn't perfect but talent gives it the soul, i.e. slightly off backup vocals, string noise, actually playing instruments with feel, timbre, etc. The digital stuff can make no talent 'musicians' sound like they are perfect.
    If, for example, Neil Young, or the Stones, had begun their career today, they would either not be successful or would never be the bands they are.

    Just my 2 cents.
  15. OldDirtyBassist


    Mar 13, 2014
    I kinda think he decided to play behind the beat just to be different.
    leegreenman likes this.
  16. True. They probably just went into the studio and used what was available. Marshall stack, whatever bass rig.
  17. AdamR

    AdamR Inactive

    Sep 24, 2007
    Bethel CT
    I believe at the time James and Kirk were using Marshall JMPs with a tube Screamer. Same setup for RTL. For Puppets through the Black album James used a Mesa Boogie Mark 2
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2014
  18. The producer said his signal was a mix of mic and DI...but I think this is just DI. If you listen to the 'live' (alt. recordings from same session with audience noises added) tracks from the singles off this album you can hear his more familiar grindy RTL tone. Just.
  19. lokikallas

    lokikallas Supporting Member

    Aug 15, 2010
    los angeles
    I don't know what mistakes you guys are hearing. Sounds fine to me. It's an easy song.
    vegas532 and Bret_Salyer like this.
  20. hintz


    Jun 5, 2014
    wahiawa, HI(Oahu)
    To me, in quite a few spots, his eighth notes sound off, then later in the song they sound tighter, stuff that wouldn't pass on modern recordings.... I will say, I never heard alot of the little 16ths he used on main a riff, that was cool
    champbassist likes this.