Cobatting Tube Mud

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by americanmade, Apr 13, 2005.

  1. americanmade


    Feb 12, 2005
    I do not personally own a tube amp, but I am considering buying one. I love the tone of SVTs, but I hate the muddiness that comes with the lows. I was wondering if pairing a tube head like an SVT or YBA200 with a 410 cabinet would make it sound less muddy. I have only played the SVT through Ampeg cabs, which I have heard are not great. I planned on pairing a head with a 212, but I was curious if a 410 would create a more focused sound. I'm not sure if that even makes sense, but it's been on my mind for a couple days.
  2. In my experience it's not the head, it's the cabs. Particularly the 8x10 cab. An SVT through my old EV 2x15 cab sounded very deep and clear on the bottom end.
  3. 4Mal

    4Mal Supporting Member

    Jun 2, 2002
    Columbia River Gorge
    The 8x10 does have a significant mid-bass (60 ? 80 hz) bump but the amp will eq around that easily. Personaly if I were crazy enough to want to move and SVT today, I'd only run it with the original 8x10. ... and I'd pay attention to the ultra low switch and the bass control. The tone controls on those amps (I would include the V4B as well) have a huge amount of boost available. It's pretty easy to dial up a muffy kind of tone .. if you do, it's your fault though. There with porper eq, it is still a hell of a good rig.

    No substitue for having a roadie / sound guy play your bass while you walk the room with an amp that powerful though. You really need to hear what it sounds like 40 to 100 feet away. Most of the bassists I've heard with muddy sound were playing decent rigs badly adjusted ...
  4. The 0x

    The 0x

    Aug 24, 2003
    Timonium, MD
    You know, there ARE more tube heads than just Ampeg, that also sound a LOT less muddy. Same with the cabs. (i'd really like to try an SVT through a relatively uncolored cab though, to see if it's the head that causes all that mudiness, or the SVT cabs. )
  5. James Hart

    James Hart

    Feb 1, 2002
    Endorsing Artist: see profile
    So true, your Sunn (played clean :p ), my peavey, trace stuff, Aggie, Demeter... mudd is not part of defining the tone.

    I love Jeff Ament's recent live tone... Vintage SVT into SWR 6x10 cabs. No mud there IMO. He was part of my push to build the rig I use.
  6. 4Mal

    4Mal Supporting Member

    Jun 2, 2002
    Columbia River Gorge
    There is a world of differnce between the old & new SVT Cabs. The new ported 8x10 is just horrible. The sealed cab is where it's at but you have to control that mid-bass bump. Recent Ampeg cab's don't do it for me at all ... then again I'm not about to start humping a 'fridge cab around again either ...
  7. jokerjkny


    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PA
    i dunno,

    i'm soooooooo used to the punch and authority of having tons of headroom from my usual 1200-1400 SS power amps, my all tube amp heads can seem muddy.

    at lower volumes, for my sound, they're tight enough for most 4 string duties. but for my 5 strings, even with my Epifani cabs, my tone feels a tad too boomy for me. :(

    to combat this, i've been running my all tube amps into an Avalon U5, using a THD Hotplate as a "dummy load", and running the whole shabang into my SS power amps.

    this way i get the heavenly fat tube feel that only an all tube power section can give you, and yet the high wattage / headroom of my SS power amp gives me that slammin' tight low end that feels sooooooo right. :bassist:
  8. 4Mal

    4Mal Supporting Member

    Jun 2, 2002
    Columbia River Gorge
    I can picture that. To me the SVT is really a rig for a 4 string.

    ... Joker - you have a serious gear affliction ... ;)
  9. Hurley


    Feb 12, 2004
    Cape Cod, MA
    Ported 810?? My Classic is sealed, and I believe those new SVT-810HPCs are as well.
  10. Every amp can sound muddy, depending on how it's set up.

    I own an old SVT and the last thing I would use to describe it is muddy. I'm currently using a Berg NV-610 (which is the dog's danglies with an SVT, BTW :D) but I've used it with the SVT410-HLF, A new Ampeg 810, an old Ampeg 810, a Goliath 3, and an Eden 410XLT without being muddy. Now, it does sound a bit tighter through the sealed boxes but it's certainly not muddy through the others.

    It's all in how you use it.
  11. ampeg.svt


    Apr 6, 2005
    Maybe you're too used to solid state? Do you listen to a lot of modern slapping type stuff? Maybe you're mistaking tube warmth for mud? You are not going to get that uber-clean, scooped-out slap sound with a tube amp unless you run it at extremely balls-cut volume. When you get down to it, set everything at unity (if you're on an SVT, set everything to 12 o'clock) and see how muddy your tone is on a decent tube amp. If you're boots get stuck in the mud, its either your bass (active EQ?) or in your fingers. I'm not going to say much about cabs as that's been covered already but I will say if you're rockin a 5 string you're definitely going to want at least 2x10 and a 1x15 or a 4x10 and a 2x12 or something similar. You won't get much low-B clarity out of a 8x10.