Disappointed in music venues

Bands and venues have a symbiotic relationship. If you remember your biology class, that's a close and long-term biological interaction between two different biological organisms. Symbiotic relationships come in three basic types:

Mutualism - where both organisms benefit from the relationship. This would be where the venue increases its sales when the band plays and pays the band a fair share of that increased revenue.

Commensalism - where one party benefits and the other is neither helped nor harmed. This would be having the band play for free while the venue increases sales.

Parasitism - where one party is harmed while the other benefits. This would be pay-to-play.

 

Its hard breaking in to any scene. We had one venue around here that went to a pay-to-play approach to booking, they went under in a year. Most of the local original bands understand there won't be a lot of money, so we grind and work our way up the tiers. My current band is making head way, and we're at the point where we're making enough to pay for gas playing at some decent venues. Next big step will be opening for out of town acts regularly at the bigger clubs, we've done it a couple times at the smaller ones. But none of us are trying to make a living at this.

 

To be honest, as a rock cover band i don't know that you should even be hitting the pavement on dedicated music venues. I can only speak for my area, but those type of venues normally don't book cover bands. I think if you just stick to the bars/restaurants/events type areas you will not find much in the pay-to-play/risk based pay and actually get a flat rate somewhere. IMO of course, others will be able to advise better than I more likely.

 

the problem is you guys are an original band, where I live they do not get the respect that even a cover band would get. do you guys play any covers? I was in a band that did 50/50.

 

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It all comes down to how big a draw you can build. If you will fill a bar you have a stronger negotiating position at a paying bar. If you don't have that following yet, then playing for free (or nearly free) is where you do the hard work to build your draw.

The only way I can justify pay-to-play is if you are a new band with new material that isn't going to get in anywhere else yet.

 

I know it's a total bummer, and unfortunately the result will also be a double edged sword. Clubs that run like that simply don't stay in business for the long haul.

Doing booking for a band these days almost requires a sales background. If you don't have that, or your sales pitch isn't quite cutting it for most of the venues you're trying to book at, all you can do at that point is evaluate the product you're trying to sell. Can you guys improve things? Do you have a decent website? Any live video or demos?

 

Don't hate the player, hate the game. I never used to understand that phrase, but i now realize it's just the situation -- weekend warrior bands are like a cottage industry, with low entry barriers, so there are a lot of them around. More bands than bookings available. People will take advantage, just as you would probably raise your prices if there were fewer bands than bookings and you were busy 3 nights a week.

My goal, in this situation, would be to change the game.

I have done this a few ways. I am into non-profit work and service, so I have put on a ton of events that require live music. We sell sponsorships, and I always insist that my musicians are involved and paid. Also, if the place gets hit by BMI, go in there with 3 hours of original music as the savior of live music at the venue. That netted me 10 bookings in a row, and then regular quarterly gigs.

Think of other ways of changing the deal/situation/industry so you are paying bands to play, including your own. Find new places and encourage them to start holding live music -- on other words, expand the market. Learn marketing so you have the clout of a promoter -- then start taking a piece of bands you book as well as getting your own band bookings whenever you want them. Check for legalities associated with running this kind of operation before you do -- in your state. What about entrepreneurs who want to own their own bar. If they are not experienced, they are easier to work with. Sell them on the idea of setting up a mobile bar situation in a place that is dirt cheap with bands and help them promote the heck out of it. Make it novel. I once packed a place with 104 people because I didn't advertise the location unless they RSVP'd. I made it secret, but novel. Massive interest from the following...

Seriously, Last of all, have you considered live streaming from someone's living room? Concert Window allows you to do this and charge. Charge people to come, and provide drinks and food for a fee. I have visions of a trade event where I partner with a hotel or venue that needs more business. I will organize and invite all kinds of people who do events, while charging event service providers a fee to be there, and of course, my bands will be the only ones there -- getting paid from the sales to the event service providers, or doing it for TRUE promotion to our target market -- event planners, wedding planners, and more.

Not all of these will work for you, but they represent the kind of disruptive thinking that expands opportunities.

it's work, believe me, but it can pay off it you hit on that idea that makes you independent of these people who won't give you what you want!!!

 

Good thing you see it for what it is. You've got to watch out for yourself, noone else will

 

In the Los Angeles area, we have the following pay-to-play venues:

The Viper Room (opened in 1993)
The Mint (overhauled in 2004)
Genghis Cohen (opened around 2003?)
The Whisky-a-Go-Go (opened in 1964)
The Roxy (opened in 1973)
The Troubadour (opened in 1957)

They may be struggling, and many other clubs have closed along the way, but as of now these warhorses (whorehouses?) still have open doors.

 

A band I was in last year played a little dive that paid 15% or 20% of the bar (I forgot exactly what the number was).
What they failed to tell the band until the end of the night was that they tallied the bar to pay us while we played. But on break when a lot of people stop dancing and get drinks, they stop tallying the bar. So we did't get the cut when on break. Pretty sleazy!

 

Bar bands.... yeaaa... play Mustang Sally!

 

Country is where it’s at these days.

 

They usually get hard rock/metal bands that play at literally deafening levels (I've seen stacks of 412's in pics of bands playing there and it's not a big place).
The manager had the stones to say "Wow - you guys sound great. We really want to book you back. The bands we usually get are way too loud and don't sound good to boot".
Could the band pay be one of the reasons they only get decent bands (cause/effect)?

 

I played a bar here 2 weeks ago where the bar tender said rule number one is NO MUSTANG SALLY.
If he was a she I woulda kissed her

 

Pay to play, not charging regulars
...so does that mean only YOUR friends get charged? Between that and 1099's it's almost better to stay home or play private parties... everybody wins.

Almost half of our gigs are private parties...we get paid cash (better than some gigs), get a meal, free drinks and usually help with setting up and loading up. The only problem is that only a few people see you at these gigs, but man... it's certainly fun!