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Eden 410T 8 ohm cab

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by OrangeSun, Dec 27, 2005.


  1. OrangeSun

    OrangeSun

    Jun 26, 2005
    Boston, MA
    Thinking about buying one of these bad boys used for about 600 bucks. Im going to go play through it and check it out first, but I have a couple questions. if anyone is in the know about this stuff...

    I'm sort of new to cabs, I've played through this one before in a store and liked it. However, I'm wondering, whats the wattage handling on this bad boy? And how powerful of a head am I going to need if its 8 ohms? Is that less/more powerful then the 4ohm?

    Any comments/response is greatly appreaciated. thanks a lot
     
  2. You don't have your profile filled out, so I'm not sure where you are located. If you are in the US, that is not a particularly good price for that cab. The T line, I believe, is the rear ported 410 with lower power handling rating versus the widely used and mostly loved 410XLT. There are 410XLT's for sale used regularly for about the same price. I would suggest holding out for a 410XLT.
     
  3. vision

    vision It's all about the groove! Supporting Member

    Feb 25, 2005
    Ann Arbor, MI
    I believe that the 410T handles 540 watts. You will probably need a head that puts out a minimum of 500 watts at 8 ohms to push it, of course more is better.

    With 410's I would really prefer a 4 ohm model over an 8 ohm...you can get more power out of a head at 4 ohms than you can at 8 ohms. And its rare that you would be using multiple cabs with a 410. The exception would be if you are using one of the older Eden heads (WT500, WT600, old model WT800), which can only bridge into 8 ohms...
     
  4. Ostinato

    Ostinato Guest

    Feb 7, 2005
    Toronto ON
    Personally I feel they are among the best sounding 410s you can get, and that includes the XLT line. They just have that certain something. ;)

    There are two brand new ones selling for less on ebay right now. Eden cabs are very efficient so any amp can make them work. I've had my D410T for thirteen years, and can't seem to get rid of it.
     
  5. OrangeSun

    OrangeSun

    Jun 26, 2005
    Boston, MA
    Thanks so much for the replies. I don't think i'm going to get it, based on the 8ohm issue and the price. I'm thinking it might be wiser for my wallet and my back to get the 210 to start off with, so i can have some money left over to start saving for an amplifier.
     
  6. OrangeSun

    OrangeSun

    Jun 26, 2005
    Boston, MA
    So, what would you say is the sound difference between the XLT and the T? I played through the 210 XLT and loved it, would you say the sound difference between that and the T is significant?
     
  7. vision

    vision It's all about the groove! Supporting Member

    Feb 25, 2005
    Ann Arbor, MI
    The 410T sounds kinda like the SWR Goliath II to my ears...its rear ported, and doesn't go as low as the 410XLT, and it also doesn't have as much of the classic Eden "mid-hump" to the sound. But the 410T does sound a bit more smooth.

    I played using a pair of 210XLT's for years, I'm sure that you would like that rig. You could buy one now and then save up to add another later. I've seen them go for as low as $350...
     
  8. Ostinato

    Ostinato Guest

    Feb 7, 2005
    Toronto ON
    I heard those comparisons made and they are more or less similar. But the D410T is punchier has more mid "character", whereas the Goliath always had a hole in the mids that seemed to make your bass disappear in the mix if you didn't EQ just right.

    If you play alot of four string fingerstyle, go for it! It's THE cab for that. Actually it's perfect for any style, very much old school. Not as in your face as the XLT, the mids are more taught sounding (maybe due to the rear port) but they're still there.
     
  9. IvanMike

    IvanMike Player Characters fear me... Staff Member Supporting Member

    Nov 10, 2002
    Middletown CT, USA
    here's the deal.

    in 1987 eden began making the original goliath 410 cab for swr. after the two parted ways both companies began making the same cab (with minor "improvements"). SWR called it the goliath2, eden called it the 410T. Put a goliath, a goliath2 and a 410T together, blindfold yourself, and try to tell them apart. not easy.

    they all handle 540 watts. $600 is way way too much for one. www.Prepal.com is a pretty fair indicator. all go for about $300 or so used.

    The 410T is IMO, a "tighter" sounding cab than the 410XLT. not as much lows, but the lows don't sound as "artificial"

    I prefer the 8 ohm version. most amps put out a little less than twice the wattage at 4 ohms as they do at 8 ohms due to thermal limitations. That means you get a 3 dB or less increase in volume with the 4 ohm cab. IMO, you're better off getting a 2nd 8 ohm cab if you want more volume, or bridging a stereo amp into it.

    and for the record, you cannot underpower a cab. i used my goliath 1 with as little as 75 watts, and as much as 1000 watts. The difference? 1000 watts was louder. :smug:
     
  10. OrangeSun

    OrangeSun

    Jun 26, 2005
    Boston, MA
    Do you guys happen to know the specs on the WT1000?

    My head gets all run together when I try to figure out how to go about getting a better bass rig. I want to eventually have a 210 and a 15 or 18 underneath it. Right now I use a SWR 15 workingman combo and I like the sound from a 15. Where I run into trouble is thinking out the ohms. Ill probably start off getting the 210 and then the amplifier. Should the 210 be 4 or 8 ohms? If I get the 210T, rated at 250W with 8ohms, do I want to get a 4 or 8 ohm 15?

    Right now im thinking the answer is a WT800, 210XLT or 210T to start. Save up and get myself a 15 or 18 to complete it. Im still stuck on what ohms would be best for the cabs to run this rig with the most power. I know this rig can work, im just not sure on the ohms. Any help would be appreaciated, thanks alot
     
  11. IvanMike

    IvanMike Player Characters fear me... Staff Member Supporting Member

    Nov 10, 2002
    Middletown CT, USA
    personally, stick with 8 ohm cabs. much more versatile. the power gain you get with 4 ohm cabs wont be much, and you can end up limiting yourself too easy with 4 ohm cabs.
     
  12. Ostinato

    Ostinato Guest

    Feb 7, 2005
    Toronto ON
    Yep, I had an SWR Redhead in the late '80s with an Eden crossover and speakers. But it still sounded like SWR. ;)
     

  13. However.... if like many of us, there would never be a gig loud enough to justify anything more than one 410, in that situation, a 4ohm cab makes a lot of sense. While the 3db thing involves total volume, it does not take into account the total power delivered to the cab across the range of the bass.... a couple hundred more watts of headroom when you are pounding on the B string can make the difference between a full, punchy sound and a distorted, compressed sound. The other key issue is the absolute wattage of the head and how loud you are playing.... 600 vs. 1000 watts 4ohm to 8ohm might not be that noticable if you aren't pushing the amp to even its 600 watt 'limit'. However, 240 vs. 400 watts 4ohm to 8ohm can really sound different if you are right up at the 240 watt limit of the amp... again, not massively louder, but cleaner and punchier on the low end... and isn't that what bass is all about anyway :)

    If you know you are going to never use two 410's, there's very few reasons I can think of to not get a 4ohm version (assuming you are using a mono head that safely runs at 4ohms) One reason I can think of, per Ivanmike's comment above, is if you are using a relatively low powered stereo amp, like the older EdenWT500... then a single large 8ohm cab does make sense, since those amps can't run safely bridged into 4ohms).

    Even if you are planning on using two 410's, consider that there are not many mono heads that put out the power to really drive two large 410 cabs. If you do go with a monster two 410 setup, more likely than not, you will be pushing it with a 'stereo' head like the Eden800, or with a big PA type power amp. These stereo heads usually run optimally in stereo mode into two 4ohm loads (although the Eden800(b) and the new 1205 can now push a 4ohm load bridged)

    The key is to figure out what you are going to need.... not to just go by the rule of '8ohm is better or 4ohm is better' in all situations. Of course, two small 8ohm cabs gives you the ultimate ability to mix and match for the size of gig. However, I find carrying one large 4ohm cab with wheels on it simpler and easier than two small 8ohm cabs on a cart (especially now that you can find wonderful sounding 410's that weigh less than what most 210's weighed in the past).


    Also, I GREATLY prefer the XLT to the old T model. The XLT actually rolls off quite high (-3db at 50hz)... which gives it that unique, chest pounding lower mid thump. I believe that's why the XLT became a standard in the industry for many years. I've actually never seen a T outside of a music store! That doesn't mean they aren't good cabs, but per my previous post.... $600 for a used one is WAY too high.
     
  14. vision

    vision It's all about the groove! Supporting Member

    Feb 25, 2005
    Ann Arbor, MI
    +1

    If you're talking about smaller cabs like 1x12's or 2x10's then the 8 ohm rule makes sense. But if you're talking about a 4x10 then 4 ohm is really the way to go. If you are playing gigs loud enough that you need a pair of 4x10's (esp. Edens which are very loud) then you will most likely be using some kind of pre/power amp setup, or a big stereo head. Either way, youd be running a pair of 4 ohm 4x10's in stereo. You would need a HUGE mono head to run a pair of 8 ohm 4x10's...
     
  15. M5Yates

    M5Yates

    Feb 7, 2005
    Austin, TX
    Do the Eden D210T and D210XLT have the same general sound as their 4x10 counterparts?
     
  16. Never played the D210T, but the 210XLT sounds very similar to the 410XLT IMO. I assume the same holds for the T
     
  17. OrangeSun

    OrangeSun

    Jun 26, 2005
    Boston, MA
    Okay so, I think I've got this now. Heres what I was originally thinking:

    Saying I got the WT800-B. Then, to start, I can get used 410XLT at 4ohms, and just run that really only using half the head. Then, when/if I ever need the extra firepower, I can get another 410 or 15 and run that as well, also at 4 ohms.

    Heres what I'm thinking now(for $$ issues and because its more appropriate for what I need, I think)

    Push one 4ohm 410(T or XLT) with a traveler400, or possibly a WT550. Ive been thinking about it, and right now I use a 150 watt SWR workingman, which is loud enough but I can tell I'm pushing it too hard sometimes. 550 watts through a 410XLT or T sounds like it could be the perfect rig for me. I do a lot of slap and fingerstyle, and I love the way my SWR can sound, it just needs more power/room to breathe. If I'm understanding what i've learned in this thread correctly, then I think that somewhere in this set of equiptment is the perfect rig for me.

    Here are my questions on this rig:

    Would there be a significant loss of lower end switching from the 15 to 410s? I am looking for a clearer sound, but something that still has enough low end. Im thinking that maybe the XLT would be better...thoughts?

    Would it be wiser to run it with the 400 or the 550 watt head? Will it make enough of a difference to be worth the $$?

    About how much louder should that be then what I've got now? 150 watt solid state SWR 1x15 combo vrs. the Traveler 400 with a 410(4ohm) or the WT550 with a 410(4ohm)

    For a clear slap sound, with punchy clear low end and mids, I think this is the rig I want: WT550 through a 410XLT or T. Final question is, would it sound better with the 40hm or 8? If I understand this properly, 4ohms would be the best.


    THANKS SO MUCH TO ALL OF YOU FOR HELPING ME WITH THIS PROCESS. Soon I will be playing through my first professional sounding rig and I can't thank you guys enough for helping me out with the details. I have learned a lot already just from this thread. Much thanks and kudos
     
  18. Sounds like a plan! The difference in sound between what you have now and a 410XLT with either an EdenWT400 or 550 is going to be massive.... much higher quality components. Since the XLT410 is loud enough to knock walls down, you will probably never need a second cab... therefore, I'd go with the 4ohm version to get all the power I can into that cab.

    The Eden's sound great for all styles of playing... fingerstyle, slap/pop, etc. The tweeters are not the most 'hi fi' around, but they get the job done if you keep them at a reasonable level. While the 550 is not a huge increase in wattage, the extra 100 watts will get you a little more headroom and fullness in the low end IMO and the 550 is safe to 2ohms if you would ever need it, but either would sound great.

    Here's one more thing to think about.... if you find a used 410XLT in 8ohms and a used 800, you can bridge the 800 into the 8ohm XLT and have what has been the 'industry standard' touring rig for many years.... just amazing sounding (remember, bridging a 'stereo' power amp into an 8ohm cab results in the amp 'seeing' a 4ohm load).

    Good luck on your search,

    Ken
     
  19. vision

    vision It's all about the groove! Supporting Member

    Feb 25, 2005
    Ann Arbor, MI
    No. You'll probably have alot more low end when going from the 15 inch combo to the Eden 410. The 410XLT is one of the best cabs ever with a low B IMHO...there's tons of low end there. Also a big factor in low end is the amount of watts available...the additional headroom you'll have with the Eden head will make the low end sound alot more full than with the combo.

    I would definitely say that more power is better, but I'm not sure if its worth the extra $$$. I don't know what used WT400's are going for right now...one advantage that the 550 has though is the ability to give you 750 watts at 2 ohms :)

    WAAYYY louder...no comparison...

    I would go for the 4 ohm...I can't see you needing to add a cab to the Eden 410 unless you're playing arena gigs...and in that case you wouldn't be using it with the 400 or 550, you'd need a big stereo amp (which you would still want to use at 4 ohms per side.)
     
  20. Juniorkimbrough

    Juniorkimbrough

    Mar 22, 2005
    Mississippi / Memphis, TN
    Endorsing Artist: Lakland Basses
    I own this exact cab and man does this thing have some killer tone. I agree that $600 isn't a very good price for it......I picked mine up for a little less than $400.

    I gig with both my 410T and a Schroeder 1210(not at the same time), while the 1210 is a lot more portable it doesn't have the great sound that the Eden does.