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Epi UL212 (II) vs Bergs

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by JEDBass, Apr 3, 2009.

  1. JEDBass


    Mar 10, 2009
    West Hartford, CT
    Hey all,

    I know there's a ton of comparison threads out there, and I didn't want to start another, but I didn't see anywhere that deals with Epifani's UL212 against comparable Berg's (usually I've seen the UL410 compared, but that's a different animal).

    For the record, I'm running a Demeter HBP-1 into a QSC PLX1804 amp, running one side to push 900W RMS into the Epi. I had the opportunity to try out an old Crest CA6, and while I did see a difference off the bat (though not much), I couldn't justify the slight difference for the significant weight difference. For basses I'm using a 5 str Spector Rebop and a 4 str Kubicki Factor.

    Basically, while I'm very happy with the tone of the UL212 when playing solo, in a band mix it doesn't seem to cut through quite as much as I'd like. In addition, if I can go modular without breaking the bank, even better. So here are the options I've been thinking of:

    1.) AE410 (running through one channel of the 1804 (900W)
    2.) 2 x AE210's (either running dual mono 8 ohm - 600W per cab, or both hooked to one side - 450W per cab)
    3.) 2 x AE112's (same power config as AE210's)
    4.) HT112/EX112 or HT112E/HT112ER (same as above)
    5.) Possibly IP112 with an EX112 and ditch the QSC, running the Dem straight into the IP.

    I love the deep tone I get out of the UL212 and don't want to lose much of that, so I'm not sure if switching back to 10's is the right thing. I prefer a lightweight solution which is why I'm strongly considering a pair of smaller cabs, but I also want to make sure I get the most volume possible for those larger gigs. I'm ready to scrap any of the 2 x 112 options if it's not going to really be any improvement volume-wise over my UL212. Unfortunately the closest shop that carries Berg is in NYC, a couple hours from me, so I appreciate any input before I make the drive down there. Thanks!
  2. KJung

    KJung Supporting Member

    IMO, it's that Demeter pre that is not matching up that well with the UL212. That cab is quite deep and wide, and so is the Demeter. I describe that pre as 'polite'. I can imagine you have all the warm, deep, and pure you could ever want, which probably turns to mush the first time the band kicks in (well, maybe not mush, but not the punch and tight kick you probably want).

    The AE410 would punch up that rig a LOT, so that's an option, or get a head or pre with the ability for a more aggressive mid punch. The Markbass F1 is WONDERFUL with that cab, and its 500 watts at 4ohms will probably drive that cab to full volume easily.

    I'm not that up to speed on preamps if you want to keep using your power amp, but I'm sure someone could recommend one with more powerful EQ and a bit more 'presence and punch' versus 'pure and pretty'.

  3. JEDBass


    Mar 10, 2009
    West Hartford, CT
    Thanks for the feedback. I've heard that the AE410 is one hell of a cabinet as far as fitting in a live mix. As for the Demeter, I have to say if I record with it I absolutely love the tone it puts out. So I'm tempted more to switch the cab versus switching the pre/power amp setup.

    But what you say seems to make sense, in the fact that it sounds like I need some more contrast between the cab voicing and the preamp voicing. The parametric EQ on the Dem does help a bit, but I don't want to overcompensate on the EQ to make the cab do something that's not its strength.

    So if I go the 410 route, then I just have one question: does it make sense to stick with the AE410 or go more modular with 2 AE210's? I know the advantage is there for modularity, but soundwise how comparable is it? Even though it's 4 drivers, with the 2 x 210 setup (driven with 600W each) the drivers are offset and stacked of course they sit a bit higher up. I'm just trying to justify if it's worth the price premium over "just" the single AE410.

    Too many good choices!
  4. GeorgeG

    GeorgeG Commercial User

    Jun 15, 2005
    Sydney, Australia
    Owner of Bass Gear Direct
    The AE410 will give you enough useble depth but also more presence in a band mix. Will punch through anything and will be more compatible with the Demeter than the UL212. As Ken mentioned the Demeter does too much of what the UL212 already has. The AE410 would be a better matchup.
    The AE210 stack will also give you the presence and punch for a band mix BUT won't give you as much depth in the lows as the AE410 but they will take it if you EQ in.

    The ER 12" stack has an awesome response in the Lows while still having a very focused and tight, punchy sound throughout the frequency range. More pure and smooth than the AE cabs but worth considering if you really want to go modular. They can take quite of bit of juice for the loud gigs.
  5. KJung

    KJung Supporting Member

    +1 to your Demeter comment, and I did not mean to imply that it isn't a fantastic, wonderful sounding pre. Rather, as George posted, more of a bit too much of a good thing with the mix and match.

    +1 to George's post above regarding your questions.
  6. chadds


    Mar 18, 2000
    What if a pre change brought you what you desire great live and recorded sound?
  7. JEDBass


    Mar 10, 2009
    West Hartford, CT
    Thanks guys,

    All great advice here, that's why I love coming on here!

    Sounds like as long as I keep my Demeter, then it's off to try either the AE410 or possibly the ER 12" stack. Definite advantages to the two different setups. Either way it sounds like I'll be able to get the best of both worlds; keeping the tone I absolutely love when recording while improving the punch in a live mix. I'd consider switching the pre, but I've tried quite a few different ones already and the Demeter just has "my" tone. Not everyone's cup of tea I'm sure, but then again that's why there are so many to choose from.

    Now it's time to take a trip down to Rudy's! Thanks again.

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