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Epifani UL410 2 now 66lbs.! Ultralight or Not?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Musicman81, Oct 2, 2008.

  1. We all know that there have been rumors going around about Epifani "gaining weight" on their UL Cabs. Well, finally some hard evidence. Although Epifani hasn't updated their website (which they never do), they have sent the new specs to Musicians Friend http://bass-guitars.musiciansfriend...0-1000-Watt-4X10-Inch-Bass-Cabinet?sku=601062 It looks as if most (if not all) of the other cabs are spec'd at their old weights.

    Do you all consider this to still be Ultralight ? Will this change your mind if you were about to pull the trigger on a new UL410 or Epifani cabinet in general ?

  2. The weight spec has been on the Perfect Bass site for a while. The new 310UL's are the same weigh as my original 410UL (around 56 pounds).

    This, combined with the Series II revoicing (and a few other reasons) is why I reluctantly no longer recommend Nick's cabs as enthusiastically as I had in the past. The large size of the 410UL combined with the extra 10 pounds would be a deal killer for me (especially given the AE410's lighter weight and smaller size). The extra 9 pounds or so on the 310UL isn't exactly a deal killer, but puts it at the same weight but large size than a lot of killer ceramic 210 cabs out there.
  3. 66 lbs is still pretty light compared to some of the other bass cabs out there.
  4. I got lucky on my UL310 Series 2 then. It weighs 47 as spec'd. I got it about 3 months back. I agree, 66lbs is still rather light compared to some 410's. I'm not real familiar with The Perfect Bass, I'll have to give it a look.
  5. I assume there are still quite a few of the 'previous' Series II models making it through the system at this point. This is another reason why I'm a little down on Epi at this point. They have VERY poor communication on their new products and product changes. The pictures of their amps on their site and some on-line retailers still has a limiter knob, and the UL cab pictures are still the old NYC cabs with the signature on the logo.

    That in and of itself isn't that big of a deal, but not knowing if you are going to get a 57 or a 66 pound cab is. They were also very sloppy about the Series I to Series II change-over. I know a few people who bought Series I cabs and found out that they had Eminence drivers in them long before this change was announced as the 'Series II'. Of course, that's not inherently bad either, but when you are paying boutique prices, I would expect better communication and tighter spec's than what I'm seeing.

    I think the transition from being a small volume, high end boutique cab manufacturer to a major cab company with a full line of high and medium priced offerings in wide distribution (Musician's Friend, etc.) has been rough for them.

    I also suspect that the PS line of cabs and the higher line UL's are both being made overseas now (or at least on the same production line). Again, nothing inherently wrong with that, but the whole operation feels a little funny to me at the moment.

    IMO there. I still love my cabs, but am glad I have the ones I have.
  6. +1 I think you hit the nail on the head saying it's been a rough time for them transitioning. Growing Pains are not easy and it looks like it's taken a toll on them. I think that's the biggest thing for me, is how sloppy they are at this point in representing themselves as a company. I think the 310 I own sounds great. It's not my #1 cab, but it's great for portability and well, sounds great like I said. I was honestly thinking of a UL410 Series 2, but I'm having second thoughts. The Guitar Center here in OKC has a UL410 Series 1 for 699.00 I've been keeping an eye on. I think I'll have Don at LDS build me a Beyma Neo 4 10" instead.
  7. blowinblue

    blowinblue Blue in name only. Supporting Member

    Nov 29, 2006
    SoCal USA
    Hey Ken, aside from taking off a handle and peeking inside, is there any way to tell the B&C speakers from the Eminence? Since you own both series I and II UL-410's, you're the man to ask. :)

    M. M.
  8. No, and then even then, there is no brand marking on the speakers. The only reason I know that this happened is that whenever anyone got a new cab at LDS, the first thing Don and guys did is peak inside and see what was what. There were some cases of the Series I cabs (late in the life cycle of that series) being loaded with the Eminence drivers. Again, not a big deal, but kind of sloppy, since there are subtle tons differences between the Eminence and B&C loaded version sof these cabs.
  9. blowinblue

    blowinblue Blue in name only. Supporting Member

    Nov 29, 2006
    SoCal USA
    So how did Don & crew know which was which? We wanna know the secret. :D I take it that there are no visual clues looking at the front of the speakers. :rollno:

    M. M.
  10. Since Don is in the cab making business, he identified the brand from looking at it (and maybe the model number or something.. can't remember). It was a while ago.
  11. vision

    vision It's all about the groove!

    Feb 25, 2005
    Ann Arbor, MI
    Endorsing Artist: MTD Basses, La Bella Strings, and 64 Audio IEMs
    Does anyone know if there was any overlap between the "first gen" 57 lb. S2's and the "second gen" 66 lb. S2's? What I'm basically trying to determine is did the change in speaker grills (the current UL cabs have the larger hole grills of the PS cabs) happen at exactly the same time as the change in weight specs (mostly from the change from ultralight Italian poplar to whatever they are using now.)

    If so, then we have another piece of evidence that these cabs are now being made overseas in the same factory as the PS cabs. Since there is an established history of Epifani "overlapping" product changes, it would be surprising if the change in gills (to the grills used on the PS cabs) and change to a less rare wood spec would happen at the same time.

    I also remember the first run of PS cabs using the same grills as the UL cabs (small holes), and it would make alot of sense to me if the first few runs of those cabs were built here in the states and then when the construction was moved to overseas the grills changed. So maybe the grill type is an indicator of where the cab was made?

    By the way, I'm just blindly guessing here, and it really doesn't matter where the cabs are made since guys have compared 57 lb. S2 cabs and 66 lb. S2 cabs and not noticed any tonal difference at all.
  12. jokerjkny


    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PHL

    from what i gather, the only other cab in the same lightweight league as the ul410 is the berg ae410, which is 62 lbs. nevermind that they sound totally different from one another, but if 4 lbs. is that much a difference to someone, then, its like, "really?"

    and maybe its the pullups i've been doing on my new chin up bar, but i've hoisted both the old 56 lbs cab and the new 66 lbs cab, and while the difference is there, and it isnt nearly as dramatic as the numbers. still, at 3am, both would be a more welcome sight than my old XLT cab!

    but bottom line, going epifani will still save hundreds if not thousands for many a management team trying to control those pesky airline cartage bills. and with more vendors getting into the neo biz, competition'll keep shearing off that weight, making us more and more happy.

  13. My UL 310 2 grill has the larger "Newer PS" holes I believe from some of the other pictures I've seen, yet still weighs 47lbs. I weighed it just to make sure after I received it, as this subject had just starting coming up around that time.

  14. You fly with a 410? My god. I've didn't think anybody flew with big backline rigs. Even with the neo stuff, flying a 410 has to cost hundreds of dollars. That doesn't make sense. What management teams would be doing this and not renting backline or trucking the stuff when the band flies (which is what the agency I work for does)?

    Anyway, +1 that Epi's current situation is opening the door for other boutique's to come in and get some foothold.

    One cab that has me VERY excited is the new TecAmp S212. It comes in either 4ohm or 8 ohm version, is vertically oriented, with a tiny 16 by 17" footprint, and weighs right around 40 pounds!!!!! They supposedly sound great, and are about the same price as the BergAE410 or Epi410UL.

    I have a feeling I'm going to be getting one of these to try out if the spec's are accurate.

  15. burk48237

    burk48237 Supporting Member

    Nov 22, 2004
    Oak Park, MI
    The other issue with the change from Series I to Series II is that the Emminence drivers are significantly cheaper then the B & C's. Since their supposdly speced specifically for Epiphani their is no way to tell the actual cost dfference. But the current price difference in the consummer catalogs shows the most expensive Emminence 10" bass speaker at right arround 100$, and all the B & C's are over 180$. You may be able to argue the new Emminence are just as good, fine. But why didn't you pass on some of the 80$ per driver or 320$ per cabinet difference? That is a huge cost savings for the manufacturer with no additional value for the customer.:(
  16. ElMon

    ElMon Supporting Member

    May 30, 2004
    Oklahoma City, OK
    This thread is making me feel great at having acquired a UL110 for $270and a UL410 for $525 :)hyper:), both of which are Series I!!!!
  17. Mike Shevlin

    Mike Shevlin

    Feb 16, 2005
    Las Vegas
    Hey Ken!!!Tec makes exciting stuff, but I emailed them a year ago & the low US dollar valuation can make their stuff crazy expensive. Jorg Schroeder makes a similar virtical 2x12 as a custom order

    Also, watch accugroove's website next week for photos of a new slimmer 62lb. Whappo Jr.

    I'm off to the gym, I need to slim down myself. BYW - my new LeCompte will be here in about a week. I'll PM you first pix.
  18. jokerjkny


    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PHL

    i dunno that's like accusing honda, who makes the rather affordable civic, of price gouging consumers with their S2000. ;)

    just cause eminence makes a particular speaker at one cost, which they probably pump out by thousands, doesnt necessarily mean that they make everything at that cheap cost, no? assembly line retooling, availability of materials, specifically trained manpower, etc, all go into making anything, and i dont put eminence or epifani for that matter in any different a catagory.

    B&C couldnt keep up, eminence could. deal done. like you said, there's no way we can tell unless we look at some balance sheets.

    but i feel you. i love the sound of scumback alnicos, which many have said are mere weber blue dog redesigns, but dang, they cost a pretty penny. :(
  19. burk48237

    burk48237 Supporting Member

    Nov 22, 2004
    Oak Park, MI
    The bottom line Epliphani came out with an "upgraded" product that was heavier, with cheaper components (I'd bet at least 150$) with no price reduction. I must admit I am partial to the Series 1 and the B & C sound. But I'm with Ken, with he Series 1 I preferred the Ephiphanis, and I thought it was the cab that all others should be measured against. Now I feel that way about the Berg AE instead.
  20. blowinblue

    blowinblue Blue in name only. Supporting Member

    Nov 29, 2006
    SoCal USA
    I got to thinking about how fortunate I am. I get to play the bass, have a wife who loves me, have a measure of good health, got a decent home, have a couple of cars that run good, and...both of my Epifani UL's have B&C speakers in them. Sorry, I just had to share. ;):D

    P.S. Don't be jealous. :rollno:

    M. M.

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