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Epifani UL410 or Bergantino AE410

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by davidjbass, Jul 27, 2008.


  1. davidjbass

    davidjbass Supporting Member

    Sep 2, 2006
    Massachusetts
    I need some advice on which cab would be the best for my situation. I play in a pretty loud rock cover band. And I have been using an Ampeg 410hlf for a couple of years now. But because of a recent lower back problem I have to find something lighter. I own a Mark Bass Little Mark II. And I have tried the Mark Bass cabs but don't like them. Plus they are 8 ohms and I need a 4 ohm cab.

    So I have narrowed it down to 2 cabs. Either the Epifani UL 410 or the Bergantino AE410. Which cab do you think would handle high volumes, produce lots of low end, handle low frequencies well(we do a lot of songs in drop D and C and I also play a 35" five sting) and last but not least not break my back. Thanks in advance for your opinions.
     
  2. Do a search on the AE410. There are about a zillion posts comparing the 410UL and the AE410, since they are the two lightweight 410 'kings' at the moment.

    Both are great, and they sound very different from each other. In short, the Epi seems to have slightly higher SPL than the AE, and has a deeper, more extended low end. The AE, though, has a lot of low mid force, and is much more voiced to the mids, especially the upper mids, where it growls quite a bit. In general, I describe the 410UL as a more 'pop/funk' cab... just a touch of politeness in the mids, a sweet, airy tweeter that is amazing for slap style, and a big, big low end that puts a very nice 'pillow' under the band. The AE is very punchy, and more 'rock aggressive'... lot's of 'bap, bap, bap' to the sound, and a more raw, grindy upper mid response that somewhat overwhelms the 'sizzle'.

    I'm not sure from your description which would be best. The 410UL definitely has the big bottom, but from the type of music you play, I would think the AE410 might be more to your liking. They both handle a B string at full volume easily.
     
  3. jokerjkny

    jokerjkny

    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PHL
    you'll definitely dig the berg AE more, since it has a more thicker woolier sound akin to the ampeg, and yet with a top end detail that's to die for.

    the epifani is a great cab, but its more neutral easier, sweetened sound is sooo far removed in tone from the growlier thicker lower middy sounding ampeg, it'll take a good deal of getting used to.
     
  4. el_Kabong

    el_Kabong

    Jul 11, 2005
    Wow, Jim must be sending different AE's to OZ coz that's not what I hear at all. The warm toned epi has much more bottom than the very clear and uncoloured AE and imo would be more in line with what the OP is accustomed to, coming from the very bottom heavy 410hlf. IME an LMII/AE410 rig is quite shy on the bottom end. Not necessarily a bad thing but that doesn't seem to be what's being sought here. The epi is not as aggressive in the mids but it does respond well to eq.
     
  5. That's why it's hard for me to recommend one over the other for the OP. The 410UL definitely has more real bottom, but the tight, somewhat attenuated low end, the low mid push of that cab, and especially that upper mid peak (to my ear) of the AE410 really says 'rock punch and growl' to me, which some of us do associate with a classic 'Ampeg like' tone signature (although probably not the 410HLF, as you mention).

    I agree, if true bottom is key, the 410UL is probably the way to go. Unfortunately, the newest models are about 9-10 pounds heavier than the published spec (around 67 pounds or so according to the new spec's published by the 'Perfect Bass'). Still pretty light though.
     
  6. davidjbass

    davidjbass Supporting Member

    Sep 2, 2006
    Massachusetts
    67 lbs is a lot lighter than 115 lbs that the ampeg weighs. And bottom end is really what I am looking for because I really only want to haul one cab to a gig. Let me throw this question into the fire. Which cab sounds best for slap? Thanks for the info so far.
     
  7. To oversimplify, if you are into a more 'Flea' type slap tone, the AE410 (lot's of upper mids coming from the tweeter of that cab to my ear). If you are a fan of old school J type slap tone, or Marcus Miller, or Alain Caron, etc.... the 410UL by a large margin (nice sizzle without much upper mid gank to the tone, and BIG low end).

    IMO.
     
  8. Tony G

    Tony G

    Jan 20, 2006
    NY
    I had the UL410 Series I, and now I have the AE410. That's all I'm saying. ;)


    EDIT: Ok, I'll say a bit more. On their own, I like the tone of the Epifani cab more than the Berg, but in the mix I like the Berg better. I never had much luck cutting through on the gig with the Epifani, despite the advice and seemingly complete opposite experience others have. While the Epifani had huge low end and pristine highs, on the gig at clubs and bars it was just too overwhelming and I never felt the cab projected the rest of the frequencies well enough to have a nice well rounded and defined bass tone. The Berg cab has a nice tight low end so it is easier to use from room to room for me. The highs aren't nearly as pristine on the Berg compared to the Epi, but in the mix the Berg highs are more usable to me. Keep in mind I use modern sounding basses for the most part, those being my MTD and Nordy. I guess if I used a more standard jazz bass tone the Epifani cabs may have worked out better for me, or maybe not, I'm not sure. I do know that so far the Bergs are working great for me, so I'm happy.
     
  9. Tony G

    Tony G

    Jan 20, 2006
    NY
    BTW, this SCREAMS to me that the AE410 would be your better solution IMO.
     

  10. I too prefer the tone of the MTD basses throught the AE410. They work together nicely, with the 'boomy sizzle' of MTD being tightened up nicely but the AE410, and the strong mid voicing of the AE410 being widened a bit by the MTD voicing. That's a very impressive match-up, and I assume the Nordy has a similar tonal fit with the AE (as does my very wide, deep, and sizzly sounding Celinder Update).
     
  11. 64jazzbass

    64jazzbass

    Sep 5, 2002
    Chicago, Il
    For the record, Markbass does make both of their 4 x 10's in 4 ohms. I know there is some dislike on these forums of Markbass cabs but I always recommend trying them on a gig if you can. Much different animal than in the bedroom where they aren't quite as pretty sounding as the Epi or the Berg ( which by the way are both great cabs ). On the gig, the Markbass cabs cut through a mix extremely well, and they also provide a nice fat support with plenty of cushion. Great slap tone as well. Also, they are wicked loud when you need them to be. Just my 2 cents....
     
  12. davidjbass

    davidjbass Supporting Member

    Sep 2, 2006
    Massachusetts
    This is all great info and thanks. I think I am going to go with the Berg because they are made about 30 minutes from where I live. I also like the tolex instead of the carpet. I have a cat that loves carpet covered cabs.

    For the record I have used a Mark Bass cab on a gig. But it was a 8 ohm not a 4 ohm.
    And it did project enough for me. Maybe a Mark Bass 4 ohm would be different but in order for me to try one I would have to special order it from Guitar Center. And that is something I don't want to do. So bring on the Berg!
     
  13. Let us know how you like it. Also, FYI, the AE410 is a spray on coating, not tolex. It's nice, but you need to be a touch careful with it. A cover is HIGHLY recommended for the AE line IMO and IME.
     
  14. jokerjkny

    jokerjkny

    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PHL
    without a doubt the epifani. the berg is ok, but the epifani tweeter is bonkers for that attack!
     
  15. jokerjkny

    jokerjkny

    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PHL
    from what i remember the HLF cab having its a really thick lower middy lower end voicing, which seems to give off this impression of big enveloping fatness. the epifani series 1 ul140 did have this thicker middle mid thing goin' on, but not anymore. the newer epifani series 2 ul410 is thankfully waaaaay more clearer and articulate. but, it still wasnt ever a cab i'd necessarily put in the same catagory as the ampeg.

    on the other hand, the last thing i'd call the AE is "uncolored". again, there's more voicing to my ears w/ the AE410 that's more akin to the ampeg. definitely NOT an "ampeg in bergantino clothing", but enough voicing to make a guy used to ceramic speakers happy. if a player is used to that, getting the epifani and its very different voicing would be a waste of time and energy.

    and holy crap, what i'd give to be in sydney about now...
     
  16. el_Kabong

    el_Kabong

    Jul 11, 2005
    It's always a good time to be in Oz Joker! It doesn't matter how bad the economy gets (and it's good right now, I might hafta buy a couple of sadowskys to help you blokes out) you're never far from a great beach. :smug:
     
  17. davidjbass

    davidjbass Supporting Member

    Sep 2, 2006
    Massachusetts
    Oh man I would love to be in Aussie right now. My 12 year old son is going to end up living there when he gets older. He loves that country.

    Yes I know about the coating on the Berg. (Sounds like a mutant version of the Borg)
    Where can I find a cover for it? It's also nice that I can drive right to the company(Bergantino) and pick it up fresh from the factory. Thanks again.
     
  18. Juniorkimbrough

    Juniorkimbrough

    Mar 22, 2005
    Mississippi / Memphis, TN
    Endorsing Artist: Lakland Basses
    david, you can get a padded cover from Jim or a non padded one from Lecover
     
  19. davidjbass

    davidjbass Supporting Member

    Sep 2, 2006
    Massachusetts
    Cool. Thanks Junior.
     
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