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Finally Bought Tool's "Undertow"

Discussion in 'Recordings [BG]' started by Brad Barker, Feb 23, 2002.


  1. Brad Barker

    Brad Barker Supporting Member

    Apr 13, 2001
    berkeley, ca
    It's very "okay."

    The first three songs are very good: "intolerance" "prison sex" (my fav.) and "sober"

    some of the songs just really drag and/or go nowhere, though.

    4 degrees really suffers from a bad drum sound. it really keeps me from liking it.

    i haven't listened to either secret songs (disgustipated may as well be...it takes like 7 minutes for anything to happen, right?)...yet.

    what is funny:

    my first tool cd was "lateralus." this is easily their best record (you may beg to differ, but i know you're wrong:D ). this is the one cd i've almost considered "perfect." if ticks-n-leeches were cut from the cd, it would be perfect. astonishing, as i am a perfectionist.

    next was aenima, their next best (a little too inconsistent).

    then i got salival, which is pretty good...pretty damn good.

    lastly, undertow.

    that only leaves opiate, which i may as well not own.

    it's a literal "Chiasmos of Tool." (downward spiral...of quality).





    aenima and lateralus have great packaging. undertow's packaging is....disturbing.
     
  2. Opiate is actually a very fine record. I like every track on that album and its the only album of theirs i can say that about except aenima. aenima was them at their paramount and i honestly dont think they will be able to put out another album to match. Laterlaus was pretty good, but i ddnt like schism or ticks and leeches at all. that album for me seems to lack the brutal integrity that seemed consistent with all their other albums and thats probably why i dont like it as much. But, since lateralus was your first album of theirs im sure that would give you a different perspective. You shold deffinetley go get opiate though. I think youll find its much better than salival and undertow.
     
  3. I have Opiate (recently bought), Undertow, Ænima and Lateralus. out of the 4 i would say that Lateralus, Ænima, and Opiate all tie at 1# with me.. i like only a couple of songs on undertow, the others i don't like because they don't have much melody to them
     
  4. I actually think Lateralus was weaker than Æmema and Undertow...
     
  5. Brendan

    Brendan

    Jun 18, 2000
    Austin, TX
    I like Lateralus on par with Aeinma. There's no way I can faithfully say either is better than the other.
     
  6. Brad Barker

    Brad Barker Supporting Member

    Apr 13, 2001
    berkeley, ca
    i'm not SO much into extremely heavy stuff, so that, i believe, is the source of our differences in opinion.

    i just love lateralus b/c it is the perfect balance of light and dark, etc.

    (those "ugly notes" adam hits in "parabola" are just IT for me)

    "undertow" : more "grunge" than most bands labelled so...


    i think "aenima" is great...but i can't just listen to it straight through like "lateralus." (studio version of "pu****" really sucks-ESPECIALLY after hearing the live version).


    more songs could use tablas! (not just tool, either)
     
  7. I think Eanima is Tool's best album. Aenima was my first Tool album, then I bought Lateralus and then Salival. Aenima is far out the best, Lateralus has a slightly better sound and is more consitent, but it misses that magical feeling I get when listening to songs like Push it, Aenema or Third Eye. I don't understand why you guys think Ticks 'n Leeches is such a bad song, I love it, the pure agression coming from the song, you can really hear they were very pissed while writing it. Salival is realy cool to, I especially like the Led Zeppelin cover No Quarter, I don't know the original, but this must be ten times better, especially that beautiful bass solo
     
  8. Brad Barker

    Brad Barker Supporting Member

    Apr 13, 2001
    berkeley, ca
    'snot that i don't like "ticks-n-leeches"

    'sjust that it seems it would be better suited on "aenima" (which is probably the reason why you like it a lot).

    i do like the song, but it doesn't mesh with the album's central message (the album art really gives it away...think about it, nearly all the songs hint at it and "reflection" just about tells you it...funny how i describe this album as being "perfect").

    "ticks" fits along with the masochistic/sadistic themes of their other recordings, but for LATERALUS the lyrical content took a sharp turn and so "ticks" is kinda the "lonely song" of the record.

    for the record: "H." is tool at its best, i believe (sounds way ahead of its time on "aenima").


    now, for discussion purposes: How in the heck do YOU pronounce "aenima" and/or "aenema"

    ME: "aenima"- "AH-nee-ma" (as in the Jungian concept)

    "aenema"- "E-ni-ma" (as in the procedure)
     
  9. JP Bassman

    JP Bassman

    Jun 18, 2001
    Jersey/DC
    Lateralus is the best, if only becasue its a complete CD. Ticks and Leeches is a great song, although i think you're right it doesn't quite fit - but still, an excellent album.

    aenema's problem is that it's more single-based, the songs don't flow like they do on lateralus. Alas, it is still a great record as well. The best part of aenema is that out of 15 tracks, only 9 are actual songs - message to ahrry manback is great! :D

    undertow, probably their weakest of the 4.

    optiate, very very good, especially considering it was their first recording.

    btw, my favorite tool song ever is sober, close second is 46&2. Those songs are pure genius!

    JP
     
  10. well, first off, it IS pronounced AH-nee-ma, I've heard them pronounce it before.

    Secondly, Opiate is an amazing album, it is chock full of pure unbrideld agression. There is just something about it that strikes a cord in you when you listen to it.

    As far as Undertow goes...prision sex, sober, and 4 degrees are the best songs on there in my opinion. four degrees is written beautifully and the bass line is one that I love

    Aenima Is Tool at their creative genious. I have listened to it all the way through at least 50 times

    :eek: . Enough said about that.

    Salival----one of the best live albums I've heard in a while. And yes, No Quarter is amazing.

    Finally Lateralus.....I'm not sure where to put this one, but It definatly has its moments...I just wished there was a little more agression in the album (i figured there was going to be what with all the bs they went through with their record label). Nonetheless, it is a sensational piece of music.

    Tool----they are simply amazing....:D
     
  11. Cantstandsya

    Cantstandsya

    Jul 27, 2001
    Fontana, CA
    I think one big difference is your age. I bought Undertow when you were only seven years old. That's not to say that your opinion isn't valid because you're younger than me.It's just that being the old man that I am ,Undertow is one of those records that i've listened to for so long I regard it as a classic(Just like Janes Addiction's Nothing Shocking ,Faith No More's The Real Thing and The Cult's Electric). Listenable from start to finish .I also encourage you to get Opiate.It's Tool in their rawest form(pre- major label).You wont be dissapointed.
     
  12. LiquidMidnight

    LiquidMidnight

    Dec 25, 2000
    Hmm, interesting discussion. Tool is one of my favorite bands.

    Lateralus is definatley my favorite album though. I like albums that you can listen to as a whole and they feel "complete" and this album has that feel to it. It was definatley their best produced album. Their earlier ones had a "muddy" sound to them, but everything from the guitar, to bass, to drums, comes out crystal clear in this album.

    Aenima is a great album. This is the album that really got me into Tool. It's a mix of their heavyness and progressiveness. (I consider Tool a progressive rock band.) Only problem is, I don't mind non musical tracks for conceptual purposes.......but I don't want them inbetween every freaking song. It's still cool though if you are listening to the album as a whole.

    Undertow is the first Tool CD I ever bought. It's closer to Lateralus IMO. Not real heavy, and leaning more towards song arrangement. Love this album. It has the catchiest songs of Tool's discography IMO. Swamp Song just plain grooves. I love 4 degrees.

    Salival - Very cool packaging indeed. (and was at a very fair price I thought) The live versions of 3rd Eye and Part of Me are amazing. The cover of Zepplin is great too. (Though I do like Zep's orginal version just a tiny bit more)

    Opiate - This was obviously Tool's first record. Not that that's a bad thing. It should where things were going to go. I love this album too. Cold and Ugly always kicks the crap out of me. And I love when Maynard sings in Jerkoff "I shoud play God and just shoot you myself". Kind of displays my attitude on the ***holes of the world who drift through life.

    Hmm, all this talk of Tool has made me decide to listen to them tonight. I haven't listened to Tool in a while, I think it's time I do.
     
  13. Brad Barker

    Brad Barker Supporting Member

    Apr 13, 2001
    berkeley, ca
    "get Opiate...get Opiate...get Opiate...get Opiate..."
    -Just About Everyone

    sure, whatever you say!

    (funny, tool made it their mission to get people to think for themselves-kinda ironic in itself, but look at it in this context, please)

    what is funny: the first time my dad heard the live version of "3rd Eye" right after Dr.....Leary (?) says "Think for yourself..." my dad said "OKAY!"

    cracked us both up!



    i'm sure "undertow" will grow on me (drag me under? hardeharhar) with time.

    it just kinda surprised me in that it was their first record that didn't jump out and say "HEY! I'm absolutely GREAT!" to me, at least.






    so, which has the best packaging?

    Aenima, hands down

    (although the painting of the two cupids and monster is really gaudy and the only reminder that, yes, this is a "metal" band)





    and i'm not watching the grammy's b/c tool is only nominated in one category...at all(like i'd watch it anyway...)
     
  14. JP Bassman

    JP Bassman

    Jun 18, 2001
    Jersey/DC
    hmm, I wonder if they'll even be there. I know how much they all *love* the music industry, as well as their fellow "musicians." What are they nominated for - Best Hard Rock or something like that right? They better win!!!!
     
  15. Brendan

    Brendan

    Jun 18, 2000
    Austin, TX
    Metal performance for Schism.

    I think Lateralus shoulda been up for Album of the year. Lot better than most of the crap pumped out last year (speaking in pop music and mainstream rock/metal, anyways).
     
  16. geshel

    geshel

    Oct 2, 2001
    Seattle
    Order I got them in: Undertow, Ænima, Opiate, Lateralus. Order I like them in (best first): Lateralus, Undertow, Ænima, Opiate. But all are pretty close together.

    I mean really they've all got great songs. Undertow! Stinkfist! Lateralus! :D For me though, Lateralus is amazing - there's an extra "something" there. Maybe Undertow has that too, but it seems to be missing on Ænima. I'm not talking about the quality of the songs or the performance or the recording specifically. It probably has more to do with what was going on in my life when I encountered each of them. . . ?

    Now, since this is a *bass* forum. . . :) I've had teh most fun learning parts from Undertow and Lateralus so far. Ænima is just too muddy to really be able to pick out a lot of it for me, and what I've gotten doesn't really draw me in. Whereas I love playing Intolerance, Sober, Prison Sex, Undertow, The Grudge, The Patient, and Schism.
     
  17. JP Bassman

    JP Bassman

    Jun 18, 2001
    Jersey/DC
    Agreed, in my opinion Lateralus is one of the best albums ever, let alone this year.
     
  18. Brendan

    Brendan

    Jun 18, 2000
    Austin, TX
    Ever might be streching it a bit, but I find it MUCH better than the other people up for album of the year.
     
  19. Jarrod

    Jarrod

    Jan 1, 2002
    Los Angeles, CA
    BLASPHEMERS! ALL OF YOU! *covers ears and convulses*

    TOOL IS GOD, PERIOD

    i got all 5 albums in order, as i have been with them for so long ;)

    ...and they all rule! there is to be no more ranking of the albums! :)
     
  20. frankencow150

    frankencow150 Guest

    Oct 17, 2001
    I thought it was pronounced a little different...

    ON-imm-UH