Floppy sound with Stingray 5?

Discussion in 'Live Sound [BG]' started by theoldmiami, Jun 20, 2008.

  1. First off - I love my sound. It's an 07 Stingray 5 HS. I play through a Markbass TA501 through an Ampeg SVT-410HLF. When I'm playing (usually at churches with really nice PA support), I usually run DI out from my Markbass head, and sometimes I'll just run DI straight through a crappy DI box.

    Anyways... I have found a few live situations where I'll be playing and it feels great on stage. My bass is rich and full and when I push my Stingray it really growls. THEN... I get a copy of a soundboard recording from the gig and it sounds really thin and floppy, especially when I push/drive the bass (pluck the string hard).

    My question is this: I feel like I hate my bass and amp when I hear the recordings, but I don't feel like the recording is an accurate representation of what sound is actually happening.

    So... Could the problem be a bad DI (both in the Markbass head and just a bad DI box)? I'm willing to invest in a Radial JDI or an Avalon U5 if I need to. I can't stand the sound the board is receiving (or at least what's represented on the recording).

    Any help would be appreciated!
  2. It could be a bad DI, bad soundman EQing your signal, or bad recording due to the recorder. Some recording devices don't capture the low end well.

    Why not try using a mic on your cab instead of DI? It's an easy next step that doesn't involve questioning your sound guy, or acquiring a new recording device or DI.
  3. Well, speakers removes a lot of high frequencys, if you cut treble on your amp, add that and it removes a lot of clank and fretbuzz. On the other hand when you use a Di all those nasty highs are there.

    So there are two things you can do:

    Buy a high quality Di.

    or if you want your true sound

    Buy a good mic and a stand and just mic your rig. I mean guitar players never go Di because of those unwanted high frequencys, bass too sounds way better when miked.
  4. I'm pretty sure I wouldn't be allowed to mic my cabinet. I wish I could, but I'd be pretty surprised if they let me. (these churches have soundguys who claim to really know what they're doing)
  5. staindbass


    Jun 9, 2008
    its the soundman ! get the noose, lol. johnny a
  6. It's true some soundmen, really don't care about the bass tone and don't even seem to listen to it. Don't let them intimidate you, if your bass sounds like crap up front, just tell them.

    Also, ask someone with a good ear to tell you how you sound in the room, it might just be that the soundguy Eq's it too sound good through the Pa, and that since it's not a recording session, they just don't care how it's going to sound on record.
  7. donk


    Nov 5, 2006
    maybe your amp is so loud from the stage that the soundman can only put a little bit into the mix and eqs it to add some definition.
  8. Donk - this is definitely true in some instances. Still, what signal I do hear in the mix sounds really thin and very unlike what I know my bass to sound like.

    Does a quality DI REALLY (honestly) make that much of a difference? Would it beef up the signal or what?
  9. 20db pad

    20db pad

    Feb 11, 2003
    I been everywhere, man...
    None. At all.
    This actually sounds like a phase or impedance problem - are the recordings sourced right from the mixing board? If they are, I'd look into making sure that the signal path for the bass is at unity gain, in-phase, and equalized properly.
  10. Not the difference you are speaking of. You are speaking of serious tone issues where it's drastically different than on stage, not transparency or noise issues.
  11. CapnSev


    Aug 19, 2006
    Coeur d'Alene
    ...And there's the red flag for me! The second the sound guy says: "I've been doing this forever, and were going to do it this way!" I automatically think: crappy sound guy.

    If the sound guy says "Do what you need to do and I'll work with it, and I'll fix it if I have to." - that's a quality sound man.
  12. Gearhead17

    Gearhead17 Supporting Member

    May 4, 2006
    Mount Prospect, IL
    Since you described the bass tone you heard as "thin", I have a feeling that the soundguy gave you the smiley face tone through the PA. Which would irritate the living crap out of me....

    The other thing here is: what are they using to record the band? Frequency response of this device? Unless you get the sound recorded with some damn good gear and place it correctly (miced in strategic locations or taking a good mixer board fed signal), a large amount of low end will be missing.

    You should definitely try to get someone out in the audience to tell you what they hear or get someone to play your gear while you wander around listening to the PA signal.
  13. Gearhead:

    Thanks. The gear used to record the services is not cheap but it's simply one of those CD-R recorders. I'm not sure about one of the other churches, but they did have some nice stuff. The one place where it does sound great has a guy who knows what he's doing and they use Radial JDI boxes. I was really just wondering if the DI would matter that much, but it doesn't look like it does.

    Thanks for everyones input.

    I still want an Avalon U5 though!!!
  14. TimmyP


    Nov 4, 2003
    Indianapolis, IN
    Quite often the sound of the bass rig in the room is very boomy (often way to loud in one narrow frequency range, and not loud enough everywhere else). The mixperson has to use a weird EQ on the bass channel so that when the bass from the PA is blended with the bass rig, the bass sounds good in the house. The bad thing is that the bass will likely sound like crap on a board recording. If the mixperson tries to get some low bass from the PA - frequencies that are under the boom and under what the cabinet can do - the recording does not suffer quite as badly. Many mixpersons don't do this. (Of course quite often if they did, bass would be all anyone in the room could hear, unless the mix was run up way too loud.)

    In short, the secret is to EQ the bass rig so it sounds good in the house, not on stage. Then the mixperson won't have to FU the bass EQ in the PA. I've yet to hear this done.