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FYI Celestion 10" Neo's

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by PJaye, Feb 21, 2008.


  1. PJaye

    PJaye

    Feb 2, 2004
    Boston/Worcester
    Here's some data:

    Celestion BN10-200X
    Nominal diameter (mm/in) 10
    Power Rating (AES, W rms) 200
    Nominal impedance (Ω) 8
    Voice coil diameter (in) 2"
    Magnet type Neodymium
    Sensitivity (dB) 96
    Frequency range (Hz) 45-3500
    Coil material Copper
    Former material Polyimide
    Cone material Kevlar loaded paper
    Surround material Cloth-sealed
    Xmax (mm/in) 4
    Gap depth (mm/in) 8
    Voice coil winding width (mm) 16

    Small Signal Parameters
    D (m/in) 0.21/8.27
    Fs (Hz) 49.5
    Mmd (g/oz) 28.55
    Qes 0.26
    Qts 0.25
    Re (Ω) 5.79
    Vas (lt) 54.53
    BL (Tm) 14.86
    Cms (mm/N) 0.13
    Rms (kg/s) 1.676
     
  2. idoru

    idoru

    Dec 18, 2005
    Brisbane, Australia
    Cheers - much better xmax than some of their other 10's I see.
     
  3. Lia_G

    Lia_G

    Oct 27, 2005
    I can't get those T/S specs to work in WinISD pro. I tried entering all of them, and got consistency check failures. Then I went and re-read the WinISD help file and did the data entry as they suggest, letting WinISD calculate a lot of the values. When I do that, the calculated values are way off from the T/S params in the initial post.

    Much or all of this could just be the fact that I'm an absolute novice at this stuff. I may just be doing something stupid in the data entry process. But if others are using WinISD pro, I'm curious if you also have any problems with these T/S parameters?

    Cheers
     
  4. asad137

    asad137

    Jan 18, 2007
    Minneapolis
    Physicist
    One thing that come to mind initially is maybe WinISD is expecting numbers in different units than the T/S specs PJaye provided. If that's the case, you can change the units that WinISD is expecting by clicking on the units next to each box.

    Asad
     
  5. Lia_G

    Lia_G

    Oct 27, 2005
    Yes, and I did initially have a problem with units. Funny how different a micrometer is from a millimeter! :eek:

    After that, though, I think that I got all the units correct. But who knows ... I'll give it another look later tonight just in case.

    Thanks!
     
  6. greenboy

    greenboy

    Dec 18, 2000
    remote mountain cabin Montana
    greenboy designs: fEARful, bassic, dually, crazy88 etc
    WinISD does expect params to be entered in a given order and this ensures comparison across brand/product lines and dispenses with marketing wishful thinking:

    Mms

    Cms - or fs if Cms is not available (then calculates the other)

    then:

    Sd - or Vas if Sd is not available (calculates the other)

    Bl

    Re (calculates Znom, SPL, Qes)

    Qms (calculates Qts)

    Xmax (calculates Vd)

    Pe

    * * *

    As to why values vary from those on some companies' spec sheets, there's a few reasons. First WinISD has environmental variables that may be set differently than what they repesent was like at time of testing. Second, a lot of mistakes and maybe intentional misrepresentations on some companies' sheets. Third, sometimes old version numbers end up not getting replaced after a revision of the driver, while others are.

    Some companies especially in their newer designs are very consistent and it becomes clear that the WinISD environmental variables are responsible for any slight discrepancies, and this is as it should be. That WORKS and gives good predictions.

    Others?... well, housecleaning needs to be done ; }
     
  7. Lia_G

    Lia_G

    Oct 27, 2005
    So in this case, Mms and Qms are not available. Can the speaker be modeled somehow based on the parameters provided, or is too much missing?

    Thanks!
     
  8. greenboy

    greenboy

    Dec 18, 2000
    remote mountain cabin Montana
    greenboy designs: fEARful, bassic, dually, crazy88 etc
    Enter CMs and fs and that'll calc Mms.

    at the right stage enter Qts and Qms will be provided.

    Man, some of these companies are way back in the 80s or worse!
     
  9. Lia_G

    Lia_G

    Oct 27, 2005
    Hmmm ... when I enter things into WinISD as greenboy directed me, I get very different calculated values for these two:
    Qes 0.649
    Rms 60.79271 kg/s

    I also get a calculated Sd of 543.8 cm^2 ... doesn't that seem too large of a number for a 10" driver?

    I went back and checked the units of measurement again, and it looks fine. I'm still pretty sure I'm just doing something boneheaded. Here's a screenshot of the driver entry form if anyone sees something I've done wrong:

    [​IMG]

    Cheers
     
  10. greenboy

    greenboy

    Dec 18, 2000
    remote mountain cabin Montana
    greenboy designs: fEARful, bassic, dually, crazy88 etc
    Better start with a fresh slate for the driver, and don't enter any values not in that list I posted.
     
  11. Lia_G

    Lia_G

    Oct 27, 2005
    That's what I did, clean slate and only entered what you posted. All the values that weren't on your list were calculated.

    Let me try it one more time ...

    Thanks!
     
  12. Lia_G

    Lia_G

    Oct 27, 2005
    Created a brand new driver entry, and filled in the items in the list, and got identical results. Very strange ...
     

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