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Getting drowned out

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by smitty5841, Sep 2, 2008.


  1. smitty5841

    smitty5841

    Aug 31, 2008
    Hey fellas, I looked around and I couldn't really find a solid answer to my question.

    My band has two guitarists and a drummer. We've got a ways to go before the time where we'll start playing at gigs and what not. The guitarists have pretty big amps. I know for a fact that one of them is 50-60W and I'd have to guess the other one isn't far behind from that.

    So I'm looking for something pretty mobile but able to put out loud, deep sound, and of good quality. I don't think I need a stack but to be honest I'm not sure about it. Any suggestions on sizes or watts would be a great help! Thanks
     
  2. Guest043

    Guest043 Guest

    Apr 8, 2008
    my old band had two guitarists, drums and vocal.

    one guitarist used a marshall 4x12 rig. the other used a fender deville 4x10.

    i tried using a LMII with 2 1x12" cabs, rarely was happy with it. then i used a 2x10 ampeg combo amp that pushed out some boomy lows and alright high mids, with nasty highs. i put that on one side of the stage with my 12's on the other side. that had a great sound...nowadays i use any config. of 4 12" speakers...

    that should give you an idea of how much you need with two guitarists, i had 2x10" and 2x12", but the key to that was they were on seperate sides of the stage.

    it depends on what you like. if your alright with 10" speakers, any old 4x10 with a 500(ish) watt head will do you just fine.
     
  3. joegeezer

    joegeezer

    Mar 9, 2005
    Northern Wisconsin
    Avatar Club#12 Eden Club Lucky# 13--USA Peavey Club#37 Carvin Club#5
    A good single 15 cab, that handles alot of wattage, such as a Carvin cab, or similar, and a power amp, such as a Behringer or similar, takes you to about 500 bucks, if you what well for used. Use your present head, or whatever else you may find, as the preamp, and your on your way. A cheap rig such as this will serve you well for many years. If it's not quite loud enough, add another cab, as your wallet swells.
     
  4. mrkreuzschlitz

    mrkreuzschlitz

    Jun 30, 2008
    Dacula, GA
    I'm not sure why, but bass requires MUCH more power than guitars.

    A good rule I heard here is to multiply the guitarists amp watts by four, and if you can, over do it, it doesn't hurt to have headroom.


    In my band, the two guitarists have 100 watt stacks, and I have a 700 watt amp.
     
  5. CraigG

    CraigG

    Mar 14, 2006
    Mechanicsburg, PA
    In the band I work in, we have two guitarists, keyboard player and heavy handed drummer. I have an Eden Nemesis NA650 with a 4 ohm Avatar SB112 Delta LF, that puts me at a point where I can get 440 watts out of the amp. I have hardly ever run beyond 50% volume.

    Craig
     
  6. JimmyM

    JimmyM Supporting Member

    Apr 11, 2005
    Apopka, FL
    Endorsing: Ampeg Amps, EMG Pickups
    It's because bass freqs require a lot more power to push out sound at the same volume as guitar freqs.
     
  7. Rick Auricchio

    Rick Auricchio Registered Bass Offender

    If the guitarists have lots of low end in their tone, they have to cut that. Either that or they don't need a bassist.
     
  8. JimmyM

    JimmyM Supporting Member

    Apr 11, 2005
    Apopka, FL
    Endorsing: Ampeg Amps, EMG Pickups
    Don't tell them that, Rick...a lot of bands are doing that nowadays ;)
     
  9. Well, since no price range is mentioned, and no specific tone, I'm gonna have some fun.

    Go Aguilar DB750 with a DB412 cabinet. Oh, wait, mobile....

    Ok, put casters on the 412!!

    Better yet, find a used Aguilar DB728, get a nice pre to go with it, and attach THAT to the 412.

    Watch the guitarists cry.:bassist::bawl::bassist::bawl::bassist::bawl:
     
  10. stewart8980

    stewart8980

    Apr 11, 2008
    Rhode Island
  11. Gegatso

    Gegatso

    Jan 16, 2006
    St. Louis, MO
    It's my personal opinion that the proper EQ can make you pop out when the guitarists get crazy with their volumes. It has worked for me a million times. Another thing I like to do when volume levels get stupidly loud is just play quieter. Anyone with an ear will realize that the bass is suddenly being drowned out and adjust. If all of this fails, maybe the other guys aren't such great musicians to be playing with.

    FWLIW
     
  12. Adam Bomb

    Adam Bomb

    Mar 26, 2008
    Bezerkely, CA
    Hey, Smitty:

    I used to get drowned out, and I found it unacceptable. I'm all for playing quieter - my current band is a no-earplugs-required, chill-ass scene. But in my previous band, it was clear that my only real option was to smother those little brats. At least, it was my preferred option. So I did my homework, and I bought a 700W amp and two 210s. And I just crushed them. You should have seen the look on the gui****'s face when I rolled in with Street Justice for the first time. It was immensely satisfying.

    I'm not sure what you mean by "mobile", exactly. My rig is considered relatively small here - almost mini. And there are some incredible tiny but loud amps here that people love and I have never played. So I don't know what I am talking about. But I don't think that the bass player is ever going to be the most mobile member of any band. It is just not our lot in life.

    I used to be a frontman. What a smug little punk I was. I'd roll up 5 minutes before the soundcheck with my Shure Beta 58 all wrapped in swaddling clothes like the baby Jesus. Plug into the P.A., and strut around. I was the cat's ass. Those were the days.

    The morning of my most recent gig - as a bassist - I was fretting over all the hauling around I had to do. My full gig gear weighs more than me. And then, a calm came over me. And I knew: I would not enjoy moving my gear to the show. I would love having it there. I would love my sound. I would not like hauling my gear back home. After my gear was back home, I would be glad I'd taken it. And that's exactly how it went.

    Maybe you can find a one-trip rig that can win a pissing contest with lots of headroom that you can afford. But if not, go big and win. Yes, quiet is better. But still I hope that, first, you show them who's boss.

    Like I said, IMO.

    --Bomb :bassist:
     
  13. spaz21387

    spaz21387

    Feb 25, 2008
    Portland oregon
    Usualy you need 3 to 4 times the power of your guitarists amp. So The lowest wattage you should get is 200 watts. Try daddys.com they sell lots of used bass gear.
     
  14. xshawnxearthx

    xshawnxearthx

    Aug 23, 2004
    new jersey
    STRET JUSTICE!
     
  15. dreadheadbass

    dreadheadbass

    Dec 17, 2007
    england
    +1000000000000000000000000

    guitarists have an annoying habit of setting their tone at home in their bedroom so the bass is usually cranked right up when you add another guitarist doing the same thing you get a sound thats too bass heavy for the bass to stand out even with a monster amp
     
  16. ggunn

    ggunn

    Aug 30, 2006
    Austin, TX
    And don't even get me started about left-hand-heavy keyboard players!
     
  17. Fretlessboy

    Fretlessboy

    Nov 29, 2007
    St Augustine Florida
    Endorsing artist GENZ BENZ/HERCULES STANDS/XSonics
    I carry an 8X10 picture of this and tell them "If your volume gets stupid...I finish unloading"

    IMG_1037-1.


    I run this rig a lot... ok most of the time

    img_0473.
     
  18. ryansalmond

    ryansalmond

    Nov 21, 2007
    Canada
    What's the difference between adding wattage and increasing number/size of speakers in terms of loudness?

    If I have a 300 watt head and one 12" speaker, would changing to a 600 watt head and staying with one 12" speaker be louder or quieter than having two 300 watt heads with two 12" speakers?
     
  19. Adam Bomb

    Adam Bomb

    Mar 26, 2008
    Bezerkely, CA
    attachment.
     
  20. Fretlessboy

    Fretlessboy

    Nov 29, 2007
    St Augustine Florida
    Endorsing artist GENZ BENZ/HERCULES STANDS/XSonics
    speaker mass is the single best to increase volume
    A 1200 watt head in to a 110 cabinet will not get as loud as a 400 watt head running a 410...
     

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