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GK Backline 600 amp and looking for a cabinet

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by bogwart, Apr 9, 2014.

  1. bogwart


    Apr 9, 2014
    Hey, long-time reader, first time poster here. Recently I purchased a GK Backline 600. I've owned two separate combo amps and lately we've been playing more shows without PA support. I can't compete with a drummer and two guitars playing through Marshall half stacks.

    I feel like I've read almost every posting on this forum about the right combos of 4x10 cabinets paired with the amp and I've been searching for good quality cabinets on the used market, but either I'm looking in the wrong places, or a good quality used cabinet is hard to find locally. Instinct says to go with a 4ohm cabinet (300 watts at 4ohm, 180 watts at 8ohm) but I could be persuaded to purchase an 8ohm cabinet if it pushed enough quality sound. Anyways....Two questions here:

    #1. Other than this forum and Craigslist, where is another good place to find local used gear? (I'm in the Houston area.)

    #2. I think my 4x10 cabinet search has been narrowed down to a GK cabinet (preferably one of the higher-end models), a Fender Rumble 410, or my preference an Ampeg SVT-410HLF. Which of these three would I be MOST LIKELY to find in the $300 range and is there a cabinet around that price that I should add to my search list?

    I play two basses, a Jazz and a Musicman Stingray (both 4 string) and I'm in a punk band if that helps with style and sound. I prefer lots of mids in my bass hence the love for the Stingray. I "feel" like I need a cabinet with a horn, but I'm open to something that fits my style of playing. Thanks everyone!

  2. http://used.guitarcenter.com/usedgear/index.cfm you can use the ship to store option so you can try the cab in person. Check local Pawn shops as well. Add Peavey, SWR and Eden to your list (just watch for creased cones on the Eden's).
    Honestly go for an 8 ohm cab. Forget how the "watt" number "look". If one 410 won't get loud enough with an 8 ohm you can add a second cab which will more than likely fill your needs. Your only choice with a single 4 ohm 410 would be to move to an amp with 800-1000 watts to get any real improvement in "loudness".
    Plucky The Bassist likes this.
  3. bogwart


    Apr 9, 2014
    So maybe here's where I'm confused. The amp is rated 300 watts at 4ohm, but 180 watts at 8ohm. So, one 8ohm cabinet receives 180 watts? What happens when two 8ohm cabinets are paired together? I get that the overall ohm rating drops to 4ohm, but are the two cabinets splitting 300 watts now (150 to each) or are they splitting 180 watts?

    Thanks for the recommendations on the other cabinets. I have a buddy at Guitar Center and he's on the look-out. I didn't realize you could ship from store to store. Thanks for the tip!
  4. tjh

    tjh Supporting Member

    Mar 22, 2006
    just an observation, but competing with two guitarists with Marshall half stacks, and (from your description) what could be a hard hitting drummer, I am wondering what size venues you will be playing that you need to cover without support ... and what kind of volumes you are playing ...

    ... just reviewing as a single $300 cab might not get you where you want to go with 180 (or even) 300 watts going into it ... I also dont really think of the Ampeg 410HLF as a strong 'mid voiced' cab (as you said you preferred) ... ;)
  5. Bogwart,
    You get the full 4 ohms of the amp with two 8 ohm cabinets (150 watts to each). That said, you probably want to go with 250+ watts on those cabinets to be on the safe side of not blowing speakers if you really crank it.
  6. bogwart


    Apr 9, 2014
    Tjh: Thanks for the feedback. We played a couple of outdoor shows that were not supported by a PA. Other than that, we play venues around Houston that do offer PA support.

    Well, having a family and a band that doesn't make a lot of money will put a small damper on the finances. I'll have to be okay with one cabinet for now at least. Again, I'm looking for the best value that I can find on the used market. I'm curious about your Ampeg comment...do you feel that this particular cabinet isn't a value as in bang for the buck? What do you feel would be better with the GK backline 600?
  7. bogwart


    Apr 9, 2014
    Eriky4003: Aaaah, thanks! That's the explanation that makes the most logical sense, but I don't know that I have read it spelled out like that before. Or, possibly I'm terrible at reading all the way through a very useful and informative post that has math problems and equations. ;-)

    So, for 8ohm cabinets, still look for something that's rated 250+ watts minimum is your suggestion?
  8. If both 8 ohm cabs are "alike" they will each get about 150 watts. BUT you have double the speaker area displacement and able to get more clean output before power compression sets in with each speaker. Speaker displacement trumps raw wattage by a WIDE margin.
  9. I would say 300 watts handling minimum each. The electrical power from the amp is at it's clean output. The amp will put out much more, at least double if driven hard. Speaker cabs run out of the ability to use the wattage fed to make proper sound pretty quick. It most cases they can only accept half of what they are "rated" for cleanly.
  10. Bogwart,
    If you read through some of the 'how many watts' threads you find that the posted rating is when the speaker fails from the speaker coil melting. The problem is, usually the speaker fails mechanically before you get to this point. Based on my readings, I'd say 250 watt cabinet is the minimum you want, likely 300 would be really safe but no 100% guarantee that aggressive playing and/or aggressive (eg. lots of bass) eq won't damage speakers. When equing, mids are your best friend with judicious use of the bass knob.

    Thanks for your thoughts, B-string. Bogwart, he's the man.
  11. tjh

    tjh Supporting Member

    Mar 22, 2006
    My comment on the 410HLF is based on a one time use for me, with a GK 400RB ... and for reference, I like/use sealed cabs usually, and the 410HLF was just not my cup of tea when it came to a nice tight punchy low mid type of deal ... if someone wanted a deeper sounding cab, they would not like what I usually use, just like the 410HLF was not for me and my liking ... I much preferred the Ampeg sealed 410 compared to HLF for a tighter more mid present, punchy type of cab ... If I needed to carry a heavy bottom, it would probably be the other way around ... hope that clears up my comment for you ...

    Edit to add: If you think a single cab will suffice you most of the time, you could also just rent a second cab should the need arise and hopefully the pay will be there to support it ... with that head though, you may want to go with an 8 ohm cab to afford you the option to expand ... although power is very cheap these days ... should you opt for a 4 ohm cab now, you could always add another cab in the future if you went the power amp route using your BL600 as a pre .... just a couple options

    ... but keep in mind, volume increases attained by increasing speaker surface, will almost always win out over more power into limited speaker surface area .. that confuses a lot of folk to start with, when they get hung up on the numbers ... ;)
  12. jeff7bass


    Apr 9, 2009
    Avatar is selling a 600 watt, 4 ohm version of the B410 NEO for 345 bucks plus shipping. It's a very good deal and would be a good match for your 300w head. Dave stands behind his stuff and it a good guy.
    Scroll down on this page and you'll see it.

  13. bogwart


    Apr 9, 2014
    Thanks, this actually makes a lot of sense. More speakers push more air even with lower total watts, if I'm understanding you correctly.
  14. bogwart


    Apr 9, 2014
    Hey, thanks to everyone. Y'all are helping me out so much!

    I ran to my local guitar center last night on the way home because they currently have two GK backline 4x10 cabinets. http://www.guitarcenter.com/In-Store-Used-USED-GK-BACKLINE-410-BLX-II-032314-110027143-i3691228.gc From the reviews I've read on here, these aren't highly rated cabinets, but they are $150 each, 8ohm, and rated at 400 watts. I could get both cabinets and be in my price range. The question is, is this a good value for the money, or would I be better off buying one 4x10 cabinet of a different brand and later adding another cabinet down the road (1x15 or something else)?
  15. Bogwart,
    That is correct! If you buy a 2x10 rated at 300 watts and a 4x10 rated at 300 watts, the 4x10 will be louder because there is more speaker.
    Good luck in your search.
  16. Get the two matching cabs. Your best bet over mixing cabs (4x10 & 1x15, look up threads on this at your own peril) and/or mixing brands. $300 for 8x10 sounds excellent.
  17. Savage_Dreams


    Jan 8, 2007
  18. bogwart


    Apr 9, 2014
    Hmmm...I'm not seeing that price listed for a 410, but the 210's are starting at $349. Am I missing something? I'd like to know more about them for sure!
  19. bogwart


    Apr 9, 2014
  20. jeff7bass


    Apr 9, 2009
    Cut and pasted from the link I posted. (scroll down).

    B410 600 Watt Bass Cabinet $345.
    NEO 4 ohm
    Eminence Custom BASSLITE NEOs

    Call Dave at the number provided and ask him about it. Forget getting two cabs because they'll cost more and the head is somewhat limited power-wise.