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Guessing on Effects

Discussion in 'Effects [BG]' started by beforeitsallove, Mar 18, 2008.

  1. I'm still figuring out what it's going to take to tweak my tone.

    I have sound ideas. But no idea on how to accomplish it (because. I'm an effects noob. i relied on tubes to give me all the hardcore-tonality i needed, now i need a little more oomph as i move from just driving my SVT to who knows where with my solid-state-nation, cleaner tones, whatnot.)

    Here's what i'd like. (warning possibly-hardcore-and-loud-like-substances)

    Song: Julia - Wait Mom and Dad
    (in the slow part i like the... clangy? sound, that's the major emulation issue. I don't know how to procure that... p.s. i do have the rights to temp distribute this song)
    Song: Hoover - Cuts Like Drugs
    (personally between 2 minutes and 4 minutes of that song is what i crave, especially the way the high end fuzzes up a little and then the low end clanks.)
    Song: Neil Perry - Fading Away Like the Rest of Them
    (I don't know if that's 'punch' or what. But also a big fan)
    Song: GlassJaw - Lovebites and Razorblades (Explicit!)
    (They all have like a common sound to them in the way they cut/attack? I want to say it's compression. But when i say cut/attack, I really don't know what i mean yet.)

    What pieces do i need? Is the commonality is a compressor and distortion/overdrive?

    I perused Bongo's list, keep looking around (and yes searching) on anything that those cats above have done. But. No Dice. And would prefer a pedal (if possible). Price range < $200 per piece.
  2. Deluge Of Sound

    Deluge Of Sound Banned

    Nov 8, 2007
    Well, I could say that none of those were really hardcore, but that'd be off-topic.

    In the first clip, the sound quality was so bad I had a hard time trying to figure out what was MP3-compression and what was effect. If you put up a higher-quality version, it'd be way easier.

    The second song isn't on their myspace anymore, so no help there...

    The Third clip just sounded like a punchy bass, not a whole lot of effects will help you there, just EQ and the natural properties of your instrument

    The last one, the Glassjaw song, sounds like a growl-y bass with roundwound strings, probably Rotosounds.

    So my advice to you is to keep your SVT and buy a Fender PJ bass.
  3. JanusZarate

    JanusZarate Low End Avenger Gold Supporting Member

    Feb 21, 2006
    Petaluma, CA, USA
    In the first song... use a pick. I'm certain it's a pick.

    Hoover... huh? It's a marching band. :meh:

    With Neil Perry... I'm pretty sure it's a pick.

    With GlassJaw... guess. ;)

    The songs you've showcased have pick-driven basslines, or at least they sound very reminiscent of what you'd expect from a pick. If you have anything against picks, now would be the time to drop your prejudices and embrace the little plastic triangle.

    I love picks. :D

    BTW... the variations in their sound are more than just the use of a pick, of course. Generally, it sounds like they're using all-tube amps pushed hard into overdrive, and all are EQ'd differently. They're probably all using different basses. But what they have in common seems to be that pickstyle playing sound.

    What they're pushing the amps with may be nothing other than the Gain and Master controls on these amps. Or, it could be some sort of boost or overdrive pedal. It's hard to tell for sure, but I'm willing to bet no pedals are involved. I've rarely seen pedals used by hardcore genre bassists in the bands that play around here - usually, it's just bass to amp, with only a cable in between.
  4. Agreed. But neither here nor there.

    unfortch. it doesn't sound much better on vinyl.

    fixed. Sorry. Wrong link.

    that's punch? i can probably get the closest to that now with my equipment (which, unfortch, isn't an SVT anymore. read later)

    Understandable. I'm talking like 1:10-2:00 for the little clank on the upper register and maybe i'd call that attack?

    Sold it to pay off some thugs back in the day. I'd love to have kept the SVT, 1980's style. It killed people naturally. Now i don't feel like paying the piper to get a classic SVT back.
  5. Jouni


    Feb 8, 2008
    ...the third is just a bass.
    so, the fourth, plain bass, nice growl though, that comes from Rotosounds?
  6. JanusZarate

    JanusZarate Low End Avenger Gold Supporting Member

    Feb 21, 2006
    Petaluma, CA, USA
    Okay, so back to Hoover...

    Sounds like it's more likely some fingerstyle playing with a bass set up for low action. I don't think it's a pick on that one.

    The amp is probably what's creating that fuzzy edge.
  7. lowendgenerator


    Mar 26, 2006
    Glassjaw ruled back in the day. Manuel Carrero, I loved that guy's tone!
  8. Lucky for me. I play with a pick. They are my friends. Unfortunately. I don't play 'hard', which i believe is the commonality between them (and hence, why i'm whining). Small tight, fast motions. None of the windmill like picking motions for me.

    Unlucky for me. No SVT anymore. Solid State blues. That being said. I can venture a guess that there's about 1.3 million threads about "how do i make my SS sound more like a Tube" threads floating around.
  9. JanusZarate

    JanusZarate Low End Avenger Gold Supporting Member

    Feb 21, 2006
    Petaluma, CA, USA
    What SS amp, out of curiosity?

    The first clip you showed doesn't require "hard" playing for that tone. The others may benefits from a more aggressive technique, but it's more dependent on how you set up your amp, IMO, than playing hard. Strings will play a factor as well.
  10. bongomania

    bongomania Gold Supporting Member Commercial User

    Oct 17, 2005
    PDX, OR
    owner, OVNIFX and OVNILabs
    Yep, there sure are. :) Unfortunately nothing hits the nail exactly on the head but fortunately there are many pedals which can give "bite", "fizz", "edge", etc. qualities to help rough up your SS tone.

    Look into e.g. a DHA valve pedal or the EBS valvedrive or the EHX English Muff'n. They're just tube preamps, but again they can get you some of the rough stuff you may like.

    Also while I don't think you're looking for a compressor per se, tube amps provide natural compression, especially when they're driven hard. So you were hearing compression, just not from a compressor pedal. :)
  11. Carvin B1500. (+ proco rat)

    I've rolled the past few years with a circle takes the square like setup. (carvin, tbird, 810)

    I'm being asked to play more parts with only the drums. Where I can get a fancy sound when the guitars are in (it took a few weeks of toying with the knobs to mix), now with just the drums it sounds very, uh, mediocre and uncolorful. Shame.
  12. JanusZarate

    JanusZarate Low End Avenger Gold Supporting Member

    Feb 21, 2006
    Petaluma, CA, USA
    Hmm... never used a Carvin. I've always been more of a GK guy. Grit and warmth are not things that GK amps lack. :)

    When it comes to mellow parts of songs, I usually depend on my 2001RB's overdrive channel or a few effects pedals at my disposal.

    In your case, I'd take Bongo's suggestion - a tube-based overdrive pedal may be right up your alley. Provided that you like your amp, of course... because replacing it is always an option, too. ;)

    Hmm... there's actually a Carvin store not too far from me, in Sacramento. I may have to try out some Carvin amps for reference's sake next time I visit my parents up there.
  13. i know about the GK love. I roll with a RB400-III combo at home, and find no problem making beautiful squishy noises. yet 280 Watts isn't gigable in a sextet with a drummer who play with thunder-toms.

    Carvin though. Is interesting. Just put it that way. The drive does some pretty cool things and the EQ drives me nuts (not in a bad way, but in a, really kinda sensitive noticing way).

    Return from the OT.

    I know the english muff'n is under 200. Is there anything else? I mean, I've been known to find SVT's or Traynor Y200's for under 700. 200 dollars is a pedal fix. 300 dollars is a might as well wait a little while longer and add another head sorta moment.
  14. JanusZarate

    JanusZarate Low End Avenger Gold Supporting Member

    Feb 21, 2006
    Petaluma, CA, USA
    DHA pedals are under $200, and they're highly regarded for bass overdrive.

    There are also "tubesim" style pedals like the EBS Multidrive under $200.
  15. If you like the sound of the GK, one thing to try out is to use the GK as a preamp; that is, use it for EQ purposes, and use a Post-EQ line out to send to your larger Carvin amp.
  16. urm, sorry i didnt listen to the clips (im a looser i kno) but just throwing it out there - Sansamp Bass Driver DI?

    it gets alot of love AND hate here- but u mentioned 'clank' and the sansamp has it in spades, i can get a good steve harris-type tone with roundwound strings and a Fender Jaguar Bass, and i can rock a geddy lee-type tone, personally i dont really boost the gain much (about 12 o'clock) but i do boost the presence control, just enuf so that its clanky as hell when you dig in.

    BUT a real tube pedal will more than likely sound better, i used to have the English Muff'n and it was gorgeous, but i often freak out about my lowend if im playing a pedal that isnt specifically for bass (which is why i now use a clean blend with a Blues Driver and a Metalzone)


    the first few seconds is my clean tone using my sansamp and a clean blend (sansamp has its own clean blend too)
    for reference my settings are:
    Level: 12 o'clock
    Blend: 12
    Treble: 9
    Bass: 2.30
    Gain: 12
    Presence: Maximum

    but its important to note that im using 2 chanels mixed together: one is sansamp, one is clean (with the Boss Blues Driver)- and its about a 50/50 mix on my mixer (boss line selector)
    its not an award winning tone, but its definitly clanky, and thats only half of what it can do. im sure ur aware of the sansamp, but if ur not, im more than happy to record clips of mine (without blended chanels and other fx, etc), although to be fair, tube pedals like the DHA ones are relatively inexpensive and are hand made. and if you prefer your amps eq and such, then maybe they're a better route for you
  17. ok, listened to a couple of the tracks, maybe all you need is an eq pedal with a high-mid boost? i think on that first song it sounded like the bass was recorded twice, once with a low-cut, but stull punchy, and once with a fuller, deeper sound. i dont know.

    sansamp gives what i like to call 'studio tone', it smooths out the mids a bit, and makes ur rig sound 'bigger' (this is so subjective, i dont even know why im bothering)

    the EHX steel leather works kinda like a compressor,as its a Bass Expander, with level and threshold, basically you set the envelope cut off point (eg: how hard ur playing b4 the effect kicks in) and when u hit that threshold, it gives you a high-mid boost, i had mine for less than a day tho, its a good idea but i didnt feel id get £60 worth of use out of it.
    i wanted to nickname mine Mr. Clank - if u follow the link i sent before, and check out the other tunes ive got 4 Steel leather demos.

    oh yeah, i guess its important to mention that on all my clips i play fingerstyle, very hard.
  18. Very true. I like my back too.
    61LB (Carvin and Tuner and Case) + 68LB (GK212) + 171 LB (Ampeg 810) = 290 lbs.
    You know you're a bassist when your gear weighs more than you. Duh.

    I like the idea though. I'll try it out tomorrow.
  19. JanusZarate

    JanusZarate Low End Avenger Gold Supporting Member

    Feb 21, 2006
    Petaluma, CA, USA
    Wait, does that mean I'm a guitarist? My gear weighs a little more than half of what I do! :eek:

    You could always go all-GK if you do like the tone. Maybe even check out their Neo series cabinets, if weight is a concern. I gig with a 2001RB and Neo 212... it's all I need to compete with the rest of the band. Realistically, the 2001RB is overkill given what cab I'm using, but I'm a "what if" man... and what if I get a bigger cabinet?

    I wish I had a Neo 412, though, simply for show. :D
  20. it's one of those if not a, it doesn't mean you're b sorta thing with the weight thing.

    i like my cab. i like the way my carvin sounds.

    and i know we've reached cross board-potential here. my problem is. this requires a complete retool of my sound. i can't get the cleans i like from the carvin when i use it as a power amp because i'm not using it's eq. *hrumph*

    every solution i find makes another problem arise!

    thanks so far for all the help

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