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Guitarts that feel they need to play on 11!

Discussion in 'Band Management [BG]' started by Breslin dp, May 2, 2010.

  1. I recently started jamming with a great bunch of guys, that happen to play progressive metal. The problem is the guitarist play way to loud. They both have 4x12's with 200 watt heads and they sound awesome. I have a GK 2001 rb and a GK Neo 410 and I can barely keep up with them. I have asked them to turn down and they said that they have to play loud to hear themselves over the drummer. So, I guess if I want to keep playing with them i going to have to invest in another 410. I just recently downsized to go figure.

    So my question is this how do you guys out there deal with
    guitarist that feel they have to play at 11 on their amps?

    I don't feel that I am asking to much from them.
  2. TortillaChip520


    Jun 3, 2008
  3. SpamBot


    Dec 25, 2008
    St. Paul, MN
    Install l-pads in the 412s without their knowing.
  4. David1234


    Jun 1, 2004
    Sydney, Australia
    Endorsing Artist: SWR Amplifiers
    Firstly, explain politely that it is a problem for you, and ask if they can help solve it. If they are unwilling, follow the advice above and quit.

    But if they're willing to act like a team, the most likely solution is going to be the one where you raise their quad boxes to shoulder height and they'll be able to hear themselves way clearer. When a guitar amp is too low and pointing at the guitarists' legs, they fill the room up with so much bass that you'll be in a full volume war. If you try to keep up by adding a proportionate wattage (say 2000 watts and at least an 8x10) it's a bit like driving through a fog with your high beams on.... safer to quit.
  5. stinger12345


    Jan 24, 2009
    Hayward, CA
    I've only been in 2 bands, but I don't think buying more gear is a way to solve problems. You guys just need to play quieter as a whole. Tell the drummer to play a little quieter of possible, and see if that allows the guitarists to turn down.
  6. Same problem with my band. I ended up getting a SWR 6x10 and a Genz Benz Shuttle 9.0. Now they ask me to turn down :)
  7. waleross


    Nov 27, 2009
    South Florida
    How about an Ampeg sVT4pro + (2)810E's in stereo? You 'll have them on their knees...or quit join a bluegrass group and play string bass which will save your hearing.
  8. derelicte


    Dec 25, 2007
    i'm a gui**** too playing off a 1x12 tube 30W tube amp and i can hear myself fine over drums... either you're playing in a garage/confined space or they're just giving u excuses. chances are, it's a volume war between the 2 guitarists that only on loud enough volumes will they both get what they want.
  9. Kaleb


    Nov 19, 2009
    We have a clear plexiglass shield for the drummer + we have these little blue gell pads for the drums + when practicing he uses a different less complete quieter set of drums + he used these bundle sticks which are really quiet. It's all about the drummer. Then the guitarists have no excuse. Each person should stand as close as possible to their sound, except for mics of course. I don't have all the answers. I would like to know exactly what the best practice for that would be especially in order to save my hearing.
  10. xxfaux_punkxx


    Mar 18, 2010
    unplug their amps.
  11. We have the same problem in one of my bands. The lead guitarist is soooo freakin' loud. He has his amp up by his head and still cranks that thing to the point where I just quit playing and the singers can barely hear themselves. I've talked about this to the band leader and we both ask him to turn down but it always finds a way to creep back up.

    Good luck on your endeavor to win the volume wars. I gave up on it. I know I have the loudest rig in the place but I don't need to start cracking walls and shattering windows.
  12. Love your description!

    At that kind of volume level, either you'll have to wear some very attenuating ear-plugs, or your ears will be self-compressing ... either way it will sound like toneless mud.

    How hard does the drummer play when on his own (check him out when warming up etc?) Is he capable/willing to bring his level down? If he's driving the volume war, then that's the way it will probably stay.

    Personally, unless they were a very successful band paying me big $, i would rather find another band than drag 2 410s or an 810 around to weekly rehearsals and gigs.
  13. Thanks for all the input guys. I have never had this type of problem before I started playing with these guys. Usually with my 410 cab and my head it's a bit of over kill at practice I am going to go to practice again on Wednesday. I will let you guys know how it goes.
  14. Meatbass


    Apr 30, 2010
    Frazier Park, CA
    I have the same problem. Volume always seems to rise and rise during practice and my 410's are at their limit. It's stupid.
  15. MatticusMania

    MatticusMania LANA! HE REMEMBERS ME!

    Sep 10, 2008
    Pomona, SoCal
    Have the drummer pla with some dynamics, he should play only as hard as he needs to to suit the song.

    Suggest to your guitarists that they alter their EQ. They most likely have too much low end in their EQ and its blending with both the Drums and Your Bass. Also, as said, either raise their cabs higher, or lean them back, so the sound doesnt sit on the floor.
  16. jive1

    jive1 Commercial User

    Jan 16, 2003
    Owner/Retailer: Jive Sound
    One of the biggest causes of volume wars (besides ego) is ear fatigue. Once your ears suffer fatigue, they lose the ability to hear certain frequencies and things don't sound the same anymore.

    The ears have a way of protecting themselves through what is called a Temporary Threshold Shift. The ears become less sensitive to sound, thus the need to turn things up again to get the same perceived volume. But if someone is continually exposed to loud sound pressure levels, temporary threshold shift becomes permanent hearing loss.

    You can get ear fatigue from hours of mix down, or you can get it from one quick blast. I have suffered TTS caused by one loud cymbal crash that I was too close to, as well as singly loud guitar passage. In in the OP's case, it may be they are getting TTS within the first few minutes of rehearsal causing them to continually increase the volume to make up for temporary hearing loss.

    My suggestion?
    Start out quieter, and stay that way.
    Or have everyone wear earplugs, so at least they won't get TTS, and you won't have to continually crank up.

    But me, I'd quit.
    Tinnitus is serious stuff. Serious tinnitus combines deafness and a constant ringing in the ears. That would be Hell on Earth for me.
  17. I'd be willing to bet they have their bottom ends cranked to give it that nice 'full' sound that sounds so awesome when they're practicing alone, but washes out the bassist when they jam with the band. Loud is one thing, but it's likely that they're trampling on your piece of the spectrum as well. If you can look into that, and, if that's the case, ask them to roll off their lower freqs a bit, you might find some sort of compromise.
  18. salcott

    salcott Supporting Member

    Aug 22, 2007
    NYC, Inwood.
    jive1 nails it. If the drummer can only play loud, he needs to learn how to play soft with the same intensity. If the gui****s can only get their sound by cranking their amps, they should get smaller amps. A guitar 30 watt tube guitar amp is plenty for 90% of rehearsal rooms. You should be wearing earplugs regardless; let the others be deaf in ten years.
  19. MN_Bass

    MN_Bass Supporting Member

    Sep 21, 2008
    I finally got my two gui****s to turn down, along with changing the eq on there guitars, the last show we played people commented on how well they could hear everything and how great everything sounded. Every gui**** I have ever played with says thats how they get there tone, what a bunch of bs.
  20. jive1

    jive1 Commercial User

    Jan 16, 2003
    Owner/Retailer: Jive Sound
    My rule of thumb. One notch on the mid control= three notches on volume. You boost the mids, and you won't need to boost the volume as much.

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