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Help me with my cabinet decision please?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Melvin7822, May 23, 2004.


  1. Melvin7822

    Melvin7822 Supporting Member

    May 11, 2004
    Broomfield, CO
    Ok, so here's the debate. Should I get two Eden D410XSTs or should I get an Eden D410XLT and an Acme Low B-4? Obviously if I go with the Eden and Acme, I'll have to purchase another power amp. I own an Acme Low B-2 and the only inherent problem I see with Acmes is what you lose in weight for the cabinet, you gain in weight for the power amp :D . I haven't found an Eden D410XST to be able to try one out yet. Has anyone tried one yet? Or maybe I should get an Eden 210XST and pair it with my B-2?
     
  2. Frank Martin

    Frank Martin Bitten by the luthiery bug...

    Oct 8, 2001
    Budapest, Hungary, EU
    Hows about a 410 & 115 or 118 setup? This way you will have way more lows and a fuller sound :cool:
     
  3. Frank Martin

    Frank Martin Bitten by the luthiery bug...

    Oct 8, 2001
    Budapest, Hungary, EU
    Not to mention that these can be found in different power ratings, so you wont have to buy another power amp, and for less $$
     
  4. Melvin7822

    Melvin7822 Supporting Member

    May 11, 2004
    Broomfield, CO
    ::bump:: Anyone else?
     
  5. Lockout

    Lockout

    Dec 24, 2002
    Illinois
    Yeah, 2 4x10s sounds like overkill. Bad for your back too. :)

    I agree with SMASH, adding another 2x10 would probably be a good idea.
     
  6. Melvin7822

    Melvin7822 Supporting Member

    May 11, 2004
    Broomfield, CO
    Yeah, I was leaning towards another 2x10 too. But I was just wondering how that would cut it in a large venue or outdoors for that matter. I figured 2 4x10s would be more portable than an 8x10. If I run 2 2x10s I'm also afraid I might have to biamp them because an Eden 210XLT only runs at 350 watts. I don't think and Eden 210XLT can handle a low E and low B at the levels an Acme Low B-2 can. Has anyone tried an Eden 210XST? (The reason I ask about Eden is because it's the sound I'm looking for. I love the classic sound of Eden cabinets couple with the sound of a J-bass through an Alembic F-2B). <br><br>My main concern is available headroom. 400 watts never cut it for me in the past even with the mids raised up against two guitarists. The majority of the shows I play are 500 people+.<br><Br>
    So I guess my final question would be this. In your opinion, what would sound better and give me enough headroom for big shows and project well; a single Eden D410XST (which runs at 1,000 watts RMS) or an Eden D210XLT (350 watts) and an Acme Low B-2 (outputs 350 watts when you give it enough juice)? And if you chose the second choice do you feel it would be necessary to biamp it?
     
  7. jock

    jock

    Jun 7, 2000
    Stockholm, Sweden
    If you go with the Acme/ Eden combo you´ll probalbly have to run them in stereo as the Eden will be way louder when getting the same amount of power as the Acme. Just a thought.
     
  8. Melvin7822

    Melvin7822 Supporting Member

    May 11, 2004
    Broomfield, CO
    Thanks Jock. I did realize this and that is why I would be pushing 650 watts into the Acme and 400 watts into the Eden if I ended up going with this configuration.<Br><br>

    Has anyone tried any of the Eden XST series yet?
     
  9. Melvin7822

    Melvin7822 Supporting Member

    May 11, 2004
    Broomfield, CO
    What to do, what to do....
    Should I get an Eden D410XST or should I get an Eden D210XST (or D210XLT) and use it with my Acme Low B-2?
    Things that are important to me are being able to cut through the mix, feel the lows, and project to the house. I primarily play rock music and when I do play jazz I just use my low B-2 because I never have to be <i>that</i> loud. I like the Eden sound with the Aguilar DB-680 and Alembic F-2B.

    I'm at a disadvantage because of my location, I never had the pleasure of auditioning an Epifani, a Bergantino, an EBS, or an Aguilar as far as 2x10s and 4x10s.

    The way I figure it is that my Low B-2 can handle the lows better than anything out there and then I can just use a different 2x10 for whatever sound I need. So it's like having whatever 4x10 I want but just swapping out the top. My only concern is how it would sound. If I were to get a 2x10, I'd want to get one that would be able to hold its own by itself.

    Should I just get a 4x10? Would an Acme/Eden 2x10 combination sound better and be able to hold its own against two raging guitarists and a crazy drummer. Are there 4x10s and 2x10s out there that share similar qualities with Eden but sound better? Please help me out.
     
  10. chiplexic

    chiplexic

    Apr 21, 2004
    Massachusetts
    I've read more than one post where people say they found 2-10" to be just as loud as 4-10". So they opted for 2-10". If projecting is your concern those 2-10" with couple hundred watts thru them surely will.
    On a side note ,you seem concerned with volume in big venues. Which got me thinking ,when I played medium to large clubs they had pretty heavy duty PA systems and all I needed my cab for was to assure I had a place to stand and hear myself if the mix was less than favorable. I had 2-10" and 1-18" equaling 4 ohms powered by 200w rms @4 ohms.The 18" did what your Acme does,same purpose and the 10's did the projecting.
     
  11. Melvin7822

    Melvin7822 Supporting Member

    May 11, 2004
    Broomfield, CO
    Thanks chiplexic. Those are some very reassuring words. Unfortunately, being in an underground rock scene, you get stuck with big venues that have less than favorable PAs and the bass ends up getting lost in the mix the further out you go. But I definitely am getting a good feeling about this 2x10 idea. If I don't like the cabinet sound, I can just buy a different 2x10 which is a lot cheaper and more convenient than buying a 4x10. Yes, 4x10s sound different from 2x10s because there are more phase cancellations going on and of course the apparent loudness goes up with the number of drivers. I think if I do this idea I'll stack the 2x10s end on end for more dispersion.
    My only other question to chiplexic is: Did you biamp that rig or run both cabinets full range. I'm thinking I'm gonna have to biamp so I can get a clean sound. Let me know what you think.
     
  12. chiplexic

    chiplexic

    Apr 21, 2004
    Massachusetts
    I didn't bi amp but your Acme cab makes it a good idea for you to vary wattage to each cab. Especially the way the low b eats up wattage. Ya , I do remember some bad club PA's now that you mention it. MAN,They can be a bummer. LOL
     
  13. You don't want to bi-amp your Low B-2! It is a full range cab and it is not meant to be bi-amped. Powering it with a stereo power amp in conjunction with another 2x10 (both run full range) should yeild the results you're looking for. Just adjust the two channels to match each other in volume.

    I have played on the Eden 210XST and found it to be quite similar to the Acme in the respect of being generally "uncolored" in it's overall sound. In your particular situation though I would suggest pairing the B-2 with an Eden 210XLT. This will give you the strong mid presence Edens are known for and your Acme can continue to do what it does.

    I forget who but I remember someone on here pairing their B-2 with a 2x8 Euphonic Audio cab and raving to no end about the sound. You could ditch the idea all together though and do what I plan on doing... getting a QSC PLX 3402 and another 4 ohm Low B-4 (making a total of 2!). Someone else on here recently did that. I'm waiting to hear (feel) their results!
     
  14. Melvin7822

    Melvin7822 Supporting Member

    May 11, 2004
    Broomfield, CO
    Yeah, I don't know why I was thinking I had to biamp the Acme. I was thinking that because I was gonna attenuate the tweeter and mid, but in fullrange, I could probably use it to add some detail that the Eden might not be giving me.

    My only concern was an Eden D210XLT being able to handle a low B without breaking up at high volumes. So now I'm thinking of running the Acme full range and running the Eden on the high out of my crossover and cutting it off at 80Hz.

    Let me know if you think I'm on the right track.
     
  15. No, not quite. You would want to run both cabs full range. You will need a stereo power amp though that can put out at least 500 watts per channel into whatever impedence your Acme is (4 or 8 ohms). What amplifier are you using now?
     
  16. Melvin7822

    Melvin7822 Supporting Member

    May 11, 2004
    Broomfield, CO
    I have a Stewart World 2.1. In which case I am pushing 650 watts into my 4 ohm Acme. I only suggested running the Eden from the high out in order to avoid distorted bass at high volumes. The 210XLT only handles down to 48Hz anyways and while it could probably handle 30 Hz from a low B, I don't see why I'd want it to do that and sacrifice my headroom. From 80Hz and up I'd still get the characteristic Eden sound.
     
  17. Melvin7822

    Melvin7822 Supporting Member

    May 11, 2004
    Broomfield, CO
    ::bump::