Dismiss Notice

Psst... Ready to join TalkBass and start posting, make new friends, sell your gear, and more?  Register your free account in 30 seconds.

High Damping Power Amps

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by DEVILMAN, Jul 27, 2003.


  1. DEVILMAN

    DEVILMAN

    Nov 24, 2001
    New York,NY
    HELLo All,

    Does anyone here have any recommendations or presently use a power amp with a high damping rate(above 1000) like a Crown Macro Tech or Crown Studio Reference amp(20,000 & VERY expensive)? The K series hasn't gotten too many good reviews as far as durability & low-end punch.

    The reason for my inquiry is that I just picked up a Whappo Grande & would like to have a new power amp with a high ratio so it can keep my sub-lows tighter at higher volumes. I know there is more to an amp than this feature but the amps I have mentioned are very favored for bass playing & industrial sound systems in their sound too.

    You can't fathom the size of this speaker until it's in front of you or next to a "wimpy" 15"!


    thanks,
    ~S~
     
  2. DEVILMAN

    DEVILMAN

    Nov 24, 2001
    New York,NY
    fast slapper,

    They don't tell you much on the site about the specs unless you load them down? I don't think they have the wattage necessary for what I'm doing, thanks a bunch though!

    later,
    ~S~
     
  3. Nightbass

    Nightbass

    May 1, 2001
    Seattle, WA
    The K Series WHAT??? Devilman, what "reviews"? That single bad review in Harmony-Central?

    The Crown K Series is widely used in live audio and installs and there have not been any reliability issues that I am aware of. The K2 in particular is popular for driving subs. It has a conventional big-iron power supply like the MacroTech. The reason you don't see more of them is because of the cost and the need for empty rack spaces for inter-amp cooling when using multiples of them.

    That said, I use the K Series for bass and it's one of the best power amps for that purpose. I'd wholeheartedly recommend the K2 for driving a Whappo Grande, if you prefer a fanless amp. Otherwise the Macrotechs can't be beat.

    Nightbass
     
  4. chucko58

    chucko58

    Jan 17, 2002
    Silicon Valley, CA, USA
    I paid for all my gear myself. Well, me and MasterCard.
    Since Bob Lee is presumably off on Sundays, I'll put in my 2 cents' worth.

    Damping factor is more or less irrelevant, as long as it's at least in the hundreds. What ultimately determines the damping factor as seen by the speaker is the speaker cable, and the wiring inside the cab.

    Most modern solid-state power amps should drive the Whappo Grande just fine.

    Mark Wright (the AccuGroove founder who uses the login Whappo Grande on this board) was using a Stewart World 2.1 in his personal rig a year ago. I vaguely remember that he upgraded his rig recently, but I don't recall.
     
  5. fast slapper

    fast slapper

    Dec 11, 2001
    Fresno, CA
    The specs might be underrated. I've never heard one, but from what i've read it seems to be top class. Somebody mentioned it had more headroom than a QSC2402 (2400w), and sounded more defined, clear, and musical.
     
  6. jokerjkny

    jokerjkny

    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PA
    a whappo grande?!?!? :eek:

    Dev, you bad man... :cool:

    when's your next gig, so i can experience this onslaught?
     
  7. Pretty much any decent modern power amp will have adequate DF to drive that cab. An actual DF of about 10 or more is perfectly acceptable. All of the modern amps I can think of have DFs at least in the hundreds...
    I wouldn't count any amplifiers out on the basis of DF unless it was really low (like less than 100).
    cheers!
     
  8. DEVILMAN

    DEVILMAN

    Nov 24, 2001
    New York,NY
    I'm Back,


    Sorry for the delay in response here, my neighborhood had a long severe black out last night & I just got in from work now!

    Nightbass: I did a THOROUGH review of all past post concerning the K-2 back to '00 on THIS board! Some people loved it, a lot spoke badly of them. I'm only going by what people here had experienced with it. Do a search here & look for yourself. On paper it looks great...

    Mark, Chucko58 & Fast slapper: Thanks a bunch, you guys are usally on the money here!

    Joker: My man! I will most certainly let you know when I'm in the 'hood doing a gig, probably end of Sept or mid Oct, I'm going to Europe with my band for a tour(not bringing the heavy artillery though). Let me know what's up with you & your gig's.


    I'm up in the air right now for another QSC PLX(2402) or the Crown K-2. Does anyone here have any info on differences as far as sound & low-end capabilities with them?


    thanks,
    ~S~
     
  9. chucko58

    chucko58

    Jan 17, 2002
    Silicon Valley, CA, USA
    I paid for all my gear myself. Well, me and MasterCard.
    My main rig has a PLX 2402 and a pair of Acme Low B-2s. I play 5- and 6-string basses through it. There is no shortage of low end - in fact, sometimes I have to turn the bass knob down on the preamp!

    The only thing to watch for with the PLX is the input impedance is kinda low in parallel mono mode, about 3 Kohms. My previous preamp lost low end because it couldn't drive that load properly. What are you using for a preamp?
     
  10. DEVILMAN

    DEVILMAN

    Nov 24, 2001
    New York,NY
    Chucko58,

    For the Whappo I use a Kern, for my other channel I use an Eden Navigator with my QSC PLX 3402.

    I think both these pre's have enough voltage output to get the most out of either a QSC or Crown.

    If I bridge the amp, do I need more output voltage to drive it fully compared to un-bridged & stero?



    thanks,
    ~S~
     
  11. Bob Lee (QSC)

    Bob Lee (QSC) In case you missed it, I work for QSC Audio! Gold Supporting Member Commercial User

    Jul 3, 2001
    Costa Mesa, Calif.
    Technical Communications Developer, QSC Audio
    Nope! The amp will put out double the voltage, but it will also have double the voltage gain of a single channel.
     
  12. lo-freq

    lo-freq aka UFO

    Jan 19, 2003
    The Republic of Texas
    Bob,

    I have a PLX1602; I assume that bridging has no effect on input sensitivity, correct?

    SideTrack: I would like to have the option to run my StingRay 5 (active preamp) direct into my 1602, but it won't drive it beyond about -20bd.
    Is there an easy mod to increase input sensitivity on these amps?

    Thanks.
     
  13. Bob Lee (QSC)

    Bob Lee (QSC) In case you missed it, I work for QSC Audio! Gold Supporting Member Commercial User

    Jul 3, 2001
    Costa Mesa, Calif.
    Technical Communications Developer, QSC Audio
    Yes, that's what I said.

    Is that -20 dBu? -20 dBV? It's possible to mod the amp to increase the gain, but that's really a lot of increase there.
     
  14. lo-freq

    lo-freq aka UFO

    Jan 19, 2003
    The Republic of Texas
    Thanks; I'm not an EE or a techno freak, so I didn't deduce the answer (to my question) from your reply to D-man (though looking at it again now I guess I should have), but I got it this time.
    [Sorry if it's been a long day for you.]

    I haven't measured the amps output. It lights up the "-20dB" indicator lights pretty good, so I assume it could really be anything below -10db (I didn't find in the owner's manual whether the indicators are dBu or dBV) and I don't know how much voltage the SR5 puts out.

    Darn, come to think of it, I don't know sh!t (& thick as a brick).

    I don't want to make the amp so sensitive that I can't use it with a regular preamp.

    I guess I need either a transformer or something like the Avalon U5. Supposedly Jim Bergantino is working on a box that provides some type of voltage boost and has a DI out.

    We appreciate you Bob dude.
     
  15. jokerjkny

    jokerjkny

    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PA
    holy crap!!! :eek:
     
  16. lo-freq

    lo-freq aka UFO

    Jan 19, 2003
    The Republic of Texas
    Here's a bad boy.

    4000W @ 2 ohm & 6dB Dynamic Headroom. BIG BADDA BOOM!
    [And only 220 lbs (where's the pallbearers when you need 'em?).]
     
  17. Phat Ham

    Phat Ham

    Feb 13, 2000
    DC
    Is this mod a simple voltage divider type thing or is it a little more complicated than that? I haven't looked inside my PLX2402 yet. I don't really have a need to increase the sensitivity; just curious.

    As many others will attest, the QSC PLX series are a kickin' line of power amps. I didn't think I'd be able to hear much difference between my PLX and the Carvin I used to use, but the PLX just sounds so much more transparent. i.e. what goes in is what comes out, just with a lot more power.
     
  18. Bob Lee (QSC)

    Bob Lee (QSC) In case you missed it, I work for QSC Audio! Gold Supporting Member Commercial User

    Jul 3, 2001
    Costa Mesa, Calif.
    Technical Communications Developer, QSC Audio
    lo-freq,

    Sorry, I'm in the process of moving, so it's been a long month. ;)

    The PLX amps have a maximum gain of 40x, or 32 dB. Increasing the gain 20 dB would give it a gain of 400x. Personally, I think that would put a really severe limit on what you can do with the amp, and if you ever decide to sell it, you'd have a hard time finding someone who would want a PLX set up that way.

    In addition, the PLX amp doesn't give you any EQ or processing, so I would think for convenience and versatility's sake you should go with some kind of a preamp, even if it's just a little gain box.
     
  19. lo-freq

    lo-freq aka UFO

    Jan 19, 2003
    The Republic of Texas
    Man I hate moving; I'm about to start that again myself. "I feel your pain, man."

    Thanks; yeah I agree with you about some type of boost external to the power amp.