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Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by cgworkman, Aug 13, 2005.
How do you identify a pre-Fender SWR Goliath III?
Thanks in advance -
hmm well i would just grab a series 2 and slap on a series 3 grill. then i think it would be a sure bet.
Not quite. A GII is a different animal compared to a GIII.
I do not know, but I would start with the serial numbers. Is there a peice of gear that you are considering buying? Maybe you could check with Fender . The addition of the Ohm rating on the front of the grill of the G III is Fender.
Can somebody give a real good description of the differences between the GII and the GIII. I hear the II's sound better, but what would be the odds of having to re-cone one since it is guaranteed to be used?
Some say the tone of the II is better than the III, though the III is louder and front-ported, which I feel is an advantage.
All SWR amps are dated--it's handwritten on the circuitboards and trannies. I've never opened up my Goliath III (pre-fender), but it probably has a date on the crossover or something.
The reason I was asking was that I've been told that SWR's QC has been pretty bad since Fender took over. Does any one have any opinions on that?
As the owner of a post-Fender Mini Mo' pre who had to go through both Musician's Friend and Fender to have it special ordered, I personally think that most of the talk about Quality Control slipping are people pining for "the good old days" when you could pick up a phone and talk to Steve Rabe. The production line move and set-up was overseen by SWR's top people, both in the US plan and in Mexico for the WorkingPro/Man lines. Components weren't changed except to conform to overseas electronic/power laws, and this was a good thing for non-Americans who wanted SWR.
The only thing I will say has slipped is the Customer Service aspect, but that happens with pretty much any incorporation of a smaller company into a larger one (this is one area where St. Louis Music and Eden were more successful) and I've still gotten e-mail response in under 48 hours. Worse? A bit. Bad? Hardly.
I just stole a Workingmans 12 from GC on tax free day 339$ in the Box Shipped to my house.
I used to own a old one, what is the difference?
Who told you that? SWR products were in serious trouble when Fender purchased them. It was a win win situation for everyone involved. When Fender took over they upgraded, discontinued and in most cases completly redesigned some of the products. I know people who work there and I have heard alot of horror stories about some of the stuff SWR was doing in the last days. I have pre Fender SWR stuff and it is great, but the last years were the worst. I also have a freind that works at an SWR certified repair center. He said that they do not see SWR products like they used too. I am sure some people will disagree, I'm sure not every SWR product is perfect nowdays, but I believe over all SWR has improved. Try them out for yourself and if it sounds good too you, go with it.
Anything made in Sylmar CA is the old company and pre buyout, it was when they moved to Sun Valley CA that things started turning for the worse, and the grill badges on the Pro Series changed to Aluminum instead of steel right before the buyout.
My SWR SM-500 says Sun Valley on it, luckily I got a good one. I have had it for 5 years and have never had a problem.
I think it's probably nonsense, at least as far as the Professional Series stuff goes. I've never heard a specific, verifiable example of a negative production change from anyone who claims this...and I've asked. It's just the usual yammering you get here from people who don't know anything or are trying to sell some old gear.
I just had an example of the latter today.
FMIC customer service is lousy, but that's an entirely different problem.
Customer Service ("CS") has definitely gone down since Fender took over, but Quality Control ("QC") I have heard no first-hand reports of problems. We all need to understand the difference between these terms, and to keep things straight when we discuss it.
Quality control did indeed start to slip when they moved to Sun Valley and started producing their own speakers instead of PAS (Pro Series here). I remember reading complaints on the SWR forum at the time that the 12 stack dust covers were separating from the speakers and production of all non-Pro was shifted to Mexico pre-Fender.
Now these were cost-cutting measures and can be debated whether quailty suffered just because it was made in Mexico, but I am of the mind that when you start cutting corners and shift production along with training a workforce, quailty will definitely suffer initially, if not permanently.
BTW, I played through the new Fender Pro 210 cab ($449) and IMO it couldn't hold a candle to the Avatar B210 Delta($229)! The Fender sounded like garbage and had no low end. It is a crime what they are charging for that cabinet. YMMV.