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How much bass is too much bass?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Mo'Phat, Dec 23, 2003.

  1. Mo'Phat

    Mo'Phat Supporting Member

    Oct 1, 2003
    San Diego, CA, USA
    There are times when I want the type of low end that just makes you need to throw up. I like to feel it in my bones and have it be felt in other peoples' bones. However, while striving for that type of ungodly low, my 4x10 Mesa cab tends to fart out (ie: the excursion of the 10" speakers is not deep enough to reproduce the frequency). To compensate I got the Mesa 2x15.

    Am I wrong in thinking that the bass should be overpowering and vomit-inducing?

    Is there a 'magic curve' on the EQ that would give me that thick, absorbing bass without giving my speakers indigestion?


    ps. I mostly play a Stingray 4 through a Mesa 400+. slap and fingerstyle.
  2. Stick a BBE Sonic Maximizer in the loop

  3. Mo'Phat

    Mo'Phat Supporting Member

    Oct 1, 2003
    San Diego, CA, USA
    It's there...

    It goes: Bass...couple of pedals...head...Sonic Maximizer in the loop...4x10 and 2x15.

    The 2x15 is pretty solid as a standalone, so I might just stick with that.
  4. well geez, i cant imagine having more bass than what you have

    are you looking to start an avalanche or something?
  5. Mo'Phat

    Mo'Phat Supporting Member

    Oct 1, 2003
    San Diego, CA, USA
    I'm from Diego, man!!! If some Honda Civic can roll up the the rehearsal studio and blow me away with a couple of 12's, I gotta bring the roof down.
  6. hahahahaah


    Clearly you need to go to "11"
  7. Mo'Phat

    Mo'Phat Supporting Member

    Oct 1, 2003
    San Diego, CA, USA
    Okay, so is there an EQ curve that will bring out the Dub lows and the Jazz definition without making my speakers whimper?
  8. I would say bi-amp and send those mean lows to the 2x15 and let the 4x10 handle the sweet upper end ... but you'd have to get a crossover for your 400+ .... or something.
  9. kirbywrx

    kirbywrx formerly James Hetfield

    Jul 27, 2000
    Melbourne, Australia.
    Boya! thats what i would do.

    So you want ball breaking bass? is this just a matter or preference, or does the type of music you actually play call for extreme low end? if its just for personal satisfaction, i wouldnt get too caught up in it, but if its required for a genre of music you play, well go for it.

    if your 2x15 is farting out at you, well then your gain is up way way too much, or theres something wrong inside them houses you call 2x15 cabs. but as for a magic eq curve, the only thing you can really to do (shock horror) boost the bass frequencies.
  10. Mo'Phat

    Mo'Phat Supporting Member

    Oct 1, 2003
    San Diego, CA, USA
    Preference, mostly. I'm starting a project that's hip-hop-funk-dub-reggae-punk-hard rock prog-jazz-metal-ska. So, yeah...I'd like ball busting bass.

    Bi-amping is not really an option with the 400+ since there's no x-over and its mono.

    Now that I've thought about it all day, it's kind of unrealistic to get what I'm looking for unless I go with folded horn 18" subs and 16,000 watts of power. I'll just keep experimenting with the 2x15 as a standalone.

    ps. It's not the size of a house...it's only about 36" high. An Ampeg refridgerator is about 52"...but I'd put mine up against that any day and it would kill.
  11. It's easy.

    I've got an 1x18" and a 4x10" that each get -only- 350w ( 2x Hartke 3500 ).

    Start out with the EQ flat, and cut everything > 125 HZ with a slight " \ "-shape. Then give your lowest frequency a small boost.

    Remember : Boost = bad ( muddy sound ), cut = good.

    Next up is the PRE-amp / POWER-amp part. the PRE-amp ( 0.5 watt ? ) is made to compensate loss from the cables before the signal enters the EQ. the POWER-amp ( 400 watt ? )is made to give the signal a kick in the nads.

    If you need to turn your PRE-amp over 50 %, then it's time to get new / shorter cables.

    If you need to turn your POWER-amp over 50 %, then it's time to get a new amp.

    remember : the more you push your amp, the more lows you lose.
  12. MJ5150

    MJ5150 Supporting Member

    Apr 12, 2001
    Olympia, WA
    Hey Mo'Phat...I know how ya feel....I had a very similiar problem. As a matter of personal preference, I like to see peoples heads rattling while I play. I have an Eden 410XLT. Trying to make my Eden rattle peoples brains was not a good idea.

    I also have a 215 cab loaded with Black Widows. I used to use my Hartke3500 with it. Since I bought the Eden, I rarely use the 215. As I was describing the same problem to a sound guy, he told me to use a crossover. I own the BBE383, that has a built in crossover. I took all my gear to this dudes house, and he hooked up my rig. It sounded amazing! That crossover made a world of difference. The Eden cab is awesome on it's on, but when it was fed only higher freq's, it sounded so awesome. The 215 almost brought the house down. I have not had it all hooked up since that day, but I plan to once I get the cables I need.

    You can pick up the BBE383 for right around $100 used. Maybe you should check into it.

  13. Mo'Phat

    Mo'Phat Supporting Member

    Oct 1, 2003
    San Diego, CA, USA
    My head is MONO fellas, there's no way to crossover the frequencies coming in and have the power from the head be split with hi's and low's going to two different cabs.

    Believe me, if I didn't have my Mesa 400+, I'd be getting a sweet-ass preamp, a sweet-ass crossover and a QSC PLX3402 to power the cabinets in stereo.

    Since I just re-tubed the head (with $250 worth of JJ/Tesla tubes), I don't really want to switch the entire thing around.
  14. inazone


    Apr 20, 2003
    Its funny you mentioned gut wrenching. We played at this bar http://www.pinkesentertainment.com/ and in the second set this guy comes up and asked if I could turn the bass down cos he was about to through up. At the end of the third set a friend of mine said he had to take his wife home cos the bass was so loud she had to puke.:eek: The soundmen were haveing trouble that nite with the board or something and couldnt get the sound right.:meh:
  15. Nice stack of mains in there!
  16. i say get a custom 2x18 made. and u can never have too much low end.
  17. MJ5150

    MJ5150 Supporting Member

    Apr 12, 2001
    Olympia, WA
    yeah...true.....brains rattling, people throwing up, and involuntary bowel movements at your shows....now THAT would have the locals talkin

  18. ahh wouldnt that be great if only i had the money. but seriously for some wicked low end get a custom made 2x18 my bass teacher has one of those with a 4x12 on top some wicked low end but its really underpowered hes only runnin a gk 400 into it so its not that great but i heard him at a gig borowin a friends amp and holy man that was some major low end anyway i say go for the 2x18. again.
  19. MJ5150

    MJ5150 Supporting Member

    Apr 12, 2001
    Olympia, WA
    yeah, the 218 would be sweet, but i have never seen one for sale.....that is why i went for the 215.

  20. Hey Ally,

    It's not THAT easy. The preamp is NOT making up for losses (and it definitely not 0,5 watts), it's preparing your signal for your poweramp, because a poweramp needs a HOT SIGNAL and while they're at it, they let you shape the signal a bit (tone shaping). So it's making up for the relatively weak signal of a bass guitar.

    The volume knob on either amp isn't telling you NOTHING about how much of it's "juice" you're using. Turn up the pre to get the hottest signal possible without clipping it, and then turn up the poweramp to get the volume you need. Now THAT'S as easy as it gets. Every amp buff will tell you the same.

    Signal loss in a cable? Then it must be seriously faulty. If it's audible, get a new one.

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