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I have a cunning plan

Discussion in 'Effects [BG]' started by dave_clark69, May 21, 2003.


  1. dave_clark69

    dave_clark69 Guest

    Jan 17, 2003
    well i have been trying to get some good tones and sounds like led zeppelin and black sabbath. Well to get a tone like that, you need 5 thousand pounds worth of a bass and lots of amplifiers and that will cost another 5 grand. Amounting to a total of 10 grand.
    what if you could get a effects pedal to get that sound. id that possible or not. Maybe custom signature pedals like iommi overdrive and geezer butler overdrive or even a multi effects pedal with lots of them preset.
    is that a good idea or what?
     
  2. bassackwards

    bassackwards Member

    Dec 16, 2002
    OREGON
    Have you tried the fine products from Tech21 like the SABDI or RBI? I find it quite easy to get a "Geezer-tone" with my RBI without any pedals.
     
  3. iloveloosey

    iloveloosey Guest

    Sep 9, 2000
    you could be called a cunning linguist.
     
  4. BFunk

    BFunk Supporting Member

    The only effect you need is an early 70's SVT and an Ampeg 8x10 cab. What you are hearing is a combination of pre-amp overdrive and tube power amp saturation into a cab designed to emphasis the mids. Solid state amps, or hybrids, will NEVER have that sound. So if you buy a pedal be prepared to live with a poor approximation of THAT sound. Anyone who tells you different has never stood in front of a raging SVT.
     
  5. Amen Brother Amen!
    The truth shall set you free!
    Peace
     
  6. bassackwards

    bassackwards Member

    Dec 16, 2002
    OREGON
    Um...have any of you "overdriven-tube-amp-only" guys tried a Tech21 RBI preamp? I can imitate practically any tube-amp tone you throw at me with mine and it's a helluva lot easier to record and practice with.
     
  7. Sorry if I'm skeptical. If you sat them side by side I think you'd hear the difference.
    But to each set of ears....
    Peace
     
  8. bassackwards

    bassackwards Member

    Dec 16, 2002
    OREGON
    You didn't answer my question. Have you tried one?
     
  9. Yes as a matter of fact I did. Live I usually use an early 70's SVT into 4x10 and 2x12 cabinets and record with this as well in my studio. Recently I tried to finish a project at home (studio is temporarily closed) using DI only. I tried the Sansamp BDDI, a Fulltone Bassdrive, ART Tube Preamps in several different combinations and after a frustrating week of attempting to recreate the SVT sound I gave up and cranked up the amp in my kitchen for one afternoon to get all the bass tracks done.
    They may sound similar but a side by side comparison will show you the truth about lugging all that heavy tube gear around. It's worth it!!!:smug:
     
  10. bassackwards

    bassackwards Member

    Dec 16, 2002
    OREGON
    A BDDI is not an RBI. Even though they market the RBI as a fancy rack-mount version of a BDDI, they actually share very little in common. The RBI will do everything the BDDI will do, but the BDDI won't do nearly what the RBI will do. The RBI is a far better and more complicated circuit and the mid-knob makes a BIG difference. I've played plenty of SVTs (I even briefly owned one, wish I still had it) and I'll admit that I'd probably rather have a real SVT for playing live, but I honestly believe the RBI is the very best thing under a grand for recording.
     
  11. See there you support our argument.Run them side by side and you will definatly hear a difference.
    As far as pedal boards, POD's, effects, emulators goes I don't care who made it or what serial number it has NOTHING will recreate the sound of those tubes NOTHING. I went kicking and screaming to the SVT (hate to pick the beast up) but I soon had to face the fact that there is a reason it is still the number one sought after rig after all it's years on the planet. It's just that good!
    Peace
     
  12. bassackwards

    bassackwards Member

    Dec 16, 2002
    OREGON
    Uh...yes and no:meh: . His original question was if there's a pedal that will get him those sounds. So, I still recomend the Tech21 stuff. Will it be EXACT? Well, no it won't be EXACT. Will it be better for the average dude than lugging around all that heavy-ass stuff and throwing down that kind of cash? Yes, most likely. I still maintain that I'd rather record and with an RBI direct than a mic'ed SVT. Admittedly, I'm a direct recording kind of guy and always go direct with everything, whenever possible. I just find it easier to get exactly what I want that way and the RBI has been like a godsend. Also, the RBI rules for practicing. I just run the 1/4 inch out into my old Laney combo and I can emulate everything I want and it sure beats firing up a big ol' SVT and a LOT easier on the power-bill!
     
  13. I'm afraid that classic argument becomes less and less relevant as the technology improves day by day, leaps and bounds. I am not the biggest fan of the Sansamp stuff but direct into a board...you'd be hard pressed to spot any diff. Sorry guy.
     
  14. No need to be "Sorry" We'll have to agree to disagree.
    My bass direct and my bass thru the SVT do not sound the same at all, if thats what you implied.. The SVT definatly helps to shape my sound. Tecnology isn't always neccesarily a good thing. There is something to be said for Analog even in this day of digital. Maybe one day, maybe the gap is closing but not today.
    I prefer Film to video or digital any day and film is hardly cutting egde technology.
    Different Strokes right?
    Peace
     
  15. Ummm..have you not plugged into a Sansamp BDDI in the studio at all? I am a commited tube-dude but when my Mesa 400+ faceplanted on the way to the recording studio i was forced to consider options. The Tech21 tecnology is damn remarkable. Direct into a mixing console, through a Sansamp has the same characteristics as a fat tube preamp. I prefer real tube stuff of course, but their products are the only I know of that _really_ do live up to the claims. Honest?
     
  16. Thankls for the input.
    I've used Sansamp product, don't know model numbers for sh*t. I wasn't overwhelmed. But I'm always open to new toys!
     
  17. BFunk

    BFunk Supporting Member

    I have tried every bass distortion pedal I could get my hands on, from ODB-3 to an BJF Blueberry. I played through an SWR IOD, and an RBI. I tried the SBDDI, and the MXR bass distortion. I have spent hundreds of dollars looking for the right pedal. In the end NOTHING comes close to the sound of a good tube power amp.

    Those modelling amps are a joke. They cannot capture the dynamic response of real tubes. They always sound like a recording of a tube amp, not the real deal.

    The original poster wanted the Geezer Butler and John Paul Jones sound. That is nothing but pure amp.
     
  18. Keep in mind guys; Sansamp prodcuts aren't meant for use with an existing preamp, best when applied for use as a DI into the board. My SABDDI sounds like ****e if i stick it B4 my head; "contact lenses with your eyeglasses" if you know what I mean.
     
  19. I think BFunk is onto something there. The Sansamp stuff or others can competently replicate the tone of a driven tube amp but there's something about the dynamic response that doesn't ring quite true.
    To quote: "They always sound like a recording of a tube amp, not the real deal."
     
  20. BFunk

    BFunk Supporting Member

    Yeah, those modelling amps always sound like a snapshot of the tube amp sound. Real tube amps respond in very dramatic ways to the signal envelope, harmonic content, and gain structure. I don't think these modeling amps are capable of replicating those values because of the complexity of the relationship. I suppose one day they will sound as good. (Then I will still keep my tube amp just to bask in the warm glow of the tubes. ;) )