I read this in the Mesa Boogie owner's manual ...

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by kcdbass, Sep 24, 2003.

  1. kcdbass


    Feb 27, 2002
    New Jersey
    Former Sales/Web, Sadowsky Guitars
    I am investigating the Mesa Boogie M-Pulse 600, so I downloaded the PDF manual. On page four, I read the following paragraph as relates to the amp's gain control.

    The region between 12:00 and 2:30 is where the classic, warm tube sound resides and within this narrow band you will discover a world of tone. Tiny increments here produce subtle, but important differences in the attack characteristic which in turn, feel like changes in the time domain. By experimenting with the amount of gain, you can actually voice the amp to feel as if it bounces just ahead of the groove - or lays back a little deeper to produce a more Fatback feel. The difference in attack and sustain produces striking results as to how the bassist - and in fact the whole band - perceives things in the time domain.

    That sounds pretty cool ... the Mesa engineers are REALLY into it, and the owner's manual is extremely well written and informative.

    Can any M-Pulse users comment on this being true? Is it true of any amp with a gain knob? I can't really say I've ever experienced this so-called phenomenon! Maybe it's just the voicing of the amp ... I do know that the gain knob seems particularly adept at getting a pretty cool overdriven sound.

    Just wondering ...
  2. kirbywrx

    kirbywrx formerly James Hetfield

    Jul 27, 2000
    Melbourne, Australia.
    Theres another thread about mesa amps here and someone remarked that the M-Pulse is remarkable.

    Anyway it soudns good, and buy the sounds of it, the authors of the manual got right into their writing :D
  3. Petebass


    Dec 22, 2002
    QLD Australia
    or they paid a marketing company to spin as much BS as they could afford.

    I'm not saying it's not true, I just hate these airy fairy sales pitches that use vauge words to create these intangible claims. What's this junk about "changes in time domain"... what is this? star treck?

    It's probably a very good amp, but ignor the mumbo jumbo and go an play through one. Let your ears decide!
  4. LMOA..... word, Pete!

    "Changes in time domain"... What is it - a time machine? Probably takes you right back to the sixties, when "tone" was sweet and warm, in other words, when amp designers didn't know swat about tightness and response, and the flaws of tube equipment were considered good tone - hey wait a minute - they still are!!

    Well, that says more about me than about those tubes.

    But I like that poem you posted, kcdbass! :D
  5. Mcrelly


    Jun 16, 2003
    Minnesota, USA
    It might be written by people who graduated from manual grade school where they teach them to write "produces earth shaking bass tones..." when they are talking about a 30 watt practice amp. :rolleyes:
  6. Rockbobmel

    Rockbobmel Supporting Member

    They really got you with their creative writing. However, they make excellent amps and cabs.
    Check out the bull talk on their cabs, WOW..!! "Everest Highs" I'm buy'n one.
    No, really though, I use both Mesa head and cab and they are the with the "very best" of amps.
    Excellent, not "magic" make them world class.
  7. billys73


    Apr 25, 2003

    This is the goofiest, dumbest stuff I have ever heard.
    I realize that companies have to say exciting stuff.....
    but.......this is really pushing into BS land.

    Note: I understand what they are talking about-that a slower attack and some distortion could sound or feel different musically than a quick transient response. However, one can not eq an amp to"bounce ahead of the groove"!
  8. Yeah it's hype; over-the-top and a little goofy but at least they're having some fun with it. But y'know, being one who has owned some of the best that Mesa has ever flogged, I'd have to say that every word is the truth. My 400+ , when tweaked just so, seemed "alive" having a "breathy" quality quite unlike any other rigs that I have owned. I'd bet that other Mesa owners might say the same....good stuff.
  9. LarryJ

    LarryJ banned

    Dec 12, 1999
    Encino, CA (LA)
    You know, that same paragraph is in the manual for
    my Buster 2x10 that I bought as NOS about a year ago.
    Call it creative writing, marketing BS or whatever-I get it, and I find that with the Mesa's
    voicing, I can get behind the "time domain" & lay behind the backbeat for a phat bass feel.
    Can't easily put it into words, I'm feeling it though.
    I've also owned a WalkAbout which i thought was excellent, although it couldn't get the full round thickness of the all-tube Buster; no SS or
    hybrid can.
    Some players don't like Mesa bass gear; no problem.
    I love mine, and it sounds Killer when I play through it. End of story.
  10. Richard Lindsey

    Richard Lindsey

    Mar 25, 2000
    Metro NYC
    Sounds like crap to me. Time feel, in any musically meaningful way, is controlled by the player, not the amp. No amp will make a note sound *before* you actually play it. If you're behind the beat, no amp will put you in front of it, unless it includes time travel as an extra feature.

    I don't mean to suggest that the Mesa is not a good or even great amp. It may indeed be; I haven't tried it. But the pseudo-scientific description just sounds like foolishness to me.
  11. LarryJ

    LarryJ banned

    Dec 12, 1999
    Encino, CA (LA)
    Of course it's controlled by the player, but the amp's voicing has some degree of effect on the sound. I think Mesa is stating that their design is intended to provide this type of result.
    Like I said, I feel it through a Mesa, as opposed
    to my GK, (tube) Ampeg, or any # of different heads I've used.
    If you played a Mesa (& you say you haven't), & didn't feel it, fine, or if you think its BS that's fine too.
    It just don't mean that's the way it is.

    My ears prove it to ME, & its all about ME!
    KCD, it's all about you, too. Try the Mesa & base
    your opinion on what you hear, not what you read,
    either in the manual OR on TalkBass.
  12. Guys....like any other piece of bass gear be it pedal, cab or tube, a head has it's own set of characteristics that can be manipulated and "played" if you will. Mesa bass heads can be very "responsive,"sensitive to your technique and playing style (attack,etc.) offerring up a sweet "give +take" feel. Some like a rather dry, SS tone with a flatter signal. Others dig a more"coloured" sound like that of a tube amp with a push-pull sort of feel. Some hear this sound to be "mushy" and "blurry." My 400+ when really cookin' is almost alive and breathing....sounds nutty but I am guessing that is what a fat ol' set of tubes can do for you. Think guitars and their Marshalls and that "thing" that happens between the two at certain volumes.
  13. Maybe they should have wrote: " This amp sounds so good it'll make you wanna slap yo mama."

    :eek: :eek: :eek:
    Anyways don't all companies write stuff like that in their manuals.
  14. JMX

    JMX Vorsprung durch Technik

    Sep 4, 2000
    Cologne, Germany
    Paper is patient...their marketing department should lower their coffeine intake. :meh:
  15. Richard Lindsey

    Richard Lindsey

    Mar 25, 2000
    Metro NYC
  16. Richard Lindsey

    Richard Lindsey

    Mar 25, 2000
    Metro NYC
    Not that I've seen. Thankfully.
  17. Dynamic, responsive...interactive and touch-sensitive; these all describe a 400+ when it's really hummin'. No temporal shifting here, just a big ol' tube rig doing what it does best. Methinks you've missed the point. Mesa's statement(albeit a colourful one) describes my experiance just fine. SS gear is "dryer" and reproduces more acuratelly my technique but tubes are a kick to work with because of this.
  18. LarryJ

    LarryJ banned

    Dec 12, 1999
    Encino, CA (LA)
    OK -my best description of Mesa's verbage would be that there is a slight but discernible phase shift that occurs between the time the note is played and the time the note is reproduced through the speaker. I believe it has to do with transient response from the pre-amp/driver tubes, etc.
    Words aside, there most definitely IS a discernible difference in the "time domain" as Mesa calls it and as I hear it.No ? in my mind, and if its not there for another player's ears,
    doesn't bother me a bit.
    Any further repudiations,I would suggest calling Mesa & discussing the "issue" with their techs & designers.
    I'd bet they would be willing to discuss their opinions (really) and IMO Mesa has some pretty good products to back up their marketing "crap"
    if that term floats your boat.
  19. Richard Lindsey

    Richard Lindsey

    Mar 25, 2000
    Metro NYC
    LarryJ, it's cool. I call 'em the way I see (or hear) 'em, and so do you.
  20. LarryJ

    LarryJ banned

    Dec 12, 1999
    Encino, CA (LA)
    Right On, Rich!!!:D :cool: