If you were me what would you do? Eden WT400 vs sabddi as pre & poweramp

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by ::::BASSIST::::, Jul 22, 2005.

  1. ::::BASSIST::::

    ::::BASSIST:::: Progress Not Perfection.

    Sep 2, 2004
    Vancouver, BC Canada
    Here is my situation. I am trying to decide if I should keep my sabddi (which I am using as a preamp) and stewart pr 1000 setup OR go for an eden wt400.

    My practice cab is a schroeder mini 12+
    I have a sch 1210 on the way for gigs.

    The Pros of the eden 400

    -13lbs and compact (all one unit)
    - I am sure it will sound great with no homebrew "issues"

    -taking a chance buying something used (cant afford new)
    -not going to be as loud or have as much head room

    Pros of the sabddi & poweramp
    -1000w (but its surprising that 1000w really isnt that loud)

    - I already own it

    - hassle factor involved with battery, cable connections etc (its not all one unit)
    -a little heavier at 16lbs but when you add extension cords etc the weight goes up

    I dont drive and I transport all of my stuff using a handcart on public transit. Thats why weight is so important to me.

    Most, if not all venues in my area have PA support, but from time to time I play community centres, weddings etc which have no pa support.

    Basically it comes down to:

    a single lightweight head which gives 400w


    multiple components which gives a 1000w but weighs a little more and is more hassle to setup

    of course, then their is the tone. One sounds like a sabddi (good) one sounds like an eden (good).

    Which option would you choose and why?

  2. nemo


    Mar 19, 2004
    I have used 1210 with WT-300 in past few months and even on the outdoor stages (with PA) I have been asked to turn down (its funky eight piece band with horns etc.). But the limit light came up quite often, so now I am looking for more powerful head to have some spare headroom. Probably WT-550 or Thunderfunk 550. Well, I think you could live with WT-400, depending on how loud your bandmates are. However, it is not the ideal situation and you can miss headroom. Maybe somebody will suggest you other lighweight affordable head like Kustom 1000 W. I don't use sabdi so can't comment on tone.

    PS: Now, if you felt 1000W was not too loud, the WT-400 will most likely not do it for you volume wise. I would stick with what you have now if you like the tone. 16 lbs vs 13 lbs is not a factor IMO.
  3. ::::BASSIST::::

    ::::BASSIST:::: Progress Not Perfection.

    Sep 2, 2004
    Vancouver, BC Canada
    My band is not too loud. We play classic rock with one guitar, keys, bass and drums.

    I am famaliar with whats available for light heads and the eden wt400 is the lightest with the most power, that is available on the used market. I'd love a AI focus, but they are way to pricey for me.
  4. 4Mal

    4Mal Supporting Member

    Jun 2, 2002
    Columbia River Gorge
    I'm just moveing from Demeter and Crown over to a GK 1001. $600 delivered from Rik's (Assumng it actually arrives of course). Portability and simplicity were my reasons. I was also looking clean, clear and punchy. I though long and hard over the WT550 and came pretty close to taking the plunge n Joey Squid's. In the end previous positive experience with GK and hearing about the Eden sound swayed my decision. I haven;t heard bad about the Eden sound only that there is one and to me that means color that I don't necessarily want. If I didn't live out in the sticks I would have gone out to audition one ...

    I am so looking forward to carrying my BE cab and a head in a sack ... goodbye Mr Chiropractor (not real likely but maybe it'll cut down on the number of visits ...)
  5. ::::BASSIST::::

    ::::BASSIST:::: Progress Not Perfection.

    Sep 2, 2004
    Vancouver, BC Canada
    Many people say the 1210 is very loud so coupled with the eden wt400 that rig should be fine in a medium size venue with pa support right?
  6. RD


    Jun 17, 2003
    Seattle, WA
    It seems to me that a used WT-550 would not cost you much more than a used WT-400. I haven't seen many used WT-400's on the market lately. Plus, I think you'll get a bit more headroom out of the WT-550. The WT-550 also will run at 2 ohms, which allows you alot of options cab-wise. Maybe one 4 ohm cab now, but if you decide you need more volume later you can add another.
  7. Not the utmost in portability but you could add an Eden WP100 Navigator pre to your rig and retain your pre-poweramp. Then you'd have a choice; Sansamp or Eden.
  8. I think try and go a higher powered head than the WT400, for larger stuff. The Eden WT550 looks a better choice, it is heavier but it will provide more headroom. I'd take a look at Gallien Krueger also, a 700RB II or a 1001 RB II will both provide plenty of juice, again they are abit heavier than the WT400 but the 1001RB II provides 700w @ 4ohm, thast 700 concervative Gallien Krueger watts...

    Obviously you want something light an easy to transport, but for more volume you'll need more cabs- theres only so much more wattage can do. I noticed your getting a Schroeder 1210, people have raved about the volume of these cabs so you should be ok with 400w or there abouts- but are you getting the most from your head, is the cabinet 4 or 8ohms?
  9. ::::BASSIST::::

    ::::BASSIST:::: Progress Not Perfection.

    Sep 2, 2004
    Vancouver, BC Canada
    the 1210 is 4ohms.

    interesting that nobody is on the side of the franken-amp sabddi with stewart setup.

    I should mention that i think i discovered why the stewart wasnt that loud. I think i may have neglected to push the little grey button on the back that switches b/n bridge and stereo thus I was only getting 350w. Next practice I will find out for sure. Sure feel like a doofus though!:ninja:
  10. It might not sound much- but too many cords. Power for the Sansamp, for the Power amp. Then you got bass to Sansamp, Sansamp to poweramp, poweramp to cabinet... And your royally screwed if you forget one. A single unit is easier to carry too.

    Now This is part of my big rig at the moment...
    A GK 800RB set to 110vAC, so I need a transformer to run it off, as we use 240vAC in Australia, it's not the extra weight of the transformer that annoys me, but the extra piece of equipment, and the extra cords that are a hastle... Just another thing to lug arround.

    So I am really basing my opinion from personal experience- Personally I would much prefer a single unit, which is why I am making a rack case for the head + transformer so I can carry them as one, albeit heavy peice.

    The Eden heads look good too, I'm actually debating between an Eden and a GK for my small traveler rig.
  11. USAJO


    Apr 13, 2005
    I have a SABDDI and a WT400 head. I think the Eden is an excellent head. I quit using the SABDDI with it when I play my Stingray. I play in a 5 piece band. I run two 8 ohm one 12 cabs (EPI NYC T-112's) and I kinda wish I had a little more headroom but then I like the sound of the WT-400 so much I just can't pull the trigger on selling it to get more power. So I'm taking the view that if I need more power the bands stage volume has gotten out of control. I would think you could pick up a used WT-400 for $400 to $500 max. If you like the Eden sound (I do) ya can't go wrong. I think the SABDDI's work best with a passive bass. But then again I bet there are guys that could make your head spin using an active bass and the SABDDI. Whatever you choose to do it's not the last move you can make, go with your hunch and then make another move if you're not happy. Enjoy the ride.
  12. ::::BASSIST::::

    ::::BASSIST:::: Progress Not Perfection.

    Sep 2, 2004
    Vancouver, BC Canada
    So then the Eden sounds better than the sabddi?

    My bass is a passive Fender Jazz.

    Re the cords hassle... I agree! How deal with it is:

    - I keep the cord that goes from the stewart to the cab always connected to the cab

    -I have a little korg tuner that i have attached to the sabddi with an elastic band. I have the parallel out connected to the tuner in with a short cable (squared away with another elastic)

    -I have the cord running from the sabddi to the stewart permanently connected to the sabddi with the same elastic that keeps the korg in place

    - I use a rechargeable battery in the sabddi so i omit the adapter hassle. I just have to make sure i remember to charge my battery once a week.

    -thus the connections i make are bass to sabddi, and sabddi to stewart stewart to wall outlet. Not too complicated.

    My next venture (if i decide to keep the sabddi /stewart setup) is to somehow connect the sabddi/tuner to the stewart. And no, i dont think a rubber band will work this time... but you never know! Once I do this it will be as simple as bass to sabddi and stewart to wall outlet... simple as any all-in-one-head.

    Cant say it looks too pretty though:cool:
  13. MJ5150

    MJ5150 Terrific Twister

    Apr 12, 2001
    Lacey, WA
    Torin....I have been in your shoes a few times. I am sure many others have also. It's no fun sometimes. For me, I opted for a small amp and ditched all of the power amp and preamp ideas I tried out. I tried several, even pretty much what you are trying to do right now.

    I can say from my trials and tribulations that it is that it is always better to be too loud with headroom than not loud enough with no headroom. Turning down is always easy, you'll reach a point where you can no longer turn up and that sucks big time.

    Get something with more power. If it means holding on to this rig longer while you save up for it, it will be worth it. Otherwise, we'll see you here in the Amps forum pretty soon asking about an amp like the WT-400, only louder. :D

  14. Munjibunga

    Munjibunga Total Hyper-Elite Member Gold Supporting Member

    May 6, 2000
    San Diego (when not at Groom Lake)
    Independent Contractor to Bass San Diego
    I'd respond to this thread, but everybody knows what I'm gonna say.
  15. ::::BASSIST::::

    ::::BASSIST:::: Progress Not Perfection.

    Sep 2, 2004
    Vancouver, BC Canada
    bahhh!.... if only i could afford the AI Focus I would be in heaven.

    How much are they again? Something like $1200usd which would be about $1600cdn?

    ... not a chance!
  16. Alexander


    Aug 13, 2001
    Seattle, WA
    I would go with the Eden or whatever other nice head you like the best. Sounds like you may not have tried the Eden and I would say it may be the amp for you, but maybe not. I'd hate to see you trade in on your current rig, then not be happy long term. Try a bunch out - I just switched to a Thunderfunk, but tried a number of good heads (Fender 800 Pro, Ashdown, Eden WT, GBE600) during the process. I didn't get around to trying the Walkabout, but many people like them as well. All of these can be had new for not much more than the used Eden. Not trying to pursuade you against Eden, mind you just encouraging you to try before you buy.

    Personally, I like the SABDDI. I have one and used it for years when going direct or to warm up a poorer sounding amp. It's done the trick. But I think a really good sounding amp blows it away.
  17. SteveC


    Nov 12, 2004
    North Dakota
    I tried to make a BDDI/poweramp work for me. I liked that it was small, nice sound, etc.

    I recently went to an Eden WT-550 head. I really like it. The preamp/EQ is excellent, as is the DI. It drives my Bergantino HT112 very well. I probably have my best tone in years going right now. It's still a very portable rig.
  18. Jack


    Sep 6, 2003
    Newcastle, UK
    Id swap the Sansamp for something more suited to driveing a poweramp. There are plenty of tube (and ss 'tubey sounding') preamps out there that sound great.

    Pros - Much louder than Eden
    More versatility (can use any pre with poweramp etc)

    Cons - Little heavier, might also have to be rackmounted.

    I love the Eden sound, but it just doesnt cut through my band when Ive used Eden heads. Never owned one, but used plenty in clubs, theyre a standard round here, and Ampeg. Sounds sooooooo good by themselves though.

    Jack, FWIW.
  19. ::::BASSIST::::

    ::::BASSIST:::: Progress Not Perfection.

    Sep 2, 2004
    Vancouver, BC Canada
    Why did you eventually abandon the sabddi/poweramp setup?

    I can't get my mind away from the pros of the sabddi/poweramp setup:

    - 1000w of power with nice sabddi tone

    -the ability to use <table class="MsoNormalTable" style="border: 1pt outset black; background: rgb(153, 153, 153) none repeat scroll 0% 50%; -moz-background-clip: initial; -moz-background-origin: initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: initial; width: 100.18%; margin-left: -1.9pt;" border="1" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr style=""> <td style="border: 1pt inset black; padding: 1.5pt; width: 49.9%;" valign="top" width="49%"> 350W x 2 @ 4 Ohms<o =""></o>

    </td> </tr> <tr style=""> <td style="border: 1pt inset black; padding: 1.5pt; width: 49.9%;" valign="top" width="49%"> 1000w x1 @ 4ohms
    <o =""></o>

    </td> </tr> <tr style=""> <td style="border: 1pt inset black; padding: 1.5pt; width: 49.9%;" valign="top" width="49%"> 725W x 1 @ 8 Ohms<o =""></o>

    </td> </tr> </tbody> </table>
    cab configurations. Plus have all the power I will ever need.

    Then again almost all the venues in my area have PA support so do I really need that much power?

    With PA support surely 400w running thru a schroeder 1210 will do nicely, no?

    I weighed the stewart pro reference 1000 using a professional digital scale at work (yes, people looked at me strange) and it said 13.79LBS. The specs that say 11lbs is total bullsh*t. I dont know why they lie to their consumers. It kind of ticked me off as i was expecting an 11lb amp and got a 14lb one. I wonder if the stewart 1.2 is actually 11lbs?

    anyway the total weight of 15lbs (14 for amp and 1 for sabddi/tuner/cord) is very reasonable for such a powerful amp.

    I guess it all comes down to tone. No surprise there.

    So generally speaking a high quality amp will sound better than the sabddi then?
  20. I'm still thinking with the Eden's 400w hooked up to a Schoreder 1210 should be enough with PA support- Smaller gigs such as weddings and so wont have PA support, but they are just that smaller gig's so you wont be needing to be as loud.

    Personally I am looking at one of the Eden heads for myself, for some smaller gigs I may be doing, and for a transporter rig- the WT400 and WT550 looks nice, very expencive in Australia, but hooked upto my yet to be built 1x12" it should provide plenty of power and a fair bit of head room too for these smaller blues/folk gigs.

    As for weight, a tip I learned in the bike racing business, the manufacture will always publish the wieghts of the lightest model / Size. So while your model might not weigh a ture 11lbs, a lower wattage model power amp may.