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Infuriating Warmoth policy!

Discussion in 'Basses [BG]' started by reachjkh, Jun 2, 2003.

  1. reachjkh


    Nov 21, 2002
    Lee's Summit, MO
    I am once again going 'round the block trying to figure out what six I want. I'm back once again to the Gecko. What a great looking instrument...except for that mandatory inlay. I would especially not want it if I got a fretless.

    The icing on the cake is when I call and ask some more questions, the salesman tells me he hates the dumb thing too. He says he keeps telling them that he could sell a bunch more if they'd make it optional. It's not even a manufacturing issue since I tried just getting ebony inlay on an ebony neck...no can do!...they want that stupid lizard for identity. I like the lizard, put it on the headstock, just get it off my fingerboard! How did Sadowsky ever get his basses known without inlaying an ostrich or maybe a cockroach or some other random thing on his bass neck...just lucky I guess.


    I feel better now. I'll go buy my Acme Low B instead. That'll make me feel better except that I really want a six stringer.
  2. 20db pad

    20db pad

    Feb 11, 2003
    I been everywhere, man...
    None. At all.
    I find your views intriguing and I'd like to subscribe to your newsletter.

    All kidding aside, I was told the same thing years ago. If I want to see little lizards crawling over stuff, I'll crash at my parent's place in Arizona!
  3. Aaron


    Jun 2, 2001
    Bellingham, WA
    cover the inlay with duct tape! :p
  4. pilotjones

    pilotjones Supporting Member

    Nov 8, 2001
    Once in a while they have a neck where the lizard is close in color to the fretboard wood, and it looks kind of nice (to me, as opposed to the usual high contrast, which I also dislike).

    I think that Brian Goode from Warmoth (TB username: bwbass) said in a recent thread that they actually have about thirty necks on the shelf at any time, and when a few sell, they pull a few more out the photograph them and put them on the web page. So maybe, if you could get someone cooperative over there, you could find out if there was a nicer one available than what they're showing? Unless of course, any lizard at all is unacceptable to you.
  5. Brendan

    Brendan Supporting Member

    Jun 18, 2000
    Austin, TX
    Actually, thought, if you knew a competant luthier in the area, I'm sure they could "fix" the gecko inlay. A suitable professional might ever manage to leave traces even YOU (meaning reachjkh) would have trouble finding. It'd cost more, but so would a custom Warmoth neck with no inlay...if they would do it.
  6. JPJ


    Apr 21, 2001
    Chicago, IL
    This is one of the primary reasons why I went with USACG for my jazz bass parts....in addition to the fact that I got higher-quaity parts, more personal service, and more customizable options. Warmoth seems to be on some kind of kick that they think that THEY know what is right...almost like they feel a need to save us from ourselves! :confused: All I wanted from Warmoth was a jazz bass neck (with Fender-style headstock) and graphite reinforcement rods. As you all know, Warmoth doesn't offer graphite because they don't think it adds anything to the neck. You MUST get the heavier metal rods or you're out of luck. As far as I know, graphite rods in necks is bunch of crap that we've all bought into via a brilliant marketing plan. However, that doesn't matter to me. I want graphite in my neck!!! I don't understand why Warmoth won't give customers what they want...within reason. A gecko neck without a gecko seems reasonable to me. A jazz bass neck with graphite rods, as opposed to metal, seems reasonable to me. Bottom line...they missed a sale. I was MORE than pleased with my experience with USA Custom Guitars and can't wait to work with them again on my next project. i highly suggest you call/e-mail Tommy at USACG and he'll hook you up with what ever you need. ;)
  7. Nino Valenti

    Nino Valenti Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 2, 2001
    Staten Island NYC
    Builder: Valenti Basses
    I actually like the inlay. It makes the bass more unique.

    I'm getting my blue Gecko back from JSonnenblick (originally traded it to him for his Atelier Z 5) & I might sell the American Standard J 5 I just bought.

    <img src="http://www.talkbass.com/forum/attachment.php?s=&postid=503323">
  8. VJP


    Jun 25, 2001
    I find your views intriguing and I'd like to subscribe to your newsletter

    Beautiful, Homer J.
  9. old_skool


    Aug 17, 2000
    Milwaukee, WI
    I too find the gecko annoying. I think, over all, they look much nicer without the gecko. Some do look nice with them though.
  10. JPJ


    Apr 21, 2001
    Chicago, IL
    The bottom line is that it just doesn't make ANY sense at all..from an economic perspective OR a customer relations perspective.

    1) It costs MORE and takes MORE time to program a CNC/CAD/Whatever machine to make the cutout for the little eye-licker and then to do the same thing for the piece of snake-bait on the laminate piece that in inserted into the neck. The fact that it costs more to make a gecko neck than an otherwise equal, non-gecko, neck makes even LESS sense when you factor in how many people DON'T make a purchase because, unlike some, prefer not to have the design on the neck. Why not give the customer a choice?

    2) Why mandate the use of steel rods in the neck when it is now industry standard to use graphite strips to reinforce a Fender-style neck..one piece or two piece....flat sawn or quarter sawn? If graphite rods are not a detriment to the tone/structure/playability of the instrument, why not make it an option, even if they may cost more? Simply pass that extra cost on to the consumers who choose the option. What if Warmoth doesn't feel as if graphite is as good as metal? What difference does it make to Warmoth? I would find it hard to believe that Warmoth would claim that by offering graphite rods instead of metal that they would be selling an inferrios product to consumers that would be unfit for the marketplace. Simply include a warning to prospective buyers....or even reflect it in the length or conditions of the warranty. This is already done when it comes to finishing options on the wood parts. Why would Warmoth offer the choice of an unfinished guitar/bass neck (which they claim in inferrior and more unstable) than one finished in a protective laquer, but not offer the choice of graphite reinforcing bars over metal, despite the fact that the metal bars add to the weight of the neck and may or may not have any more beneficial properties than graphite?

    Am I rambling? Is it just me? :rolleyes:
  11. Flatwound

    Flatwound Supporting Member

    Sep 9, 2000
    San Diego
    I'm having a problem with this, which is that I can kind of understand both sides of the argument. On the one hand, as a consumer, you want what you want. No problem, that's what makes horse races, as they say.

    On the other hand, Warmoth isn't really a custom outfit. They sell certain things, and offer certain options on those things. They may do custom work for a manufacturer, but for individuals, they have a product line with options. And, since the Gecko is a Warmoth design, they want it identified as such.

    So I'm not really agreeing or disagreeing with you, just saying that there're two sides to the story.
  12. I am actually having the opposite problem... I want the gecko inlay for my jazz 4 but thats not available. :(
  13. "On the other hand, Warmoth isn't really a custom outfit. They sell certain things, and offer certain options on those things. They may do custom work for a manufacturer, but for individuals, they have a product line with options. And, since the Gecko is a Warmoth design, they want it identified as such. "

    Exactly!! This is like complaining that Fender doesn't offer a bass with a Gibson style headstock.

    They have the Gecko there as a trademark. They want it there to mark their product!! If you don't like it don't buy it, but the Gecko is still a Warmoth trademark bass that they choose to mark as such.

    The same applies to the graphite rods. As far as I know USACG doesn't offer anything...steel, graphite or otherwise so why not complain about that. Warmoth thinks graphite doesn't work so they use steel inserts. It's their company and that's the product they sell.

    Go elsewhere if you don't want it but don't go to McDonalds and complain that they don't sell Whoppers.
  14. JPJ


    Apr 21, 2001
    Chicago, IL
    USACG DOES offer graphite reinforcement rods in their neck, which is why I purchased my neck from them. Also, Warmoth's trademark is a "turtle". They mark their products with the turtle logo, so why not stamp this with their brand name on the face of the headstock on ALL of their necks if they want people to know where the part is from? Otherwise, the arguement doesn't hold up for all of their licensed and copied necks (i.e. Fender, Gibson, etc.).
  15. I was unaware that USACG offered the graphite rods.

    You learn something new everyday.

    The swap is the fact that you don't get an Fender headstock (without some reshaping that is).

    And you answered the other questions yourself. The Gecko is not an officially liscensed replacement it is their personal brand.
  16. There's a difference between in house designs and licensed designs, don't you think?
  17. Brad Johnson

    Brad Johnson Supporting Member

    Mar 8, 2000
    Gaithersburg, Md
    DR Strings
    Granted, that is one way to look at it. Another way is that it's a gigantic logo and it is costing them sales. If it's worth losing business over, cool.

    Lots of people don't like gigantic, possibly garish logos. Heck, there are lots of people who won't buy a Fender Sting P bass because of that high contrast inlay... including me. I don't like the Gecko logo. I think the Sting logo looks bad too. On the Peavey Cirrus at least the logo is understated IMO.

    As you said, don't like it, don't buy it.

    That's what I did.

    Something they probably didn't consider is that by not putting a gigantic logo on the neck it might make it a bit harder to dismiss out of hand ("Oh, it's a parts bass, built by the owner"). Instead of seeing that logo from 50 feet away and walking in the other direction, some might actually investigate up close or in the case of seeing a player with the bass, engage in actual conversation about it.

    Hey, it's their company and they can do what they want. IMO this is costing them business for no good reason. That's not very bright.
  18. I never said I didn't think it looks stupid!!
  19. bben


    Feb 28, 2002
    Santa Fe, NM
    I think it ruins the fretboard.

    And I would guess that it would be distracting while playing (I look at what I'm doing quite a bit, 30+ years of it and I still look at the fretboard, what the heck.)
  20. reachjkh


    Nov 21, 2002
    Lee's Summit, MO
    Nino, you do have a cool bass. (blue isn't it?)

    Buddy_Lembeck, you're absolutely right. Unfortunately, I DO want McDonalds...just without onions;) If USAguitars made a similar product, I might just go there, but they don't.

    I love Warmoth. They make great stuff and I really want a six string Gecko, I just don't want that huge inlay on my fretboard. I think it would be distracting to me. I keep saying (and suggesting to them whenever I can) that they move it to the headstock.

    Now what I REALLY want is a six string jazz body and 4+2 headstock with the gecko neck joint. They could inlay anything they want on that and I'd still want it! Fortunately, I want many different things for my bass rig so I won't have a shortage of things to drool over until they change their mind - or I do.

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