Is being heard really about being loud...

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by ccyork, Dec 3, 2005.

  1. ccyork


    Jan 26, 2004
    ...or is it more about finding the right tone/frequency and getting your cabinet up off the floor?
  2. jokerjkny


    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PHL
    no, never, not ever for moi...

    heck, i'm an acme cab user, and in most of my moderate volume to moderately loud gigs, i'm plenty "present" in the onstage mix.

    for me, its literally a matter of cutting a few dB's, and spinning the frequency knob of my amps' fully parametric EQ section to find that offending "blanketing" frequency that's causing the stage to be muddy, or worse, making everyone else feel buried and cause them to turn up, ruining that onstage balance.

    and while, my tone is much clearer, i'll find that annoying honk or peak that's a byproduct of such EQ'ing, and find a way to smooth out that resultant sound. and because i'm using mostly 10" loaded cabs, VOILA, jokertastic tone.

    vice versa, if everyone else just wont back down, then i'll crank the midrange knob, and do another spin of the parametric EQ knobs to find that one frequency that'll liberate my sound from the din of onstage noise. usually, its in the lower mids around 120-300Hz, but if anything, i'll punch w/ authority thru most mixes.

    once you find the patience to figure out how to properly dial in your EQ on whatever setup, you're more than golden, you're a deliciously golden browned to a caramelized crust. :p
  3. billfitzmaurice

    billfitzmaurice Commercial User

    Sep 15, 2004
    New Hampshire
    Owner, Bill Fitzmaurice Loudspeaker Design
    It's about midrange and dispersion. If you can't hear it turn up the mids and be sure your speakers are pointing at your head and not your knees.
  4. specplyrz

    specplyrz Inactive

    Nov 11, 2005
    If you can't hear it..turn it up! What? I said, if you can't hear it, turn it up! What? Forget it......
  5. I dont think it is, as bill said, its about having the mids in the right place, its about sitting right in the mix

    Altho, i dont have to worry about being too loud atm . . . play in a band with one guitarist, and all he has is a 1x12 100watt SS combo amp, no competition ;)
  6. Planet Boulder

    Planet Boulder Hey, this is a private

    Nov 10, 2001
    6,482 feet above sea level
    I once had impure thoughts. Oh, and I pluck my ear hair.
    Definitely the mids. For the longest time, I was too intent on dialing in "the smile" (cut mids) for the purpose of dialing in what I perceived to be the "right" slap tone. I couldn't figure out why I was getting lost in the mix until I brought the mids back up. IMHO, my slap tone has actually improved because it has more bite.
  7. Masher88

    Masher88 Believe in absurdities and you commit atrocities

    May 7, 2005
    Cleveland, OH
    What you need is 4 -8x10" Ampeg cabs powered by 4 SVT CL heads...can you hear me....wait let me turn up more. BOOOOOM! muuhhaaahhhaahh (evil laughter) :bassist:
  8. slagbass


    Apr 5, 2005
    +1. I've shaken my head a few times when I plug into a backline amp that has been EQ'd by the previous bassist. After cutting the lows (that have been boosted 12dB), boosting the mids (that have been cut to nothing) and backing off the (cranked) volume about 50%, I've got something that allows me to be heard, allows me to hear my bandmates and allows the soundman to get a decent sound out front.
    The "smile" curve sounds great when you are playing alone in your basement. It isn't so useful in a loud band setting.
  9. I have my EQ flat on my Ashdown no cut no boost and this works fine for me. Every venue every gig, always sounds good. I use the EQ on my Spector to control any dominating frequencies or trouble frequencies, but mainly using the EQ as my playing adjusts throughout the set.
  10. I used to run my Warwick Thumb flat on the onboard EQ, and whenever i'd turn down the mids between songs my guitar player would go "that sounds great man you need to do that" so one time I turned the mid-knob down to about 1/3rd, and we went back into the last song. After a few bars the guitar player stopped and swore I had turned my volume knob down to trick him.
  11. chaosMK


    May 26, 2005
    Albuquerque, NM
    Too much hip thrust
    It totally depends on the venue.

    I dont have much trouble being heard these days, but that is probably because I am using a powerful tube amp into an 8x10 stack, with tons of midrange. I use a Sansamp BDDI and Hartke VXL set to different frequencies/tones, depending what I want to cut through. For example, my fingerstyle tone is very midrange intensive, but sounds like ass for slapping and doesnt do the job quite right for deep lows under high gain distortion.

    In practice, I fiddle with my stuff while on stage and take the soundguy's/friends advice (which is usually "turn up/down the low bass"). In theory, I figure for playing a loud rock/metal show, the fans will hardly care as long as the volume and intensity of the experience are there. If I were a smooth jazz cat playing smooth stuff in a lounge then I'd probably be real concerned about it.
  12. seamonkey


    Aug 6, 2004
    Sometimes it's about feeling it in your bones.

    This might be a little controversial but try bass skakers in your pants.

    OK, well maybe shakers bolted to a platform you stand on.
    (Somewhere I saw a commercial made platform)

    Drummers are bolting these things to their thrones to hear their drums.

    Let the sound person worry about what it sounds like out front.
  13. Its mostly the EQ. If you go really into the smiley category, you get volume, you feel the thump, but suddenly you realize you've been playing 2 frets up for God knows how long, maybe half the song for all you know. You couldn't even hear the difference. So of course you turn up, you obviously can't hear yourself...

    The reality is you can't hear the pitch of the note you're playing because you've cut all the freqs that tell you that, and boosted the ones that cause indistinct rumbling.

    If it sounds like ass by yourself, too much treble and midrange, not enough bass, its probably pretty close to right when the band's playing with you. There's a bunch of things in the midrange that are masking your midrange, competing with yours, covering it up, making it disappear when the band's playing. Guitars, horns, cymbals, vocalists.... That's what needs boosting for you to cut through, not the 100Hz and below that's virtually uncontested.

  14. I first dial in my tone, then I just turn up the master until I am at a hearable volume in the mix. Note that we usually have no PA for guitar or bass. If the mids are up on my amp, as they sometimes are one or two bands I play in on occasion, then I do not need to turn up as loud.