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Is it worth fighting this ticket?

Discussion in 'Off Topic [BG]' started by silentstranger, May 10, 2004.

  1. I'm hoping to avoid the fiasco that occurred when Ty Mcneely posted a similar thread a few months back...

    Anyway, I was taking my friend home last week in Grosse Pointe (yea, my first mistake...the rich people are willing to pay for tons more cops milling around than they actually need :rolleyes: ) and got a ticket for turning right on red. I was also informed by the officer that my right rear brakelight (one of three :rolleyes: ) was out, which likely contributed to me getting the ticket instead of a warning for this ridiculous offense. I fixed the light and got it signed off the ticket, but I still have the matter of the turn on red. Apparently signs were posted in two places, but I didn't notice them and just turned because it was almost 1 am and there wasn't another car in sight (meaning I was endangering exactly no one and there was absolutely no reason for turning right on red to be forbidden).

    The question is, is this worth fighting? I know people fight speeding tickets all the time, but I've never heard anything about no turn on red tickets (probably because most cops don't give such stupid tickets :rolleyes: ) I don't yet know what the fine or points will be; I really don't care much about the fine, but I don't want any points for this BS.

    Think there's any reasonable chance at defeating the ticket, or is there pretty much nothing I can do about it? Advice?
  2. cheezewiz

    cheezewiz Supporting Member

    Mar 27, 2002
    Well...it may be a stupid cite in your opinion, but the ordinance is there for a reason your City Council or other governing body thought was important enough to regulate. It's really a black and white issue when you think about it rationally. Did you violate the ordinance or not? If so, why fight it? Be more careful next time, and you won't have to worry about a citation.
  3. Matthew Bryson

    Matthew Bryson Guest

    Jul 30, 2001
    I think that the only way you have a case is if the sign stating "no turn on red" was not visible from where you were stopped at the intersection. If the sign was not visible, you have to get photo's of the intersection that will prove that it was missing, obscured, faded, or otherwise not visible. If the "no turn on red" sign is clearly visible at the intersection, you have no choice but to just pay the fine.

    A friend of mine once got a ticket in a similar situation (his may have been a posted no left turn) He took a bunch of old shabby clothes and such to the scene and hung them all over the street signs and took pictures. He took the pictures to court and told the judge that all of the bums in that area had their clothes hanging up drying and that he'd not seen the sign because it was covered by a homeless mans wash. The judge dropped the ticket. Because of where you got your ticket, I don't think that will work for you.
  4. Eyescream


    Feb 4, 2004
    Knoxville, TN
    Every ticket is worth fighting if you've got a pretty clean record. Something dumb like that will probably get you a night in traffic school and a dismissal with court costs once that's completed.

    It's worth a shot.
  5. i was in court today a woman who had driven over a double yellow line and passed several cars, among them a cop, to catch a left-turn light. the cop was there and testified and the woman did not deny driving over a double yellow line and the judge still dismissed the charges and told her to "be more careful".

    gave me hope for my own speeding ticket.

  6. Rumzini


    Feb 14, 2004
    Jackson, MI
    I have to agree. I use to be a cop...don't hold it against me. There were many times that people would check the box on the reverse side of your violation that says...Admit responsibility with Explanation...they would simply state to the judje that they knew clearly that they were in the wrong after they were written the vilation and that they have a clean record...yada yada yada..and that they didn't wnat to have any points on record due to insurance purposes. * out of ten times..."I will dismiss this case on the assesment of $80.00 court costs. Can you pay for that today or shall we set up a payment plan???" If your professional, kind, cleaned up and courteous at the hearing you should do fine. Let us know what happens.
  7. ONYX


    Apr 14, 2000
    Grosse Pointe, eh?? I live within walking distance of Grosse Pointe. I've gotten tickets there before. It's a city full of snobs who are of the mindset that if you aren't one of them--i.e income of $750,000 or more a year---then you have no business being within the boundries of their little encampment.

    I'd say fight the ticket, but don't hold your breath and hope to get it dismissed.

    BTW--Grosse Pointe is kind of a drive from Ann Arbor. You must be a really good friend to drive someone home that far!!! ;)
  8. Bad Brains

    Bad Brains Banned

    Jan 7, 2004
    Detroit, michigan

    Which Grosse Point? Woods?? Farms??

    I got a speeding ticket in Grosse Points woods last year while on lunch break at work (i work in St. Clair Shores). The cop was pretty much a dick to me, it was the same cop i held the door open for at the 7-11 on the St. Clair Shores/Grosse Point border, go figure.

    He pulled me over for going 5 over, gave me a ticket for that, then gave me another ticket for accidently handing him my expired regestration even though i had the correct one in the gloove box. And oh yeah, it took 2 sqad cars for this....they definitly have too many cops, rich people always get what they want.

    If you want to fight it, then it's up to you. If you have the money too, and don't want any points on your license then it's a good idea. If not then just pay and be done with it. I got lucky because i happen to work privetly for some laywers who own a pretty high class lawfirm, and they were alble to get me out of it without any points, but i still had to pay the speeding fine.

    I was informed that Grosse Point woods has the toughest system in the state when it comes to things like this, so if you got it there you might not want to bother fighting it unless you have the right kind of representation.
  9. Matthew Bryson

    Matthew Bryson Guest

    Jul 30, 2001
    :eek: Really!? Wow.
  10. Eyescream


    Feb 4, 2004
    Knoxville, TN
    An appearance in court and basically the same little song and dance Rumzini just posted got me out of a reckless driving fine ($500 first offense) with $65 in court costs, a night in traffic school, and a dismissal when it was all said and done. A lot can be said of just being polite and courteous but still standing up for yourself.
  11. LOL! That's absolutely brilliant, I love it! :D :D

    Not an option in my case because bums wouldn't last five minutes in GP before getting picked up by the cops and carted to either jail or Detroit (one of the two...), but I'll have to keep that in mind if I ever get a ticket like that in downtown Ann Arbor. In the situation at hand, I doubt I can argue the signs weren't visible because there are apparently two of them (!)...I have to check out the scene again, but I'm not hopeful.
  12. Daaaaaammmmmiiiiiiiittttttt! You nailed it, I was in GPW :( (I really don't know what the differences are between the Pointes though, other than names). Wow, I thought the cop that got me was bad, but you got me beat by a huge margin!That registration thing is a load of CRAP! :spit:

    You say fight it "if I have the money too", does that mean fighting the ticket will cost me more than just paying it if I lose? (this is a new experience for me) I don't like the sound of that... I'll gladly pay the fine etc, but I don't want my insurance company to find out because then it'll cost A LOT of money. Legal representation and all that seems excessive though; I wasn't planning on doing any more than what Rumzini was saying. I think I need to call the courthouse... :(
    Heh...nope, not that good. I was driving her home from a mutual friend's place in Warren, and then headed to Sterling Heights to spend the night at my parents' house. Still a little drive, but not nearly as friendly ;)
  13. cheezewiz

    cheezewiz Supporting Member

    Mar 27, 2002
  14. Ty McNeely

    Ty McNeely

    Mar 27, 2000
    Call the local police department, or better yet call the Grosse Pointe Police Department and ask about what the fine will be and if it will incur points onto your record.

    If there's no points involved and it's not going to go onto your record, I personally wouldn't worry about it and just pay the fine. If there will be anything at all (even just a mark with no points involved) then I would DEFINITELY contest it. In the event that you ever have a wreck, they will automatically look at this infraction and try to place more blame on you. Do whatever it takes to keep this from going on your record. Do as rum said and go "guilty with explanation" then just say that it was late at night, no traffic, and you simply weren't paying attention. Honesty goes far, even in traffic court. Trust me :D
  15. Bad Brains

    Bad Brains Banned

    Jan 7, 2004
    Detroit, michigan
    It pretty much was BS, i think i was like 6 or 7 over, but still, big deal. I think most of this was a result of me being in this rich neighborhood (one of the richest in the country in fact) while driving a crappy college kid car. I wasn't really surprised, usually when i get bored i used to drive down there to look around at the mansions and such to kill time. So it was bound to happen eventually.

    I just don't like the fact that not but 5 minuts before i held the door open for him while he was entering the 7-11, then the next thing i know i'm getting pulled over. He even said something like "you looked right at me and continued to speed up". If i would have seen him i would of slowed down.
  16. I guess she was hot.

    We have red light cameras here that are notorious for being extremely picky with people making right turns on the red light. The only way to be sure you don't get a ticket is to wait for the light to go green. If not, you have to come to a complete stop before the stop line and wait 3 seconds, then creep forward so you can actually see oncoming traffic, stop and wait three seconds, then go. I usually just refuse to make right turns on intersections with cameras.
    What is worse is that if you get caught I think the ticket is $300 now. They say they raised it for safety reasons but everyone knows that it is just a cash-cow. Like someone is thinking as they come up to a red light "Hmm, if it was only the $80 fine I'd run this light, but since it is $300 I'll stop." :rolleyes:.
    Also, similar to photo radar, they don't place this cameras in dangerous areas where an accident is likely to occur, they place them in the area where they think they can catch the most people.
  17. no, she was pretty average.

    an update to my situation is i got my charges dismissed, too! all i had to do was establish that i was paying attention ("i don't think i was going that fast, and as soon as i saw the speed limit sign, i braked.") and that there was room for the officer to be wrong ("i have no doubt he is convinced of what happened, but i am presenting evidence that there is more going on at the time than he was aware of.").

    i think it helped that he wrote the ticket for the wrong section of the mississippi code. serves him right. he could've just checked the box for speeding, but he wanted to go out of his way and cite the actual section of code. he got it wrong.

    so my charges were dismissed with a warning to be more careful.

    "thank you, your honor."