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Is the Ampeg SVT CL too powerful for 2x210AV cabs?

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by Kuchar, Jun 11, 2018.


  1. Kuchar

    Kuchar

    May 31, 2006
    Michigan
    Hey everyone,
    Been reading some threads from past questions but couldn't really find a solid answer to my question.

    I've been gigging an Avatar B410 Neo for about 8 years now and it's pretty beat up and now has a blown speaker. Rather than replacing the speaker I'd like to get a pair of cabs to replace it.

    I was looking into the SVT 410HLF but will be unable to transport it, so I'm wanting to get a pair of 2x10s. I've heard some good things about the 210AVs but I'm worried that setting my Ampeg SVT CL will be too much for them. Just wanting to see if anyone else has tried this and if I should expect a huge drop off in volume from the Avatar 410 cab or if I'll be very prone to blowing the cabs up with this head.

    Also, there is a Ampeg SVT 210HE cab for sale on craigslist locally, but I doubt I'll be able to get a matching cab anytime soon since they seem pretty hard to find, was wondering if anyone has tried pairing that with a 210AV cab.

    Thanks everyone for any input!
    Appreciate it.
     
  2. Kro

    Kro Supporting Member

    May 7, 2003
    New Jersey
    I've never personally tried them, so I can't comment on the sound, but on paper they don't seem like a bad match as best as I can tell.

    How hard do you typically run your SVT? Noticeable distortion territory?
     
  3. Kuchar

    Kuchar

    May 31, 2006
    Michigan
    Thanks for the reply!

    The "clean" signal is fairly clean, I do use a couple OD pedals that push it into that territory, though.
     
  4. Wasnex

    Wasnex

    Dec 25, 2011
    I believe @JimmyM has played an SVT through a pair of 210AVs.

    Whether the 210AVs are a good choice for you is probably dependent on the volume and power handling you require. If you need more volume/power handling, perhaps a 212AV or a pair of 112AVs would be a better choice.
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2018
    BluesOnBass likes this.
  5. Kro

    Kro Supporting Member

    May 7, 2003
    New Jersey
    Yeah, I wasn't as concerned with the actual level of distortion as much as the amount of power that an SVT pushes out when its power-amp starts getting up into that realm. I'd personally not expect that the amp is too powerful as the title of this thread questions.

    Those cabs will also likely be fairly comparable in volume output to your Avatar 410. Tone… well only you can decide if you like the tone, but I've heard good things on this forum about those 210AV cabs. :)
     
  6. Stumbo

    Stumbo Wherever you go, there you are. Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 11, 2008
    Intergalactic Mind Space
    Song Surgeon sofware
    If you add an HPF to your signal chain, you'll get speaker protection and tighten up the low end.

    Some add an HPF to the end of the effects chain to cut some bass out of the distortion. The Effects Forum can help you out more with that.

    Also, when you stack your cabs vertically what you hear will sound different than your used to because you'll have speakers pretty much in your ear.

    You'll get more balanced stage volume, better stage/FOH dispersion.

    Going FOH during sound check will give you a much better idea of how you sit in the mix.
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2018
  7. lfmn16

    lfmn16 Supporting Member

    Sep 21, 2011
    charles town, wv
    It's not too powerful if you know where your volume knob is. ;)

    I knew a guy who played his SVT with an old, cheap, 2 10" cabinet that was about 100 watts. I've played my SVT though a single 15" cabinet. Use your ears and you'll be fine.
     
  8. Kro

    Kro Supporting Member

    May 7, 2003
    New Jersey
    I have to be honest brother @Stumbo , I love you, but I think I’m experiencing a bit of HPF fatigue.

    OP, did I read your profile right that you have a Sterling? If I’m not mistaken I believe at least some of them (maybe it was just a certain era of 5-string-ers) have a pretty steep roll-off at 60Hz just like my ceramic StingRay 5. If that’s the case, adding an additional HPF may not do all that much unless you run it pretty high (not that people don’t do that). Just something to consider before you drop any cash on another piece of gear.
     
    Kriegs, eriky4003 and Aqualung60 like this.
  9. Burwabit

    Burwabit Likes guitars that tune good and firm feelin women Supporting Member

    Apr 4, 2011
    Lubbock, TX
    I generally say Yes, too powerful. Can you do it with restraint? Yes. But, you could easily kill them with too much low end. Why do that to yourself?

    Would you consider the 212AV instead? Better fit IMHO.
     
    Mastermold and five7 like this.
  10. jumblemind

    jumblemind I also answer to Bryan Supporting Member

    Aug 27, 2011
    Knoxville
    I haven’t run an SVT through mine but I have used them extensively with 500w solid state and hybrid amps with great success. You just have to use your ears. I would echo having an hpf in the chain to help protect them, but these 210AV cabs can hit harder than you expect.

    Volume would be essentially the same since you have the same amount of speaker area. Perceived volume will be different because the 210AVs are sealed and won’t have same low end at the same settings. You will find your tone “faster” and more responsive with the sealed aspect, and they project in the room amazingly.

    As stated, @JimmyM has run this setup in the past...IIRC correctly, he's posted photos of stacking the speakers on top of the SVT, I assume for structural reasons.
     
    Wasnex likes this.
  11. BogeyBass

    BogeyBass

    Sep 14, 2010
    The Avatar 410 you were using can handle more power than a pair of 210av it took 8 years to put it down. But its somewhat common a 410 offers enough SPL for players doing what they are doing. But for most part the cabinet is being pushed on edge. Its enough but barely enough.

    Sound quality the recommendations for a pair of ampeg 212 is a good idea. Slighty more effiency and better sound. Also a 2x15 would give about same amount of SPL as the 410. But using a high powered neo pair would make the 2x15 work as well
     
  12. Kro

    Kro Supporting Member

    May 7, 2003
    New Jersey
    Good point. Any details as to how the Avatar met its demise?
     
  13. Wasnex

    Wasnex

    Dec 25, 2011

    Something to keep in mind is the voicing of the 410HLF is very different from the other cabs you are considering. The HLF has a huge and extended low end.
     
  14. BogeyBass

    BogeyBass

    Sep 14, 2010
    I would assume physical stress over the years being pushed hard. More likely a thermal thing. Or weakened cone surrounds. neos offer lighter magnets and good power handling. But thermally neo is not as good and heat can haunt voice coils over time. Much like SWR and Fender and the Ampeg fridge. Not using series parallel wiring and running all drivers in parallel gives thermal advantage. Likewise with SWR Fender and Eden using heavier cast frame ceramic drivers.

    Ive used eminence loaded 810 for years didnt have much problems. But ive seen the glue on surrounds give out eventually on 4x10 drivers. It does help to rearmount speakers the surround is held in place better. But it's pretty normal to front mount speakers.
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2018
  15. Kro

    Kro Supporting Member

    May 7, 2003
    New Jersey
    I've killed a few Avatars myself over the years, and IME it's easier to run them into mechanical failure via creased cones than thermal failure. All of their cabs tuning is a little different, but it wouldn't surprise me if that played a bit of a role.

    Anyways, I was more looking for something like... "somebody stepped on my EQ pedal and maxed my bass knob" or... "I let my friend use my cab and he blew it up it" (both actual stories of failure I've heard here on TB). :laugh:
     
  16. BogeyBass

    BogeyBass

    Sep 14, 2010
    Exactly which really ties into the whole 410 thing. Its enough but barely enough so the drivers are pushed pretty hard for its lifetime.
     
  17. Kuchar

    Kuchar

    May 31, 2006
    Michigan
    Thanks everyone for all the replies!

    @Kro Yes, I'm still playing the Music Man Sterling though I'm not 100% sure about the roll-off at 60hz.

    Also not certain what caused the Avatar to go out. It definitely wasn't an overnight thing. It's been acting up for a while now. It's just gotten to the point where it's so noticeable I wouldn't want to gig with it any longer. I've pushed it quite hard over the years. Always really liked the cab, would consider just getting another one but I'd like to try something else.

    I was also looking at the AV212 since it's the same depth as the Avatar (meaning I could fit it in my car), just cannot find a used one for the life of me and don't really want to shell out $700 at the moment.

    @BogeyBass Did you mean to say a pair of AV212s? or just a single 2x12 cab? A pair would be out of the price range for sure :/
     
  18. Stumbo

    Stumbo Wherever you go, there you are. Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 11, 2008
    Intergalactic Mind Space
    Song Surgeon sofware
    Me too, with the HPF fatigue. :cautious:

    Still, with the low-knowledge base on the topic and with questions about high power amps with different cabs or TBrs who compete with one or two 100w 4x12 guit players and don't have $3-4K to spend or TBrs who are considering spending a bunch of cash, possibly unnecessarily, an HPF make a lot of sense as the go-to addition.

    And to keep bringing it up.:thumbsup:

    Or not.
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2018
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  19. five7

    five7 Supporting Member

    Dec 5, 2009
    denver
    Is the avatar cab 4 ohms or 8 ohms. If 8 ohms how did your svt like that?
     
    Roccafella likes this.
  20. Kro

    Kro Supporting Member

    May 7, 2003
    New Jersey
    Yes, I guess it's a thankless job. For the record, I'm all for them - I just think that if a lot of players seriously analyzed their signal chain (especially including all effects and amps) they might find that they already have one or two already engaged. Hell, I only use my bass, one pedal (not an HPF), and an amp, and I have 3 included in my chain! :cool:

    Yeah, it is the good fight. You probably should. :)
     
    Stumbo likes this.