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just popped for a Yamahiko

Discussion in 'Amps, Mics & Pickups [DB]' started by Mike Arnopol, Jan 9, 2015.


  1. Mike Arnopol

    Mike Arnopol Supporting Member Commercial User

    Jan 4, 2005
    Chicago
    Owner of MAS Soundworks
    Ok---checked the conversion. The dollar is weak. Fortunately the Yen is weaker. $259 shipped.

    Bit the bullet.
     
  2. scott reed

    scott reed Supporting Member

    Nov 4, 2002
    Memphis
    I'll be interested to hear what you think of it. I've had one for a couple of years and one of my basses likes it.
     
  3. Ric Vice

    Ric Vice Supporting Member

    Jul 2, 2005
    Olivette, Missouri
    Single or Dual Element? That's a very reasonable price for that pickup, they were around $500.00. I was told that the Fishman Full Circle, owes quite a debt of "gratitude" to the Yamahiko.

    Ric
     
  4. flatback

    flatback

    May 6, 2004
    Yeah at that price it is the one element version...but super smart to get just the one...what if you don't like it? The thing is With the MAS speakers and a decent preamp (Headway or better) just about any pickup can sound pretty good...and if this is a good Piezo I'll bet Mike will be able to make it sound best...curious to hear what you think....I am still really loving the Schertler Vintage Stat B into your MAS 46. Mostly it totally kills it for every gig...although last night outdoors with a trio I wasn't getting my normal fat sound ...it was midrangy for some reason and no amount of knob fiddlin made it better....
    Let us know how you like the Yamahiko.
     
  5. Mike Arnopol

    Mike Arnopol Supporting Member Commercial User

    Jan 4, 2005
    Chicago
    Owner of MAS Soundworks
    Eric Hochberg uses that Schertler and gets a great sound.I tried one years ago and found it to be super-finicky as far as setup.As in all contact-type pickups---piezos or whatever you call the Schertler---it's not a piezo but some sort of electrostatic sort of thing---they all must make perfect contact and at the perfect pressure. Back in the Cro-Magnon days when we all used the Underwood ---I can say this with all honesty and humility-- I got the best Underwood sound. I went nuts with filing the slots perfectly ---even using graphite to insure maximum contact--and would literally use rolling papers as shims (I hear they also have other uses) to get the perfect pressure on the pickup. To much-enough bass but wanky mids and a bit staccato---to little---no low end. It was a very finicky balance. Same with the Fishman BP100. Contact area had to be perfectly flat. Same with the Full Circle. I've actually made 1/4" thick maple circles that I glued to the surface where the FC normally contacts. I then glue sandpaper with a 1/4" hole to a spare adjuster to sand the surface perfectly. So now I can turn the FC to any position and the sound is consistent.

    Perfect contact area and the right amount of pressure are imperative with all of these pickups. And 95% of the basses I see are improperly set up as far as this. So---the gist of my long-winded shpiel (?) is that if the Schertler is middy---it's likely not making perfect contact. The Schertler is more finicky than piezos in this regard. But if you get them dialed in---they can sound great.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2015
    martinc, Groove Doctor and Don Kasper like this.
  6. flatback

    flatback

    May 6, 2004
    yeah you are so right. It IS the contact....The thing I like about the Stat B is that once it is dialed in, it is really an awesome sound WITH A BAND. I dont like any pickup really by itself so to me every pickup I judge by how it sounds when I am playing it IN CONTEXT. Anyway, my Stat B mount is funky, I really mean to take it to Gael and have him make a proper shim in the bridge. There really should be a good contact, but one of the reasons that I am so into this pick up now is that I realized that the CONTACT side, the PICKUP side is the CORK (I think) and that makes it the easiest to shape. also I think that the soft cork between the pickup and the wood of the bridge takes away a lot of the hard mid range over emphasis. I could be totally wrong and I would really love to see how someone like you would futz with the mounting and what you could come up with in terms of sound....The Underwood thru your speaker (and a Headway) sounds pretty damn good (WITH A BAND) ....Im not screaming just emphasizing....
     
    PaperbackRyder likes this.
  7. flatback

    flatback

    May 6, 2004
    But I have always been interested in the Yamahiko and I am super curious if you get a good sound from it and what your experiences are with it THRU MAS CABS...They just make such a huge difference (on stage)
     
  8. flatback

    flatback

    May 6, 2004
    One other thing...I'd sure like to see what you are talking about with the FC....pictures? How can you turn the wheel and still have your maple disc be in contact? Are there different Discs for different heights (as in you are making a solid bridge leg out of it?) Or are you doing that so that the entire surface of the FC disc is in contact with the maple disc? I dont use my FC because I dont like aspects of the sound but it could very well be misalignment...Can you teach me how to get it right?
     
  9. Ric Vice

    Ric Vice Supporting Member

    Jul 2, 2005
    Olivette, Missouri
    +1
    Luthiers are so important to talk to when you get a new pickup. My Underwood was fitted by one, the Realist was installed by one, so I've never even attempted to set up a new pickup without taking it
    in to the shop. It may cost a little more, but it's worth it IMHO. Even if I wasn't enamored with the sound of a particular pickup, at least it it was installed on the bass in a way that gave me the optimal
    sound possible from that pickup.

    Ric
     
    Josh Kneisel and robgrow like this.
  10. Michael Eisenman

    Michael Eisenman Supporting Member

    Jun 21, 2006
    Eugene, Oregon
  11. Mike Arnopol

    Mike Arnopol Supporting Member Commercial User

    Jan 4, 2005
    Chicago
    Owner of MAS Soundworks
    I'll take pics of my bridge. I told the engineers at Fishman what I did and they said "sounds like a good idea"
     
  12. flatback

    flatback

    May 6, 2004
    Hey thanks man...I'll try it. Would love to see the pics
     
  13. kscbass

    kscbass Supporting Member

    Sep 12, 2006
    Miami
    I'm very interested on a Yamahiko/Full Circle comparison.
     
  14. flatback

    flatback

    May 6, 2004
    Man I really want to hear what you can do with this Pickup because every clip of it has both an attraction and a huge repulsion. Listening to the clips and EG's records using it, I don't think that it is being EQ'd to its full advantage. It will be interesting to see and hear for example what you find the ideal impedence/preamp combo will be or if it even works out at all. And then presuming you like it there is the second element. I have been looking at it for some time wondering for example if you had the two element version with two imputs (rather then ganging the imputs into one) and ran that into a Headway or something would being able to eq and or adjust the gain and phase make anything more then a big pain in the ass? Actually it isnt that big a pain to run them to a stereo jack and then split the signal in the Headway....anyway one thing at a time....I would still like to see a pic of how you did the FC and how you will presumably mount this one....?
     
  15. I once got a dual wingslot type pickup customized, so I could run each side into its own channel and mix them. I gave up the experiment because as soon as you turned one of the elements just a little bit up, I seemed to get the "flatter" sound which is the problem with these pickups imo. In other words, as soon as one of them was slightly in the mix, you got the phase cancelation issue, that must be part of a dual pickup system like this, imo.
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2015
  16. Povl, did you try a phase inversion on one one of the channels when mixing the two pickups?
     
  17. No. I am pretty sure I turned one of the sides upside down, which I assumed would change the phase, but now I understand it does not, because these kind of pickup pick up pressure and not vibration (?). I would guess that the producer has tried out the phases in designing the pickup, but ofcourse, if you want to be totally sure... I believe it was on a Shadow pickup I did the experiment (looks like Underwood, but silver coloured?).
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2015
  18. Ric Vice

    Ric Vice Supporting Member

    Jul 2, 2005
    Olivette, Missouri
    Povi,
    I talked with Don Underwood once, since he had built a four element pickup for Glenn Moore, that could be either in phase or out of phase. It had two elements inside each of the outer metal sleeves. So, I believe that even a regular two element, Underwood can
    have issues with phase "artifacts" as I know players, who only use one side of the pickup.
    I would postulate that's why the Realist, Realist Life Line, Full Circle, Ehrlund, and Schertler Stat B, only use one element. Just my opinion.


    Ric
     
  19. flatback

    flatback

    May 6, 2004
    I have found using the Stat B Vintage that the so called phase issue is easily solved by making sure each element has proper pressure. Phase cancelation is pretty easy to hear when it happens (in your stereo speakers for example) it sounds just like what it is. It's kind of like when someone steals your bounce on a trampoline. How a two element pickup shares the sound (without phase issues) is a different question. A Stat B with only one element on the E side sounds different then when they are both engaged...in my opinion better its with two...because of the kind of natural HPF that seems to happen when the signal is shared (it isnt phasing) it would be nice to control that some...and back to the Yamahiko, I am really interested in that second element design because it makes trying out all the possibilities really easy (the way all the connectors are interchangeable and that it would be easy enough ...and cheap enough to buy 2 single element versions and then test all the combos)
     
  20. Roger Mouton

    Roger Mouton Supporting Member

    Aug 19, 2003
    Southern California
    There was another Yamahiko thread floating around sometime ago. I don't believe it ever got to the testing stage like this one. Looks like now we're going to get a comparison.

    I have an acquaintance in Japan and I asked him once about the origin of the pick-up. There may even be a story of origin on Yamahiko's website. My Japanese contact, who is not in the music industry, told me that expensive electronics manufacturing equipment required monitoring of certain internal moving part vibrations. It would seem to indicate that the sensors they make for monitoring these vibrations would have to be uniform in character and function before they're used.

    Calibration could compensate for differences and/or varying sensitivities but the impression I get is that these are minimal with Yamahiko. It seems when people talk about the FC p/u the talk runs the gamut from "tricky wire leads" to "it just pooped out one day". Yamahiko seems to have some nifty little threaded connectors that should preclude such damage. Aaah, but how it sounds. That's the question.