Lakland's made from Warmoth parts?

Discussion in 'Basses [BG]' started by embellisher, Dec 31, 2000.

  1. embellisher

    embellisher Holy Ghost filled Bass Player Staff Member Supporting Member

    Well, I couldn't find a Lakland 5 string or a fretless to demo.:(

    But I played a 4-94 Classic, it does appear to have a wide range of tones indeed.

    I went to another shop that didn't have any Laklands, played a couple of Moduli and Alembics(hated them all) and asked the guy if he was a Lakland dealer.

    He proceeded to tell me what crap Laklands were, how they are made out of Warmoth parts, and how he has had dinner with Mr. WhatevertheguywhoownsWarmoth'sname is and was taken to the Warmoth factory and shown Lakland bodies and necks hanging up. Of course, they were unfinished and did not have the Lakland name on them yet.

    He said that he couldn't see spending $2500 for a bass made out of $400 worth of Warmoth parts and $250 worth of Bart electronics(which he blasted too, he swore Lane Poor is still in business but Bartolini has filed Chapter 11:rolleyes: - BTW, this isn't true, is it?). He said that basically a bunch of fools are paying Lakland $1800 to finish the wood and assemble the bass.

    Is this guy for real, or is this one of those vicious lies like people tell about Sadowsky?

    He also called me an idiot for owning an SWR amp and buying an Eden amp. He is a tube purist, and said that you can't get traditional, warm tones with hifi amps, that they are strictly for Marcus Miller clones.
  2. Thumper

    Thumper Supporting Member

    Mar 22, 2000
    Layton, UT
    I would think the amount of idiotic statements he made would serve to dispel his viscious, self-serving ranting.
  3. Yvon

    Yvon Supporting Member

    Nov 2, 2000
    Montreal, Canada
    I think you need to be stupid to work in a music store. In montreal at least...
    Remember what Roger wrote about the parts being done outside the shop?
    It is true for Lakland also. He said it himslef in his reply. You can do a search, if you can't find it i will copy it and send it to you.
    Maybe that contract is given to warmoth. But they use Roger or Lakland wood. So you have great wood. If the body where done anywhere it wouldn't change a thing. If they use there own wood and there own have a Sadowsky or a Lakland...not a warmoth.
    My opinion

  4. embellisher

    embellisher Holy Ghost filled Bass Player Staff Member Supporting Member

    The guy thinks he is a tone expert, but I guessed based on the Lane Poor(they don't even have a website anymore:()/Bartolini comment alone, I shouldn't have listened to anything else he said.

    It's just that I am very close to deciding on a used Lakland fretless, and I was hoping that there was no basis in fact for his comments.

    I know that the fit & finish on the 4-94 I played was as good as any bass I have ever seen.
  5. I am apalled at some of the crap I hear at music stores I visit, whether it is how great the items that they stock are or how bad lines are that they don't carry. Opinions are like assholes, they all stink sometimes others all the time.
  6. Brad Johnson

    Brad Johnson Commercial User

    Mar 8, 2000
    Gaithersburg, Md
    Boom Bass Cabinets, DR strings
    I've considered building a Warmoth bass several times over the years. Some of their bodies look spectacular. As someone who has actually added up the cost, several times, of building a Warmoth myself, I can't imagine where this guy thinks he'd get the parts to build a Warmoth for anywhere near $400. A finished body and neck will run close to $600. Add a laminate top, add some bucks. Want 19mm spacing on a five? Sorry. It was going to cost me in excess of $1000 for parts for a bass that on paper might be comparable to a Lakland or Sadowsky. I say might because, until it's built I'd have no idea what it would sound like. I'll also admit that these luthiers have more experience than me at QC'ing and setting up basses.

    What I don't get is people who say that someone is using Warmoth parts like it's an insult. Warmoth makes some very nice stuff. If you can read and cypher you soon realize that they aren't cheap or inexpensive:D

    So what would I end up with for that money? A bass that would need to be assembled and setup up, that might sound like I wanted it to. That has relatively little resale value. It might be a great bass. It might not.

    Do I care where Dan's or Roger's bodies are made...nope. If they're up to their specs, why should anyone?

    Em-B, the LP/Bartolini comments should have made you take what this guy said with a pound of salt:D
    The tube comments... they're opinions and I can't say they're wrong, though I don't use tubes, don't want tubes and only sound like Marcus when I try to;) I do sometimes yearn for the tube butteriness that the Acoustic 360 gave Jaco. I use an AMP BH-420 and there's not one tube in it (I looked) yet it is amongst the smoothest amps I've ever heard.

    Badmouthing competition is usually a sign that you have nothing to sell. If your products have merit, you don't need to do this.

    BTW I'd take being called an idiot by a bonehead as a compliment.
  7. embellisher

    embellisher Holy Ghost filled Bass Player Staff Member Supporting Member

    LMAO! True, Brad, I guess I should consider the source.

    What gets me about him trashing Eden is that he carries it, right there alongside the Ampegs(can't stand the Crate ones!) and the Aguilars(love those, but can't afford them!).

    Oh, he also said that somebody who couldn't appreciate a Modulus or an Alembic must be somebody who uses old Fenders to play blues. :rolleyes:

    I happen to like old Fenders, and blues, but I don't play either.

    This is the same guy who recommended the Aguilar internal preamp for my Ibanez. I would still like to try that mod, but now I am going to look for somebody else to do it for me.

    And I can guarantee you when I need an Eden extension cab, or if I ever decide that I like Alembic or Modulus(not likely), that I will find someplace else to spend my $$$.
  8. Yvon

    Yvon Supporting Member

    Nov 2, 2000
    Montreal, Canada
    I think the onboard aguilar pre-amp is good, I never listen to it, but i guess it sound alot like my sadowsky pre-amp. I think it could be a great modification. But why wouldn't you buy the out-board one?
    you could use it with more than one bass, and when you upgrade you could have it for another bass. That's what i would don't have to.
    Just bypass the pre-amp in your bass, you could have a switch install, it will cost you about 25$ if you can't do it yourself.

    Only an idea....
  9. mchildree

    mchildree Supporting Member

    Sep 4, 2000
    You REALLY have to be careful when dealing with music store salespeople. The days of helpful, knowledgeable staff in music stores is a thing of the past in most cases. It disappeared along with the small shops, IMO. I'm with Brad on the Warmoth thing, too. From what I've seen of Warmoth parts, they're of higher quality than you'd find on your average Fender, Musicman, Ibanez, etc. Speaking of that, I'll never forget the guy that told me Ibanez was a Mexican company...he pronounced it EE-bahn-yez. He was Hispanic himself and said it with a great deal of pride...I didn't have the heart to tell him he was all wrong.
  10. What a load of Crap. Laklands don't have anything to do with Warmoth parts. That guy wanted to stear you away from Lakland, obviously because he was trying to talk you into something he sells.

    I worked at Lakland for 5 years, so I pretty much know what's going into them, and the processes that go into their construction.

    Happy New Year!!
  11. Whether or not it's true, it's a fact that many manufacturers DO contract out certain aspects of their production to companies who are able to do a particular job cheaper, faster, or better. Many, many brand names are composed of parts from many sources, for example, Washburn machineheads, and Pedulla, and Ibanez etc, etc, are just Gotohs with the Washburn (or whatever) logo on them. This does not mean they are inferior. These companies recognise that it's pointless them spending huge bucks on R&D and tooling, when a perfectly satisfactory alternative is available at a very reasonable cost. In the case of a small concern like Lakland which has suddenly exploded into a fairly big operation, it would make perfect sense for them to farm out some aspects of their production, rather than trying to expand their premises, staff numbers, machinery etc in order to cope with demand. This is a normal business practice.
  12. It certainly is, and in the case of Lakland - as you said, for them to purchase the tooling, and hiring the staff neccessary to build enough of them to meet demand would be cost prohibitive. The bodies (and now the necks) are made to their specs buy a company with CNC machines. To build them all by hand is way too labor intensive, and the cost of their basses would have to increase accordingly. In addition, it allows them to produce a more consistent product.

    The hardware is made by Hipshot, to their specs. Not just stock Hipshot parts off of their shelf.

    This practice is done by Roger Sadowsky, as well as Mike Lull, among many others. Very few still make them entirely by hand, as is the case with Rob Elrick.
  13. Randy Payne

    Randy Payne

    Jan 1, 2001
    I'll second what Brad said about Warmoth parts. They are of the highest quality. Even if Lakland did use Warmoth parts, I wouldn't consider it a "problem".
  14. air_leech


    Sep 1, 2000
    heh, I went to a store were they had really old and abused Warwicks, the guy there wanted 2000$ for a heavily used 5 string Corvette (it had dust particles in the cervices of the wenge fingerboard and some green slime or mosh on it plus the strap buttons were rusted a bit), so I asked why the hell does he want twice the price that the local distributer asks for. his reply was: "yeah but these old Warwicks are made in America while the new ones are made in Korea"

    now thats a dumb one!

    I suggest not relying on information from sales people in those stores. don't buy your gear from people who don't even have a clue what they are selling. my warwick was purchased from the only certified distributer.
  15. Munjibunga

    Munjibunga Total Hyper-Elite Member Gold Supporting Member

    May 6, 2000
    San Diego (when not at Groom Lake)
    Independent Contractor to Bass San Diego
    This guy ... was his name "Dick"?
  16. lowfreakwency


    Dec 28, 2000
    I agree completely with Herm. I worked with Paul Reed Smith when he first started. Back then, we made just about everything (or bought off the shelf), but started farming out some of the hardware production not long afterwards (locking nuts, tuners, pickups, etc.). We were building about one guitar a month, now he's doing close to 20 a day.

    Although, there's a pretty good chance he's still cutting bodies and necks at the factory on the Eastern Shore of Maryland.
  17. embellisher

    embellisher Holy Ghost filled Bass Player Staff Member Supporting Member

    No... But it should have been!
  18. Laker


    Mar 23, 2000
    Embellisher, I guess, in a roundabout way, that "dealer" did answer your question. With all the crap he shoveled he definitely isn't a Lakland dealer.
  19. embellisher

    embellisher Holy Ghost filled Bass Player Staff Member Supporting Member

    Laker, I was pretty sure he wasn't a dealer before I asked him the question.

    I think he was pissed at me because the only high end basses that he had that I liked were a used Pedulla ThunderBolt 6, a used Ken Smith 6 and the several Spectors that he had.

    I really liked the Spector 5s, the USA bolt ons are within my budget, even prettier than the PentaBuzz or the Lakland 55-94(IMHO) but The string spacing is too narrow and the neck is too chunky.

    He was extremely offended that I like the sound of my Pedulla Rapture more than any Modulus or Alembic that he had in stock.
  20. Brad Johnson

    Brad Johnson Commercial User

    Mar 8, 2000
    Gaithersburg, Md
    Boom Bass Cabinets, DR strings
    I grew up on the Eastern Shore, near St. Michaels. I haven't seen Paul in over ten or more years, back when he was on West St. in Annapolis.