Psst... Ready to join TalkBass and start posting, make new friends, sell your gear, and more?  Register your free account in 30 seconds.

Leveraging Talkbass Buying Power

Discussion in 'Miscellaneous [BG]' started by rickbass, Sep 18, 2002.


  1. rickbass

    rickbass Supporting Member

    If you noticed or participated in the Talkbass poll on the site's homepage, over one-fifth of the respondents, (the largest percentage - 140 of us to date report spending over $2k (US) on bass gear in the last year. Or, 1291 GBP or 2047 Euros.

    That's a lot of buying power.

    I would imagine we aren't including Talkbass Supporting memberships, t-shirts and bass magazine subscriptions.

    Doesn't it seem that dealers in bass gear are really missing the boat by not supporting the site with their ads, at the very least???
     
  2. Blackbird

    Blackbird Moderator Staff Member Supporting Member

    Mar 18, 2000
    California
    I think SWR has exclusive advertising rights.
     
  3. DanGouge

    DanGouge

    May 25, 2000
    Canada!
    Also I think that paul wants to keep the site relatively clean looking. He could no doubt attract more adverts but I don't think he wants to unless he has too. Which is good on the whole...
     
  4. rickbass

    rickbass Supporting Member

    I don't get that at all in a capitalistic society Dan, as long as pop-ups don't haunt us or downgrading the site to a situation where no one can speak ill of the best advertisers.

    In other words, as I see it now - the Supporting Members and those who buy Talkbass gear are doing ad hoc advertising for gear and gear dealers who should be actively contributing to the costs of keeping the website alive.

    Ever seen an ad by Fender, MIke Tobias, Alembic, Bass Central, Bass NW, Musicians's Fiend, and a jillion others who are constantly promoted here on Talkbass step up and never contribute to "the cause"??? ---- Hell NO!!! They all want the gravy but won't pay to buy the meat. To their credit, more honorable people like Steve Rabe of SWR, Roger Sadowsky, Ken Smith, Zzounds.com and Dave Pushic, to name a few, have stepped up to the plate and have taken the trouble to become TB members.

    What can I say? - Maybe I'm just old and in the way. I'm an old punker from the late 70's and I have disdain for the predatory attitude I perceive buy such parasites as St. Louis Music (Ampeg), Fender, Modulus, and other leeches.
     
  5. oddentity

    oddentity

    Nov 20, 2000
    Philly
    Just wondering - why lump Modulus in with Fender and St Louis Music? They don't seem to be in the same league, to me.

    I think you're right that dealers are missing out -- but guys like Tobias, BassNW, etc surely don't have the advertising budget of SWR or Musicians Fiend (er, Friend).
     
  6. i wouldn't call them leeches, just not very bright. having people like bob lee, trip wamsley, and thomguy around to stand behind QSC, Gallien-Krueger and Thomastik-Infeld, respectively, makes me far more confident about buying one of their products. i know that if i ever come across deficiencies, there's somebody here that will take responsibility or at least answer for them. it puts a human face on things.
     
  7. DanGouge

    DanGouge

    May 25, 2000
    Canada!
    Cool, I just was repeating what I understood to be paul's position on the matter based on posts made when the deal with SWR was announced.
     
  8. Plucky

    Plucky

    Jun 18, 2002
    Underwater

    .....and you didnt count food, diapers, and two mortgages......
     
  9. rickbass

    rickbass Supporting Member

    odd - It's not a matter of "price point." It's a matter of "free promotion" at the expense of the people who support the site.

    Hell, there was a company that gave away a top-of-the-line bass here in a contest the other Christmas, (odie won it I think), and I respect them more for that than the stiffs like Alembic and Fender who get promoted in threads all the time and have made an industry off of us for decades. It's like some companies give a hang and the other just want to dip into our wallets free of charge for as long as they can.

    It's known as "giving back to those who enabled you to put food on your table." If the company is relatively small with low overhead or putting a lot into R&D to give us ever-better gear, like Basslabs, then I have no problem with them being tight with the money.

    On the other hand, there are "fat cats" who benefit from ad hoc free advertising here. All they know is "take".
     
  10. rickbass

    rickbass Supporting Member

    IMO - Bob Lee and the Thomasik rep are most cool to help us out. That's even better that ads and they do without being self-promotional.
     
  11. rickbass

    rickbass Supporting Member

    Their choice, not mine. If you can't afford them, don't take them on. It's called "being responsible for your actions/zipper."
     
  12. oddentity

    oddentity

    Nov 20, 2000
    Philly
    I do see your point, but hey... that's capitalism, right?

    What you call "free promotion" I call "word of mouth".

    EDIT: Would you slam Fender, Modulus, and Ampeg if their sales directors were supporting members here, and contributed in the way that Bob Lee and Roger Sadowsky do?
     
  13. rickbass

    rickbass Supporting Member

    As always, you're a good businessman, odie.

    But I see it as "replensihing" the field that gave you the crop in the first place.
     
  14. oddentity

    oddentity

    Nov 20, 2000
    Philly
    See my above edit... personally, I think that such "replenishing" might be better served than bogging this site down with adverts. I'd rather see a Fender representative "giving back" as an active member here, answering questions, than have Fender advertising here. This place reminds me of PBS - good content with little paid advertising. I don't mind paying $20 a year to keep this place "mine" instead of Fender's.

    Btw, I'm a terrible businessman. You only have to check my bank account to prove that! :eek:
     
  15. rickbass

    rickbass Supporting Member

    I never met a fine musician who wasn't a sucky businessperson. Vocalists usually are good accountants types, a la Mick Jagger.

    To me, that's virtually a badge of honor....Art above what your drive, your home, or what you wear. And that's why we get played for suckers, too. :rolleyes:

    But when the Grim Reaper comes, there are few regrets as I see it.
     
  16. EEbass04

    EEbass04

    Dec 28, 2001
    Lee's Summit:MO
    The amount of people here that support Fender and Ampeg. You think somebody would catch on somehow. But with the bashing of Fender and St. Louis Music Company. It makes me wonder if they really even do have knowledge of this site. If they do, I hope they do come check it out sometime and can give us advice or heads up on new gear and stuff.
     
  17. I just wanted to post a few lines in defense of Mike Tobias, and the guys at Modulus. I personally speak with Mike and the Modulus crew on a regular basis, and I assure you that these people are in no way purposely thumbing their nose at anything nor do they have some predatory corporate mentality.

    The bottom line is that yes, every business is out to make money. But have you bought an MTD bass?? Have you ever had a question about an MTD and emailed the company? Mike Tobias will be the first to respond to your question. ON top of that, most of these boutique manufacturers are not kin to Bill Gates. They're not super rich folks that just have more money then sense. They work hard and deserve nothing but credit for doing an outstanding job! Mike Tobias may not submit articles to the site every day, but the man is busy building some of the best bass guitars on the planet! And...taking very good care of his customers! So ease up.

    As far as advertising goes, most of these boutique bass manufacturers can't build enough to keep up with demand already, why should they invest more in advertising?

    I hope this post doesn't come off as adversarial, but I have to defend these guys and I think that it is just a lack of understanding that is causing these generalizations to be posted. My tone as I write is meant to be very calm and reasonable, which doesn't tranlsate well on boards.

    Have Paul (I think that was the owner of the site) give me a call if he is looking for advertisers. I may interested if the price is right. It's the new companies like mine and budding manufacturers that are the companies that will be willing to financially support sites like this. But keep in mind that all business people are all busy staying in business supporting their customers and making sure employees get paid.

    Anyway, fire away, and if you want the inside scoop on Modulus or MTD email me. Basically these guys are great and are doing a great job of serving the market and doing the best they can to "give a little back". When you have a great product that is in demand...your first job is to produce that product! Give them some credit...

    James

    http://www.theperfectbass.com
     
  18. If you have any questions about MTD, Modulus or Roscoe gear, I'll be happy to let you know what I know!

    Peace,
    James @ The Perfect Bass

    http://www.theperfectbass.com
     
  19. Wow. Now this has been a good thread to read. Right on Rickbass! Power to the people!
    That said, I hereby weigh in as being in favor of keeping the site "ours," and having manufacurers provide their support in supporting member fashion. I commend those who already are. While I've never been a fan of KSB in particular, I gotta give the man props for showing the good example on the part of a manufacturer. I similarly salute all manufacturers who participate constructively.
    As for the site's current commercial content, I like the understatedness of it. I'm sure Paul & SWR are cozy with it too. I guess the point is that manufacturers who do well by the site, a la KSB et. al, should probably be able to trumpet positive TB feedback in their print ads in order to really give the TB membership some clout. If a manufacturer learned to value TB that highly, then TB membership discounts would become a logical extention of the relationship. Perhaps this whole "atmoshpere of cooperation" thing was Rickbass' original vision to begin with.
     
  20. it is, of course, entirely possible that many companies don't even know about this site.