Looking for a light and portable rig: considering ea, berg, and epi.

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by ArwinH, Sep 21, 2006.


  1. jokerjkny

    jokerjkny

    Jan 19, 2002
    NY / NJ / PHL
    the EA setup seems like the best compromise. the nl210 footprint is amazingly small, and i've fed a whole 3,000 hall w/ just my iAMP800 + nl210. terrific little combo.

    but dont discount the epifani ul112's. i've been using a pair w/ the ul502 head for a few months now, and day in night out, they've been SOOOO good to me. fat, focused kick that's louder than you'll ever need. i thought i'd miss the rounded punch of 10" speakers, but the ul112's have me quickly rethinking that. and they're stupendously light to carry. like empty briefcases.
     
  2. Since the OP was suggesting a NL-210, I was working with that. I use 2 Wizzy's - and I'm expecting an M-line Wizzy in the mail shortly. They are the bomb.

    Jay
     
  3. 62bass

    62bass

    Apr 3, 2005
    I agree completely and was never in doubt about the actual difference in perceived volume between 4 ohm and 8 ohm cabinets. I know from experience it's not a problem. My only gripe with the Wizzy is I can't use a pair with my amp and I really like my amp. I also really like the size and weight of the Wizzy. I haven't been able to try one, but based on reports from others, they sound like the type of sound I like.

    I know you didn't aim your explanation at me specifically, but thought I'd let you know how I feel. You know, an 8 ohm Wizzy might be just the thing for someone who wants to stack 4 of them for use with the Iamp. :)
     
  4. FunkyLemz

    FunkyLemz Supporting Member

    Oct 17, 2005
    Los Angeles, CA
    Hey Arwin, I didnt even realize this was your thread buddy. How's this world treating ya?
     
  5. Mike Dimin

    Mike Dimin Inactive

    Dec 11, 1999
    I didn't aim it at you - and I completely understand your feeling. The Wizzy is a great cab and, well, the more the merrier.

    There has just so much misconception about 4 ohm vs. 8 ohm that I was going to burst.

    Mike

    ps I think you would also like our 2 ohm stable iamps ;o)
     
  6. HMZ

    HMZ Supporting Member

    Dec 21, 2003
    USA-Mineola
    Eden/Nemesis 210 combo 250 watts, two tens, 47 lbs. I love it, its light and sounds great.
     
  7. Well.. the iAmp will definitely be less furry and cleaner, and it puts out quite a lot of volume and low end. As Tom mentions, the DB750 puts out quite a wumping punch, but the iAmp800 with two cabs running at 800 watts into a 4ohm load is close to being as loud IMO, and would be a more 'neutral' platform for staying clean or adding 'grit'. I feel pretty good about you liking it, based on what you describe above.
     
  8. seanm

    seanm I'd kill for a Nobel Peace Prize! Supporting Member

    Feb 19, 2004
    Ottawa, Canada
    +1 I also prefer the wizzy cabs. The CXL-112 was *too* clean for me, although they make great monitors.

    If the amp can't handle two ohms, how about running two wizzys in series? You would need a special cables but with speakons it would be easy. I can understand not wanting the hassle through.
     
  9. Hrothgar

    Hrothgar Guest

    Sep 22, 2003
    Seattle
    I'll second that! Run mine without a pre too and love it!
     
  10. 62bass

    62bass

    Apr 3, 2005
    If the amp can't handle two ohms, how about running two wizzys in series? You would need a special cables but with speakons it would be easy. I can understand not wanting the hassle through.[/QUOTE]

    That's a thought. Although I wouldn't get much more than 150 watts out of my amp at 8 ohms, I would get a bigger sound. I don't generally need a huge amount of volume or to wring the last db possible out of my amp.
     

  11. Mike,

    Except for your Accuswitch comment, that seems to indicate that you believe it actually did change the impedance of the cab from 8 to 4:)eek: ;) ), I appreciate what you are saying here.

    However, here's the deal from a 'single cab user' consumer perspective. You offer a very powerful head that can safely run down to 2 ohms. You offer the wonderful NL210 in 4ohm version for stand alone operation or 8 ohm for those who use two. Also, since the iAmp800 can safely run down to 2ohms, you could also choose two 4ohm NL-210's to generate the full power of the iAmp into that stack, etc. So far, wonderful and very similar to other companies' offerings.

    However, for the NM410, which I would assume would, for most, be a single cab solution, you are only offering an 8ohm version.... resulting in your top of the line head (800) putting only 1/2 its wattage into that 1000 watt cab. Also, two 4ohm NM410's could benefit from the iAmp800 cranking out its full 1000 watts into a combined two ohm nominal impedance. Yes, the volume difference between 4 and 8 isn't huge, but it's there (and when you start adding +3db along with stacking multiple cabs... it starts to really be there!), and the increased headroom is also there.

    The other thing that seems to be lost in the 'doubling of power yields only +3db of additional volume' is the impact of 'max power and clipping'. Obviously, if you have an amp running at 500 watts into 8 ohms and 800 into 4, and you aren't even pushing the amp at the 8 ohm level, you won't hear ANY difference. However... if you are running right to the edge of the clean power of an amp at 8 ohms, reducing the nominal impedance of the speaker and hence allowing the amp to generate more power, and most importantly, more peak power can really clean up the low end and result in a better tone IMO and IME.

    No big deal, and I realize there are subtle differences between the same cab in 4ohm versus 8ohm, but it seems like a puzzling decision to me. If the NM-410 is jumping off the shelves in 8ohm only version, than obviously it is a moot point as you suggest. If sales have been and continue to be disappointing, well, maybe a revision in design goals and specs could help:)

    The reason I'm chiming in here is that I am quite interested in this cab, but would never use more than one.
     
  12. ArwinH

    ArwinH run rabbit run

    Dec 1, 2005
    Southern California
    Hey Man, I'm doin' great. Doing a lot of sideman type gigs, still writing alot too.

    I just recently picked up a sadowsky too, and couldn't be happier. That whole issue of fat low end and the playability and whatnot...totally solved

    How are you doin?
     
  13. FireBug

    FireBug

    Sep 18, 2005
    Houston
    midget.jpg
     
  14. ibz

    ibz

    Apr 14, 2005
    Columbus, OH
    The 3db difference might be less or more prevolent a jump depending on where you're starting on the db chart as it is logrithimic.

    Also, I think people need to realize that cabinet sensitivity can be just as important a determining factor for rig volume than what impedance you're running/power you're using.
     
  15. MODNY

    MODNY Guest

    Nov 9, 2004
    SWR baby blue 2
     
  16. ArwinH

    ArwinH run rabbit run

    Dec 1, 2005
    Southern California
    Might sound a bit wimpy compared to the 750 watts run through four ten inch speakers :)
     
  17. MODNY

    MODNY Guest

    Nov 9, 2004
    u just gotta remember

    PORTABILITY
     
  18. Mike Dimin

    Mike Dimin Inactive

    Dec 11, 1999
    I’ve never actually used the Accuswitch. What I do know, however, is that Mark is one of the truly nice and honest guys in the biz. He knows his speaker design. I would never doubt his word.

    We do offer the NL-210 as a 4 Ohm option. But here is where we differ from other companies. We don’t do it electronically, we do it by using different drivers. As you know, all of our drivers are proprietary. The 4 ohm version of the 210 needed deifferent drivers designed for it. The 4 Ohm version sounds a little different than the 8 ohm version. Perhaps not enough for some to discern or care about, but certainly enough for us. Which sounds better? –well, that’s a matter of taste. Either of them sound better than anything else on the market (that is, too a matter of taste)

    You have assumed incorrectly. First let me say that the 8 Ohm version doesn’t not halve the power of the amp ([email protected] 8 ohms and [email protected]).

    We designed the 410 to be a killer, stand alone cab. With an SPL of [email protected]/1M - believe me it is. It is loud enough for most any gig. But we also designed the 410 with a lot of input from Hugh McDonald, Kasim Sultan and other rock guys playing very large stages who wanted to stack 2 (or more) of them.

    Just a note – when you mention “that 1000 watt cab” – I want to say that a cabs power rating is very misleading. That’s rated at 1000 watts of continuous sine wave. You rarely, if ever are pushing 1000 continuous watts. That is why you can easily play a 1000 watt head into a speaker rated at 500

    I wish I had the time to talk about cab impedance. Impedance changes with frequency. For an informative read, please see:
    http://www.eaamps.com/2005/technology/transmission_line.htm

    I hope that I have, in some small way explained both our thinking and the technical and design issues behind why we do what we do. As to your last point, EA does not design products for the sole purpose of selling more cabs. We design and sell cabs that sound the way we want them to; we design and sell products that we want to play; we design and sell products that players can trust.

    Me neither. But I definitely would (and have) used only one.

    Peace
    Mike Dimin
     
  19. ArwinH

    ArwinH run rabbit run

    Dec 1, 2005
    Southern California
    So I think I'm getting ready to lay down some greenbacks to pick up 2 nl210's and an iamp800.

    Any final causes for concern to know about?

    If not, how about a suggestion for the best prices ;)

    (now accepting pm's with pleasure.)
     
  20. alexclaber

    alexclaber Commercial User

    Jun 19, 2001
    Brighton, UK
    Director - Barefaced Ltd
    That's what I'd do - good choice!

    Mike, it sometimes seems that you'd be well served by a crash course in electronics and speaker design before you say anything! ;)

    Alex
     
  21. Primary

    Primary TB Assistant

    Here are some related products that TB members are talking about. Clicking on a product will take you to TB’s partner, Primary, where you can find links to TB discussions about these products.

     
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