1. Please take 30 seconds to register your free account to remove most ads, post topics, make friends, earn reward points at our store, and more!  
    TalkBass.com has been uniting the low end since 1998.  Join us! :)

Losing weight, not tone

Discussion in 'Amps and Cabs [BG]' started by jar546, Apr 5, 2009.

  1. jar546


    Dec 14, 2006
    Yeah, another rig downsizing thread.

    I have a blown disc in my back that has pinched so hard it broke a piece of the disc off, therefore I need to have lighter gear.

    I have an Eden D410xlt that I am in love with and a fantastic Mesa Boogie 400+ which means I am humping equipment heavier than the doctor wants me too and at a price up 2 flights of steps whenever I have to use them.

    I need something comparable without completely losing out.

    Looking for opinions to take into consideration. My Hartke Hydrive 210c does not cut the mustard, even at 250W.

    The SR5 is the axe of choice when I play out.

    I am leaning toward 2 separate 112's but need a brand that has the best bang for the buck.

    As far as a replacement head, who knows. Already had an LMII and it was too clean for me.

    Thanks in advance.
  2. Marley's Ghost

    Marley's Ghost Gold Supporting Member

    Feb 9, 2002
    Tampa, FL
    Schroeder has super loud and lightweight cabs. My 1215L is 40 lbs and 800 watts @4ohms. I have a Genz Benz 6.0 shuttle at 3.5 lbs that works really well with it. If you run the tube pre up you can get some grit and warmth. Maybe not full tubey goodness though. But you are never going to get that in a light weight package.
  3. seanm

    seanm I'd kill for a Nobel Peace Prize! Supporting Member

    Feb 19, 2004
    Ottawa, Canada
    The EA wizzy 12 is about 30 pounds, very light and easy to move. I carry them one handed all the time. Good vintage sound. Since you are probably looking at an SS amp to save weight, the wizzy gets back a bit of warmth.

    However, they are about $500 each new. They do come up for sale once in a while here.
  4. Stumbo

    Stumbo Wherever you go, there you are. Supporting Member Commercial User

    Feb 11, 2008
    the Cali Intergalctic Mind Space
    Song Surgeon slow downer software- full 4 hour demo
  5. jar546


    Dec 14, 2006
    Thanks for the links.

    Big price difference between the neo and regular 112's, not sure of the tone difference though. All I know it that my back is hurting and I will probably lose my shirt selling the 400+ and the D410xlt.

    I looked at some Bergantino cabs while at Rudy's in NYC but they were pricey.

    Was hopin I could get a new system by getting rid of the Mesa Boogie 400+, Eden D410xlt and my Hartkey 210C Hydrive combo without spending any money.
  6. warro


    Feb 13, 2009
    I feel your pain. Disc trouble is nothing to mess with. Backs are more precious than tone. I'm a studio cat, but if I were gigging I'd carry a Sansamp and a couple of cables and be done with it (assuming there'd be a PA). It works for Geddy Lee.

    Otherwise, I'd check out the "mini rigs of doom" threads.
  7. Sorry to hear about your back, hope it gets better soon.
    I'd stay with a 4x10, I think. If you like that sound you may not care for 12's. Or maybe you will, dunno.
    If I were you I'd look at the SWR Golight 4x10(56lbs) or the Epifani UL2 4x10(66lbs).
    For amps, if you didn't like the Markbass tone, you may like the GK MB2 or the Genz Benz Shuttle series, these are reported to have a more aggressive tone than the Mark.
  8. Dark Horse

    Dark Horse Supporting Member

    Jul 31, 2008
    Austin, TX
    The Markbass LMII head gets a nice tone and is lightweight. Set the controls flat and just adjust the two filters and you're in fat, old school-ish tone territory. You can get a more modern sound pretty easily as well. (EDIT: I just saw that you had a LMII and felt it was "too clean" - sorry)

    What about getting an Alembic tube preamp (or similar) and a lightweight digital power amp ?
  9. jellymax


    Nov 29, 2006
    SF CA
    yes those 410xlt's are boat anchors. too bad cause they sound good. i think i saw your
    for sale ad on craigslist.

    a couple of lightweight 210 cabs would be a big improvement. epifani maybe? a pair
    of 1x12 cabs would be good as well. carvin has a new 500w head for $400 that weighs
    9 lbs. you can pick up used 210 or 112 cabs cheap on craigslist if you are patient
  10. Jim C

    Jim C Is that what you meant to play or is this jazz? Supporting Member

    Nov 29, 2008
    Bethesda, MD
    Svt3Pro - Can get it to sound very similar to an SVT
    Many here like the VT pedal and a clean amp
    Sorry to hear about your back
  11. Mike151


    Dec 22, 2008
    Sherman Texas
    Hopefully some helpful info for you. :)
    I've had 3 back surgeries over the past 10 years due to a bulging disk. Not as bad as yours. I'm also work in the computer field so lifting printers, Monitors (CRT), or anything else heavy would always screw me up for a couple of weeks. I started swallowing my pride and asking others to move or even lift something from the floor to a table.
    My surgeries are years in the past and I still have issues which is primarily inflamation.
    That being said, don't feel bad about asking someone to help you out here and there. I have yet to find one person that doesn't hesitate to help out when asked. My wife even hauls in the heavy groceries.
    Here's a suggestion for long periods of standing. That kills me so what I do is borrowed from the elephant. (I'm not that fat LOL) They constantly redistribute their weight from left to right ever so slightly. Now it's a habit for me to keep moving when I'm playing with the weight around my neck. Just a slight shift from right foot to left foot and also just walking around casually. I think it makes for better stage presence also.
    I don't ever expect the back issues to go away but the pain is not as often as it used to be due to the type of things I listed and anti-inflamitory medicine.
    I'm my no means an expert on the subject so I can only give you my personal experience and what works for me. Hope some of this might be helpful to you.
  12. Sufenta

    Sufenta Trudging The Happy Road of Destiny

    Mar 14, 2002
    The Signpost Up Ahead.
    The LMII may be too clean for you, but it is still a great head for its price/tone/reliability/weight. All you'd need to dirty it up a bit is something like a VT pedal. That and the HT/EX stack makes for one heck of a (dare I say the 'ultimate'?) mini-mid rig.
  13. Smallmouth_Bass


    Dec 29, 2005
    I'd have to agree. I use a SansAmp in front of mine to get some tube-like tone and I am pleased with the setup.
  14. +1
  15. jar546


    Dec 14, 2006
    I know that 2 112's cannot replace the power of a 410 but I can assume there may be some positive tradeoffs.

    Anything bigger than that will be through the subs in a PA system anyway.

  16. fokof

    fokof One day ,I'll be in the future

    Mar 16, 2007
    A pair of in ear are pretty light :smug:

    Have you candodered the Carvin BX500?
    500watts , 6 pounds , goes down to 2 ohms......
  17. JimmyM


    Apr 11, 2005
    Apopka, FL
    Endorsing: Ampeg Amps, EMG Pickups
    Two 112's are better than a 410 IMHO. I've fallen out of love with the 410. Too small to rock SVT style, too big to deadlift. If you have to use small stuff, I'd make it as efficient as possible, and two 112's can be stacked and be more efficient in distributing highs/mids off axis than a 410. And I'd be looking very closely at the Genz Benz Neox 212 if I were you.

    As for the head, get any small head and a VT pedal and you may not quite get the Mesa tone, but you'd be a lot closer to a genuine tube tone than an amp on its own.
  18. KJung

    KJung Supporting Member

    I would also consider a Mesa Walkabout with a Bergantino AE410. The 410 is much smaller (16" depth) and MUCH lighter (62 pounds) than the 410XLT, but has a somewhat similar mid punchy, tight aggressive tone (again, it doesn't sound exactly the same by any means, but is in that tight, punchy, mid forward, slightly upper mid aggressive tone universe that the 410XLT is in IMO an IME).

    The Walkabout is VERY tubey for a hybrid, will keep you in the Mesa Family, and is really loud for a 300 watt solid state amp. The high SPL Bergantino AE410 is very nice with that head.

    You might want to PM TBer Chef, since he has both an AE410 and a Walkabout, and is also very familiar with the 400+ and the Eden tone in general.

    I've yet to find a 212 that has the ooomph of a good 410, but there are some nice 112's out there that sound great. For a more punchy tone like the 410XLT, my favorites are the Aguilar DB112's. They also kill with the Walkabout.

  19. two fingers

    two fingers Opinionated blowhard. But not mad about it. Gold Supporting Member

    Feb 7, 2005
    Eastern NC USA
    A couple of Avatar 112 Neo cabs should get you plenty of punch. 250W each and 40lbs. Then you could get a Sans Amp and a really light weight power amp. I feel sure you could put a SansAmp and a light (yet powerfull) power amp in a rack at under 25 lbs. Not only should you get some really nice tones from that kind of rig, but you should also be able to put it all together for less than what you sell your current setup for. Good luck!
  20. jar546


    Dec 14, 2006
    I am zeroing in on a setup that will be cost effective yet tone effective.

    Two Avatar 112 Neos
    Eden WTX 500

    That oughta do it.

    Now to find buyers for my Mesa Boogie 400+ and the Eden D410xlt.

    Would love the Berg cabs but can't justify twice the cost as Avatar.

Share This Page