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Lots of gear, many questions...

Discussion in 'Live Sound [BG]' started by xI Jonathan Ix, Jan 8, 2020.


  1. xI Jonathan Ix

    xI Jonathan Ix

    Jan 8, 2020
    Florida
    8E230367-F286-4EE2-93BA-032C39366887.jpeg Hi, I’m new here, first post. I have some decent knowledge, always seeking more though. First I’ll give you the facts, then ask the questions and if anyone is willing to chime in, great!

    Things I can’t currently change or can’t live without:

    Active (18v) 2006 Fender Precision Deluxe 4-string
    SWR Working Pro 700 head
    SWR Son of Bertha 1x15
    SWR Goliath Junior III 2x10
    Boss ODB-3 Bass Overdrive
    Boss OC-3 Super Octave
    EHX Bass Mono Synth

    Things that could be swapped around/removed/added if needed:

    Ampeg SCR-DI preamp/DI pedal
    Dbx 166xl Compressor/Limiter/Noise gate
    BBE Sonic Maximizer 882i

    Sennheiser wireless kit (can’t tell you model at the moment cause I’m not at home with it.)

    Main question: I like the sound of the Ampeg preamp as first in chain after the wireless but I would like the house to get the effected sounds (Boss OD, Octave, & Synth) which are on my pedalboard. My idea for chain is Bass > Wireless > Compressor > Ampeg > Synth > Octave > OD > Amp’s Effects Return. What problems are there with this? Where/when/would a buffer pedal be needed if I have 2 25 foot cords going to and from the pedalboard?

    This leaves the Ampeg’s DI cleanest for FOH and I could use the SWR’s unbalaced line out to a Radial JDI for effected signal to the house. Also would get rid of the BBE which I feel is preamp overkill with the active bass, compressor, and ampeg pre which all add to the overall output signal. (P.S. I only use the SWR footswitch for mute while tuning)

    I welcome your input and thanks for having me here at TalkBass.

    - Jonathan

     
    Stumbo likes this.
  2. Dump the BBE
     
    shoot-r, s0c9 and xI Jonathan Ix like this.
  3. promdates

    promdates

    Jun 2, 2019
    Slidell, LA
    You could run both signals to FOH, and have them blend them for you. I hadn't thought about putting the SCR-DI before everything else in my chain, because I mainly use it as the DI on my board if I'm not running an amp.

    Also, I believe the Boss ODB3 has a buffer in it.
     
    s0c9 and xI Jonathan Ix like this.
  4. xI Jonathan Ix

    xI Jonathan Ix

    Jan 8, 2020
    Florida
    I’ll whip out ye olde google to see if the Boss has a built-in buffer, thank you! I’ve always gotten bad results from using the SWR head’s XLR out so I was aiming at giving them better outs to deal with, ya know?
     
  5. s0c9

    s0c9 Supporting Member

    Jan 9, 2014
    Ft.Worth/Dallas
    1964 Audio artist, Fractal Audio Beta Tester
    I would always put the DI as the LAST item in the pedal series... then set up the effects loop for anything you might need at the back of the effects chain.
    On my pedalboard (when I use it), it's tuner -> compressor -> chorus -> SCRDI. I also have other DI's that I can swap out with the SCRDI.
    I do NOT use the effects loop, and I can split the XLR to FOH and Line Out to amp if I'm using an amp on stage.
    Remember that your amp WILL add color to the SCRDI output in some manner, so your stage "sound" may not = FOH!
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2020
    xI Jonathan Ix likes this.
  6. Zbysek

    Zbysek

    Mar 23, 2017
    Czech Republic
    Hi Jonathan,

    Welcome on Talkbass!

    I would put JDI after your pedals but before the amp...

    ...and I would put compressor after the Ampeg preamp...so that FOH gets at least one uncompressed signal...

    Why don't you plan using the amp's balanced output?
     
  7. two fingers

    two fingers Opinionated blowhard. But not mad about it. Gold Supporting Member

    Feb 7, 2005
    Eastern NC USA
    Welcome to TalkBass!!!!!!

    If it were me, I would ditch the rack compressor and BBE first. You've got plenty of tone shaping on hand. If you find you really need compression later, there are tons of good pedals out there you can put on your board.

    (As an aside, if you sell those two and your wireless unit, you will likely raise a good chunk of the money you would need for a Line6 wireless that would also fit on your board, thereby eliminating everything except your pedal board and amp, which will only be a stage monitor.)

    In another effort to clean up your setup, either figure out a way to put the Ampeg last, or simply put the Radial at the end of your pedal board signal chain. XLR out of that to the PA and a 1/4" cable from that to your stage rig. If you want the house to habe a clean signal too, send both the Ampeg XLR at the beginning and the Radial at the end to the house and let them blend to taste.

    These are just suggestions as to how I would clean up everything and have the most options too. Right now, you're talking about a pedal board, a rack, and still a DI behind your amp. Using my plan, you're down to a pedal board and amp. You walk in and plug in power to your board, power to your amp, and run two XLR cables.... DONE.

    Best of luck with it either way.
     
    s0c9 and xI Jonathan Ix like this.
  8. xI Jonathan Ix

    xI Jonathan Ix

    Jan 8, 2020
    Florida
    Many thanks for the warm welcomes! I appreciate everyone’s feedback and I’m gonna try to answer you guys in one long-winded reply rather than multiple...

    The SWR’s preamp has just become lackluster to me over time and has never translated the tones I have spent countless hours dialing in to the FOH very accurately no matter how I arranged the switches. I read that sending everything to effects return can bypass that and head straight to the power section? That sounds phenomenal to me because the Ampeg is a beautiful sounding preamp and the SWR has enough power to handle any venue I’ve come across. With the variety of soundmen I get, there’s no telling if they even own a compressor sometimes and I want to be as plug-and-play for them as I can. Hence, the Ampeg SCR-DI purchase and the (possible) JDI purchase. The only balanced line out on the Amp is the XLR and it’s always given me trouble with said soundmen.

    The ODB-3 DOES have a built-in buffer! Score!

    Anyway, I will try all the routing options you suggested and, @two fingers, it’s like you could read between the lines to my G.A.S. because I was already thinking about updating the wireless. A lot has changed since I got that Sennheiser. I see the MXR comp on a ton of boards too...must stop buying things!

    It seems like the SCR-DI’s volume knob is gonna be an issue because that controls house sound level as well as output to the amp/chain unless you use thru which is then, devoid of tone shaping.
    Decisions decisions.

    You guys helped me get the wheels turning some more, thanks again.
     
    two fingers likes this.
  9. promdates

    promdates

    Jun 2, 2019
    Slidell, LA
    You can just put tape over the knob so it doesn't move after you set it. I got tired of having my knobs get adjusted while in my bag, so I just gaff taped them all where they should be. Also have marks where it should point.
     
  10. xI Jonathan Ix

    xI Jonathan Ix

    Jan 8, 2020
    Florida
    i meant FOH would want me adjusting at the pedal and that would have me changing everything around RIGHT before a show.
     
  11. promdates

    promdates

    Jun 2, 2019
    Slidell, LA
    Unless it's super low volume, I can't see why they would want you to do adjustments before.
     
  12. xI Jonathan Ix

    xI Jonathan Ix

    Jan 8, 2020
    Florida
    Update: I tried a few configurations and then the solution was clear to me...
    I needed an Ampeg head.

    I purchased the SVT-7 Pro (with a decent warranty, given the reviews) it has a compressor built-in, tube preamp, and an FX loop so it solves the rack clean-up issue for sure. It’s coming through FedEx so by Friday I should have it in my possession. Will keep all previous gear at least temporarily in case I have issues with the storied problematic SVT-7.

    The GAS got me. To be fair though, I’ve always wanted an Ampeg head and I work hard for my money soooo no regrets there.
     
    Zbysek likes this.
  13. xI Jonathan Ix

    xI Jonathan Ix

    Jan 8, 2020
    Florida
    So the head arrived! It’s a Rev C00 on the top and Rev H01 on the board.

    Slimmed the rack down quite a bit, sounds phenomenal with ridiculous amounts of rumble. So with the Sennheiser wireless and a korg tuner the rack’s at 4U used in a 6U space. I have a Boss pedal tuner I can throw onto the board also for more rack room.

    Only remaining test is: FX in the loop or straight in? If straight in, then I’ll be after a pedalboard mounted wireless.

    B2D3FED7-9CD2-4FF5-9661-4530E711B575.jpeg
    5F2F6FBF-AB17-40C8-8214-DB91EB88E801.jpeg
    ^ Gratuitous Bass Pic
     
    Ethereal Thorn likes this.
  14. Whatever works.

    No reason your wireless has to live on the pedal board. It can live in the rack and send out to pedalboard just fine.
     
  15. Primary

    Primary TB Assistant

    Here are some related products that TB members are talking about. Clicking on a product will take you to TB’s partner, Primary, where you can find links to TB discussions about these products.

     
    Mar 2, 2021

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