Modern Meaning of the Iron Cross?

Discussion in 'Off Topic [BG]' started by tplyons, Dec 20, 2004.

  1. tplyons


    Apr 6, 2003
    Madison, NJ
    What's the modern meaning of the Iron Cross? It's obviously come far since it's roots in World War II Germany and the Luftwaffe, but what does it represent today?
  2. Folmeister

    Folmeister Knowledge is Good - Emile Faber Supporting Member

    May 7, 2003
    Tomball, Texas
    I am a little unclear as to what you are asking. I believe the Iron Cross decoration was a design based upon the old imperial German design (there is a name for that type of cross that I can't cough up right now). The, and I hope I get this right, Balkan cross, that displayed upon German aircraft and armour is a stylistic variation upon that theme. Modern companies, like Jesse James' custom cycle works, have adopted what seems to be a stylistic adaptation of the imperial design. I would doubt that it has any real meaning other than being a "bitchin' design." Or it may simply be seen as symbolically "outlaw." (kind of like KISS adopting the twin lightening bolts that the SS had on their uniforms for their logo)I had a girl in one of my classes that came to school one day in t-shirt with a Balkan Cruz on the front. After I told her where it came from, she never wore it again. Anyone else?
  3. tplyons


    Apr 6, 2003
    Madison, NJ
    I too think of it as just a cool design, and I dont see any harrassing meaning to it, but the second I brought home a Nikki Sixx Blackbird, my mom went ape because Iron Crosses are "bad" and I'm just wondering why.

    I think they look cool, but don't want to offend anyone. To me it seems to be a symbol of rock these days.
  4. Benjamin Strange

    Benjamin Strange Commercial User

    Dec 25, 2002
    New Orleans, LA
    Owner / Tech: Strange Guitarworks
    Rock is supposed to be offensive. Wear that bass with pride!
  5. The Iron Cross was first used during the Napoleonic wars of the early 1800's. It was a German award for bravery like the US bronze and silver stars.

    During WWI Wilhelm II, (Emperor of Germany) restored it's use. There is nothing evil about the medal itself other than the fact that it continued to be a symbol of German military bravery on through the second world war.

    Anyway, modern hate groups have adopted it and bastardized it's meaning much like they did with the confederate flag.
  6. The bastardizing of symbols relates to another now-famous one: the swastika. it is actually an ancient symbol for luck, adopted by the nazis because of its popularity. imagine that, we could be seeing swastikas everywere today, and we wouldn't even take a second glance. :meh:
  7. Against Will

    Against Will Supporting Member

    Dec 10, 2003
    Big Sound Central
    If I remember correctly, the nazi swastika is reversed from the original Buddhist symbol (the 'twig' things at the end are facing a different direction). In the Japanese manga Blade of the Immortal, the main character has a swastika (traditional) on the back of his robe, and there is a disclaimer at the beginning of the book telling people that, because the book takes place in the 17th century (or whatever it is, I forget), it isn't meant to be interpreted as relating to hate groups.

    The Iron Cross isn't bad in itself, it is connected with WWI Germany more than the Nazis.
  8. Kelly Lee

    Kelly Lee Yeah, I'm a guy! Supporting Member

    Feb 17, 2004
    Marana, AZ, USA
    The swastika was even used by certain Native American tribes as a symbol for peace. They used it, and so did many others, long before Nazi Germany did.
  9. They did NOT use the same swastika that the germans used.
  10. Kelly Lee

    Kelly Lee Yeah, I'm a guy! Supporting Member

    Feb 17, 2004
    Marana, AZ, USA
    I beg to differ: about midway down the page

    Thats just a small sample of reading and resources covering the swastika. Please read them.
  11. Bard2dbone


    Aug 4, 2002
    Arlington TX
    It's called a maltese cross, and the only association I know of for it is the slightly fatter version that is the firefighters professional symbol.

    I seem to also recall that it was associated with some particular saint. The way a diagonally widespread cross is somehow a 'St Andrews Cross', but I can't remember which saint that would be.

    edit: Okay. I found a reference. It is occasionally a "St John's Cross"
  12. kaboom133


    Oct 19, 2001
    Latrobe PA
    The reverse swastika is even a christian symbol. Some churches around here have them hanging from tapestries on the walls.
  13. Eyescream


    Feb 4, 2004
    Knoxville, TN
  14. Kelly Lee

    Kelly Lee Yeah, I'm a guy! Supporting Member

    Feb 17, 2004
    Marana, AZ, USA
  15. No, I'm not going to read, I skimmed a few of them, I'm pretty familiar with them and I don't need to be lectured on them.
  16. Kelly Lee

    Kelly Lee Yeah, I'm a guy! Supporting Member

    Feb 17, 2004
    Marana, AZ, USA
    I'm not lecturing I promise. Its just the way your coming off is "closeminded" and unwilling to accept the obvious. Sorry if I offended.
  17. No offense taken - perhaps I was taught wrong, I was always taught that the germans turned around the arms vs. the native american and eastern variants.
  18. Kelly Lee

    Kelly Lee Yeah, I'm a guy! Supporting Member

    Feb 17, 2004
    Marana, AZ, USA
    Cool. I worry sometimes about getting what I'm trying to say across without sounding like an @ss.
  19. DanGouge


    May 25, 2000
    The iron cross is still used by the modern German military. Given how sensitive the Germans are about any Nazi symbolism (swastikas are banned from display as I understand it), I think there's nothing wrong with it.